This file concentrates on the 6" Atlas 618 lathe, with nominal 18 inches between centres, that was also sold by Sears as various Craftsman 101 models. The earlier Sears model with bronze bearings was 101.07301 and the roller bearing model was 101.21400. The 618 design was later changed to the Atlas 6" Mark II, or "Square Head", and this version had the Sears Craftsman 101.21200 designation. The U.K. site http://www.lathes.co.uk/ also reports additional Atlas-made Sears numbers 101.2048, 101.2048F, and 101.M1518 (mica undercut version). [Incidentally, this site has excellent data and pictures on a great many brands and models of lathes and other metal machinery.] Various Atlas lathes (and their horizontal mill and shaper) were also sold in the U.K. under the Acorn brand. [While the term 6" lathe swing in the United States means the maximum diameter of work over the lathe bed, in the U.K. swing is defined as the radius, so these lathes sometimes may be referred to as 3" lathes. Just to add to the numerical confusion ;-] There is a very small amount of information here on the 6" Craftsman 109, which lathe is a completely different machine made by another company (AA Company, a.k.a. Double A Company) and shares no parts with the 618/101 except the change gears. Users of the 109 would be well served to join that lathe's specific Yahoo news/user group. (The numbers assigned to these lathes included: 109.0701, 109.0702, 109.0703, 109.2046, 109.2053, 109.2062, 109.2063, 109.2064, 109.2082, 109.2127, and 109.2128 at least.) The main issue that should concern a new owner is the actual general model type. Is it an Atlas-made 6" (original or Mark II), or its Atlas Sears/Acorn equivalent, or a totally different AA model? Is the spindle plain bearing (sandwiched by bolts on the split headstock) or roller bearing (no split in the headstock)? The only other unlikely worry would be if it were a metric version (fortunately these were relatively very rare). Then for the Atlas-made lathes, verify if the spindle thread is 1" x 8 tpi (threads per inch) or 1" x 10 tpi. Yes there are a large number of model sub-numbers that were assigned for whatever reason, but once you identify the general model type you should be able to find parts and accessories to fit. And if you ever get a part that does not fit, there are a lot of folks out there who do need it, so you shouldn't be out anything but time. [Just when we thought we had seen everything, we (extremely rarely) encounter the Atlas 612 aka Craftsman-Atlas 101.07300 plain bearing, 6 inch, with a .75" x 16 TPI spindle nose and 12 inches between centres.] SPECIAL NOTE for those reading this text file from the Files section of the Yahoo Group atlas618lathe. (There is also a PDF version there that is easier to read with a menu, but may not be as current; it takes more time to edit and that file is maintained by a very busy group moderator.) BE ADVISED THAT GEMS IS JUST ONE OF MANY FILES RELATED TO ATLAS MACHINES AND METALWORKING that I have put together. To see the rest just set your browser's address to http://www.janellestudio.com/metal/ The latter is a private site with no commercials and gathers no personal information. It is provided as a service to other home machinists. The files there are gathered from some conversations in several metalworking groups. It is not a FAQ. It is not an archive (as I gathered only conversations of interest to me from the groups I follow, and have heavily edited out redundant material.) To get the full picture about a particular problem or process, you should also read more than any one file as related conversations may be recorded in other files when a conversation changed subject in midstream. For example, a question to a group about where to find an Atlas part may have included responses that told how to fix the part or even make a totally new one from scratch. The reverse could have happened when someone asks a repair question and gets some advice to buy the part. So the files "Atlas Parts General" and "Atlas Repair or Fitting" must both be read. Sometimes a message was completely about parts or repairs done on a 618, but the techniques were applicable to many other models; such messages were usually put only in the other generic Atlas file. Similarly a question about chucks could be here, or if more generic placed in the Atlas Chucks General, or Chucks General files. Anyone wanting to see a wider range of advice on chucks should read Atlas Backing Plates, Sherline Chucks, and Taig Chucks. The same conversation was not copied to more than one file due to severe space constraints on my website. There are already about 11 MB in the text files when a chosen item is included just once. You can also search the Yahoo archives of the atlas_craftsman and atlas618lathe groups to get a complete insight into their questions and answers over the years. Also remember that few metalworking subjects are unique to the 618; read what other lathe users have to offer. A subject such as milling on the lathe may have some 618 twists, but good advice is available from users of larger Atlases, and other brands, and from milling machine users. Keep an open mind when looking for information. In my on-line files, the "at" symbol in e-mail addresses has been replaced with x~xx to confound spy/spam robots. Just reverse the procedure to get the correct address to correspond with anyone privately off-group. LOOKING FOR ATLAS PARTS? New Atlas lathe, mill, and shaper parts are still available from Clausing. (ATLAS BOUGHT CLAUSING, NOT the other way around, and then adopted the more upscale Clausing name.) You need to get to know that fine lady, Jolene Olds, or one of the good folks at Clausing Parts & Service Dept in Goshen, IN. (800) 535-6553 infox~xxclausingsc.com http://www.clausing-industrial.com/service-std.htm And their good copies of manuals and current price lists are must-haves. While some other dealers carry Atlas parts, they get theirs from Clausing and usually mark them up a lot. Note: There is a list on-line of Atlas Technical Bulletins for the 6, 9, 10, and 12 inch lathes along with the Atlas horizontal mill that can be seen and printed free at: http://www.atlas-press.com/servicebulletins.htm#General Bulletins If the machine was also sold by Sears under their Craftsman name, you have the added advantage of looking up parts on-line at the Sears site; and you can print out the parts lists. http://www3.sears.com/ A quote from Sears' site: >Most parts are sold as a quantity of one. In some instances a part description will include a quantity in parenthesis. The number inside of the parenthesis represents the total number of pieces to be ordered for that particular part. If verification is required for the number of parts to order, please call 1-800-252-1698 or email partsdirectx~xxcustomerservice.sears.com for further assistance.< Then there are other vendors that make new parts that may be modified or adapted to use on an Atlas. Or you can make parts like rests yourself. Used parts are often available from machinery dealers (see metalworking magazines' ads) or at on-line auctions. Particular caution must be used for internet transactions to be sure the part being sold is really the correct one for your machine. Often the vendor of a machine part knows little to nothing about what exactly he is selling. You will find more information about Atlas parts in my text files: Atlas Parts General Atlas Repair or Fitting found in the Metal Lathe Files at http://www.janellestudio.com/metal/ SAFETY WARNING BEWARE: DO NOT ASSUME that any subject matter or procedure or process is safe or correct or appropriate just because it was mentioned in a news/user group or was included in these files or on this site or on any other web site or was published in a magazine or book or video. Working with metals and machinery and chemicals and electrical equipment is inherently dangerous. Wear safety devices and clothing as appropriate. Remove watches, rings, and jewellery -- and secure or remove loose clothing -- before operating any machine. Read, understand and follow the latest operating procedures and safety instructions provided by the manufacturer of your machine or tool or product. If you do not have those most recent official instructions, acquire a copy through the manufacturer before operating or using their product. Where the company no longer exists, use the appropriate news or user group to locate an official copy. Be careful -- original instructions may not meet current safety standards. Updated safety information and operating instructions may also be available through a local club, a local professional in the trade, a local business, or an appropriate government agency. In every case, use your common sense before beginning or taking the next step; and do not proceed if you have any questions or doubts about any procedure, or the safety of any procedure. Follow all laws and codes, and employ certified or licenced professionals as required by those laws or codes. Hazardous tasks beyond your competence or expertise should also be contracted to professionals. Let's be really careful out there. (c) Copyright 2003 - 2008 Machining and Metalworking at Home The form of the collected work in this text file (including editing, additions, and notes) is copyrighted and this file is not to be reproduced by any means, including electronic, without written permission except for strictly personal use. ************************************************************************** NOTE TO FILE: COMPREHENSIVE THREADING GEAR SETUPS FOR THE 6" LATHE A conversation in October 2004 about threading led to Bruno kindly providing a much more comprehensive threading chart than found in prior references. Rather than have you scroll way down to Oct 2004, this chart and immediately related messages were moved here to the start of the "Atlas 618 Gems" file. ------- Date: Thu, 14 Oct 2004 03:11:19 -0000 From: "azbruno" Subject: Re: more 101 MK2 "gearsettes" questions [atlas_craftsman group] --- In atlas_craftsmanx~xxyahoogroups.com, "Reg Tulk" wrote: > OK, so while not made of unobtanium, they are rather expensive. I > suppose I could just buy them as they are needed. > Several of you mentioned about "I just use the change gears" - can > someone direct me to a better explanation of this? Are the > "gearsettes" just some sort of easier way to use gears without > having to do all the math? Can I just use change gears and if so > what are the models or part numbers or whatever for the gears? Reg, the information you need is just to your left. That is, follow the "Files" link for this group. There is a link to the thread gear chart for the 6" lathes right near the top. It's the same chart that's located inside the gear cover on the lathe (which I believe you don't yet own). Also, follow the Operation and Parts Manuals for a copy of the 618 manual as well as a doc on the gearsets. As for the threading gears... look at the chart to see what I'm referring to. There are three positions for the threading gears called A, B and C. You will have one or two gears on a bushing and spindle on either A or B, and the same on C. You'll also have a gear attached to the left end of the leadscrew. These gears, along with the fixed tumbler gears, will control the rate and direction at which the leadscrew turns relative to the spindle. The result will either be used for threading or longitudinal feed. The "gearsettes" are basically fixed units that replace the A, B and C position gears, but not the leadscrew gear. They provide less range on threading but a few more longitudinal feeds. I've taken the approach of acquiring a few more spindles and bushings for the A, B, C positions so I can have them preloaded as it were. I've also had to get some extra gears, particularly 64, 32, 20. Also, with extra gears, there are other possibilities in addition to what's on the chart. For example, the chart specifies a 32 TPI thread to use a 64 tooth gear on the leadscrew and a 64 tooth idler gear on the B position. I found it also can be done with a 32 on the leadscrew, 32 idler on C and 64 idler on A. This is important because I also do 36 TPI threads and then I can switch between the two with just a change of the leadscrew gear. Of course, this requires one more 32 tooth gear than the lathes originally came with, hence the exclusion from the chart. I've made an expanded thread chart for the 618 that ranges from 5 to 128 TPI and includes more choices for existing TPI settings as well. I have not yet tested all the additional combinations for fit, but I suspect most, if not all, will work. I'll post it if there's interest. Hope this helps. Bruno ------- 15 Oct 2004 NOTE TO FILE: As I certainly wanted a copy of the thread charts, I wrote to Bruno off-group and he quickly provided them, along with kind permission to include them in a file on my site. An extract of his e-mail follows along with the charts. >>> Hi Steve, here's the thread charts I worked up. A couple notes... -- Those items identified with FOOTNOTE * are not included in the Atlas charts and I have not verified them (except for the 32 TPI I mentioned in my posting). I suspect they'll fit just fine. -- As for FOOTNOTE **, I suggested using a 64 instead of 56 TPI. I have not verified the fit, but see no reason for any problem as it's just an idler gear and the 64 is close to 56. The reason for this suggestion is that I have an identical setup already for the B position (see above in the chart) so there's no reason not to use that one. -- Second page contains the charts for metric and longitudinal feed, but I have not tried to expand them out at all with other gears. -- The notes at the end are to help see just what gears and how many bushings are required to do all operations without having to ever replace gears on the bushings, which is where more than half the time to change the gears would be spent. You're welcome to use them as you wish. And if you have any comment or corrections, be sure to let me know. Also, I'd like to thank you for the wonderful service you've provided by culling out the messages and making them available as you have. They've been most valuable more than once. Best regards, Bruce (aka Bruno) <<< Very kindly provided by Bruno, in the atlas_craftsman Yahoo group. Thank you, Sir, for all your help. His charts are also available now in an MS Word formatted document (with helpful table outlines) in the files section of atlas618lathe; they may soon appear in the atlas_craftsman files when space becomes available. The charts were converted here into a text format for the sake of those without high-end wordprocessors, and also so that it could fit easily inside this simple text file. The columns here depend for vertical alignment on a monospaced font being used. BRUNO'S ATLAS 618 THREAD CHARTS (per updated version in March 2005) NOTE TO FILE: IMPORTANT! Bruno's threading charts were again updated in the files of atlas618lathe (Yahoo group) in July 2005 to include a great many theoretical setups for uncommon threads. Unfortunately it contained some errors. I was confused trying to figure out which versions were correct, being corrected, or still subject to error and revision. So I will leave the earlier, smaller chart at the start of this text file in its Mar 2005 state. If I find any errors in this earlier version, they will be corrected; but no new threadings as in the latest .doc or .pdf versions at the group will be added. IF YOU NEED MORE THREADING SETUPS, I strongly suggest: a. you consult atlas618lathe group's latest threading file(s); AND b. you verify any thread setup you read (here, or there, or in any book) on scrap material first. Remember President Reagan's brilliant philosophy: "Trust, but verify." ---IMPORTANT NOTE TO FILE ENDS. FOOTNOTES: * Not in original Atlas chart ** Substitute 64I TPI Leadscrew Position-C Position-B Position-A Spindle-Stud Back Front Back Front Back Front Back Front 32(B) 16(F) 3.57* 20 20 56 64I S 32(B) 3.85* 20 20 52 64I S 32(B) 4.17* 20 20 48 64I S 32(B) 5* 20 32 64 64I S 32(B) 8 32 32 64 64I S 32(B) 9 36 32 64 64I S 32(B) 10 40 32 64 64I S 32(B) 11 44 20 40 64I S 32(B) 11.5 46 20 40 64I S 32(B) 12 48 20 40 64I S 32(B) 13 52 20 40 64I S 32(B) 13.5* 54 20 40 64I S 32(B) 14 56 20 40 64I S 32(B) 16 64 20 40 64I S 32(B) 10* 20 64I S 32(B) 16* 32 64I S 32(B) 18 36 64I S 32(B) 20 40 64I S 32(B) 22 44 64I S 32(B) 24 48 64I S 32(B) 27 54 64I S 32(B) 28 56 64I S 32(B) 32 64 64I S 32(B) 20* 20 S 32I S 64I 16(F) 32* 32 S 32I S 64I 16(F) 36 36 S 32I S 64I 16(F) 40 40 S 32I S 64I 16(F) 44 44 S 32I S 64I 16(F) 48 48 S 32I S 64I 16(F) 54* 54 S 32I S 64I 16(F) 56 56 S 32I S 64I 16(F) 64 64 S 32I S 64I 16(F) 40* 20 56I** S 32 64 16(F) 64* 32 56I** S 32 64 16(F) 72 36 56I** S 32 64 16(F) 80 40 56I** S 32 64 16(F) 88* 44 56I** S 32 64 16(F) 96 48 56I** S 32 64 16(F) 108* 54 56I** S 32 64 16(F) 112* 56 56I** S 32 64 16(F) 128* 64 56I** S 32 64 16(F) NOTE TO FILE: Hank passed some corrections on 26 Feb 2005 to Bruno for the Metric section; their settings have also been entered here. WARNING: There is an indication that there are still mistakes in the Metric thread chart. I will fix the chart here as soon as Bruno and Hank fix their version. Warning 23 July 2005, pending fix. Metric Pitch Leadscrew Position-C Position-B Position-A Spindle-Stud in mm Back Front Back Front Back Front Back Front 32(B) 16(F) 0.50 56 36 64 44 52 32(B) 0.70 64 24 32 44 52 32(B) 0.75 64 32 40 44 52 32(B) 0.80 54 46 64 44 52 32(B) 0.90 46 36 52 44 52 32(B) 1.00 40 32 48 44 52 32(B) 1.25 44 48 52 40I S 32(B) 1.50 44 40 52 46I S 32(B) 2.50 44 24 52 64I S 32(B) 3.00 44 20 52 64I S 32(B) Feed Leadscrew Position-C Position-B Position-A Spindle-Stud Back Front Back Front Back Front Back Front 32(B) 16(F) .0024 64 64 20 24 48 16(F) .0039 64 64 32 24 48 16(F) .0048 64 20 64 48 24 32(B) .0078 64 32 64 48 24 32(B) English Threads: Spindles: 64/S, S/64, 32/64, 20/40, S/32, 56/S Leadscrew: 20, 32, 36, 40, 44, 46, 48, 52, 54, 56, 64 Metric Threads: Spindles: 44/52, 40/S, 46/S, 36/64, 24/32, 32/40, 46/64, 36/52, 32/48, 48/42, 40/52, 24/52, 20/52 Leadscrew: 32, 36, 44, 54, 56, 64 Feeds: Spindles: 24/48, 48/24, 20/64, 64/20, 64/32 Leadscrew: 64 ------- Date: Fri, 15 Oct 2004 14:43:45 -0000 From: "azbruno" Subject: Atlas 618 expanded thread chart posted. I've posted my expanded threading charts for the 618 on the atlas618lathe group Files section. I'd have posted it here, but there's no more room. Any comments or corrections would be appreciated. Regards, Bruno ------- Date: Sat, 16 Oct 2004 17:01:16 EDT From: anthrhodesx~xxaol.com Subject: Re: Expanded thread chart posted to files section. In a message dated Fri, 15 Oct 2004, Louis Balleweg writes: << That chart is really good. It is something I started to do but haven't finished. Now I won't have to. One suggestion that might improve it: I feel that the Atlas format is somewhat backward. For me, it would be more logical to start with the Spindle Stud on the left side of the chart and work toward the Leadscrew on the right. Especially since the positions of the gears are labeled alphabetically, starting from the left in the Atlas diagram. >> Actually there is a good reason for the original layout of the Atlas change gear charts. When setting up a gear train, since the position of the screw gear is fixed, the logical sequence of installation is: Screw gear First intermediate stud gear (closest to screw gear) Second intermediate stud gear (2nd away from screw gear) (Etc. for any other intermediate stud gears) Swing gear carrier up to engage appropriate tumbler reverse gear The sequence I cite above allows you to install a gear and set the clearance, then install the next gear and set the clearance, continuing until you set the clearance to the tumbler reverse gear. Any other sequence of installing the gears means you are constantly repositioning the gears on the gear carrier. To illustrate, let me work through the first example on the Atlas 6" Threading Chart, 8 TPI: Screw Gear 32F (F indicates "Front" or closer to the installer when standing at the left end of the headstock looking squarely at the gears). So install spacer at the "B" position ("Back" or closer to the headstock, away from the installer), then install 32, then washer and nut. Position "C" calls for 32B and 64 F. Install bushing on stud, install 32 on bushing, install 64 on bushing, then washer and nut. Install assembled stud on gear carrier and adjust clearance between 32 screw gear and 64 stud gear, then tighten nut. Position "A" calls for 64B and Spacer F. Install bushing on stud, install 64 on bushing, install spacer on bushing, then washer and nut. Install assembled stud on gear carrier and adjust clearance between "C" 64 and "A" 64, then tighten nut. Swing gear carrier up to engage "A" 64 with 32 tumbler gear and adjust clearance, then lock position of gear carrier. So the Atlas chart, when read from left to right, tells you exactly the sequence for setting the gears. (The sequence you suggest makes it easier to visualize the power transfer from spindle to leadscrew but it shouldn't be too difficult to learn to read the Atlas-style chart from right to left to get the visualization.) Hope this is constructive. Anthony Berkeley, Calif. ------- Date: Thu, 14 Oct 2004 09:37:41 -0700 From: Don Rogers Subject: Re:more 101 MK2 "gearsettes" questions [atlas618lathe group] At 09:41 AM 10/14/2004 +0000, you wrote: >I think the "gearsettes" you are referring to are really just a set >of gears that came with the lathe when it was new. No, they are sets of gears made to make changing easier. The full set is six clusters of gears. Each set covers a range of threads/feeds. However, you have to change the screw gear, so it doesn't eliminate getting greasy or having to have a selection of change gears. The gears are still available from Clausing A full set of six Gearsettes is going to cost $682.67 in the last price list. The change gears are also still available, and they are interchangeable between the Mk1 and Mk2. A full set has 14 gears 20, 24, 32 qty 2, 36, 40, 44, 46, 48, 52, 54, 56, and 64 qty 2. You also need a couple bushings and spacers to complete the train. From the sound of your note, you probably have six of the set already. Buying the missing gears to fill out your set would be the way to go. Don ------- Date: Thu, 14 Oct 2004 23:29:38 EDT From: anthrhodesx~xxaol.com Subject: Re: more 101 MK2 "gearsettes" questions In a message dated Wed, 13 Oct 2004, Reg Tulk writes: << Several of you mentioned about "I just use the change gears" - can someone direct me to a better explanation of this? >> Individual gear changed out by reinstalling them by hand based on a table is the traditional way of regearing the leadscrew to cut different pitches or feeds. << Are the "gearsettes" just some sort of easier way to use gears without having to do all the math? >> The "gearsets" are, essentially, the multipliers that go on the center change gear stud to give 2:1, 4:1, etc. times a smaller TPI count. Besides being premade as the multiplier, and slightly cleaner to work with, they also have the screw gear value printed on them for several pitches (the one that goes on the leadscrew which, also by the way, you need to reinstall by hand). << Can I just use change gears --- (?) >> That is the more reasonable approach. Anthony Berkeley, Calif. ************************************************************************** NOTE TO FILE: So ends the Oct 2004 section dealing with the 6" lathe's threading charts, and a few related threading messages from the same conversation. Note also that there are many other messages later in this Gems file that include threading ideas. Also see the "Threading" text file on the home page http://www.janellestudio.com/metal/ for lots of tips that can be used on the Atlas/Craftsman/Acorn family, or other threading lathes, or using taps and dies manually. And now we return to fairly chronological message order starting in 2000. ************************************************************************** Date: Sun, 17 Sep 2000 16:07:55 -0700 From: "Dale March" Subject: Re: AA109 Spindle Shaft Needed From: "Dr. Robert Harms" Hi Robert: If you check the message postings #2494 there is an Earl Bower who can make you a new spindle for $75. If you need more help let me know... DALE MARCH ------- Date: Tue, 19 Sep 2000 07:27:33 EDT From: Area51tatsx~xxaol.com Subject: trav-a-dial I've been gone a few day, so getting into this thread a bit late. A TravADial is like a dial indicator that reads the full travel of the carriage. It is not digital. It can be used on a lathe or a mill. Every lathe (4) in my Dad's shop has one and the Bridgeport without DRO has one on both table travel directions. Extremely useful. They can be set to zero at any location. IMHO, with the bracket and TravADial mounted, it may be too much (big & bulky) for our mini- mills/lathes, but useful for larger machines. For photos of one, off and mounted on an Atlas 10", go to: http://www.easystreet.com/~krugerr/Machining/Atlas10/TravADial/ Rick K Portland, OR ------- Date: Tue, 3 Oct 2000 12:06:19 -0600 From: "Maxwell Sandford" Subject: Re: My New Lathe Gentlemen, regarding the use of carbide tooling in small lathes, I'll offer my experiences. > I found the same thing on my 6" Atlas/Craftsman. The cutting angles > used forcarbide tools put a higher load on the lathe and it > chatters more. Rex Trammell I found the same experience, that HSS worked far better, when I began working with my 6" 101.21400. After looking into the variables mentioned below, I found that carbide works as well or better than does HSS, although the latter is still my preference for materials that are softer than steel or cast iron. For either carbide or HSS, there is no substitute for a properly sharpened and positioned rigid tool. However, I find that carbide is much less sensitive overal to the cutting speed, working well over quite a large speed range. Perhaps its best advantage is durability and the increased in the little lathe's HP and torque that is delivered at the higher cutting speed. Carbide works well on my 6" only if I pay particular attention to locating the cutting edge exactly on center, whereas it is my impression that HSS is a bit more forgiving of position. The tool holder, cross-slide, and compound must be absolutely rigid, of course. Turn the work at higher speed than one would use for HSS, perhaps 200 fpm for mild steel, and be prepared to deflect very hot turnings. I turn steel dry, with good results using carbide tooling. Replacing the lantern-style toolpost with a quick change holder increases the rigidity and gives easy adjustment of the tool height. Of course the carbide tool must be in excellent shape as well. It's quite easy to chip or break the brittle cutting edge, and once this has been done there is no stopping the chatter and poor performance. The cheap C2 brazed import tools are resharpened easily with a SiC (green) wheel, but you must always be careful not to take too large a cut that increases the tendency to break the tool edge. With these considerations, carbide tooling has been working well for me. Carbide used for threading requires the same attention as HSS. Slow speed, much lubrication, and decreasing cuts that must be quite shallow even to start. Feeding 5 -10 mil on the compound to start and only 1-2 mil as the thread deepens gives me nice threads with carbide tooling. Lately, I have followed a suggestion made awhile back in this forum to use bacon grease for threading steel. I mixed mine with a little high-sulpur thread cutting oil and apply liberally with a small brush while the threading proceeds. This makes one BLT go quite a long way. Old-timers advocate "goose grease" and I'll prepare some of this as well, but not until Thanksgiving. M. T. Sandford ------- Date: Tue, 10 Oct 2000 10:08:53 -0700 From: John Sandhagen Subject: RE: Tool Post Grinder for 6 inch Hi Guys, I made a grinder that fits on my toolpost for $30.00. This is probably not the same as a tool post grinder in terms of accuracy, but may work for your job requirements. I bought a right angle die grinder (harbor freight, about $20.00) and a repair clamp for steel pipe ($5.00). I removed the lever from the die grinder and made a cut out on the pipe clamp for the button that was left. I adapted the flange on the pipe clamp to fit my toolpost. I ended up needing a piece of 1/2" square stock between the flanges so the tool post would not bend the clamp out of shape when tightend. It seemed a little flimsy until attached to the tool post, but then very solid. Yes, it's loud, but mine weighs very little, is cheap, and not difficult to build. I had the idea before I had a use for it, so if anybody sees a problem let me know, my feeling won't be hurt. John Sandhagen ------- Date: Mon, 06 Nov 2000 06:33:16 -0000 From: "W.C. Gates" Subject: Re: stablizer fo back side of spindle [Long stock extending thru headstock -- preventing bending/destruction/severe injury!!!] We are discussing two different situations here. One situation is the need to "stabilize"---align and hold on the spindle axis--- a long but relatively stiff object, so that one end can be worked on in a headstock chuck, instead of out on the steady rest. The classic application is threading and chambering a rifle barrel. For this situation, some sort of "chuck" on the back end of the spindle is adequate. On many lathes (such as Atlas 6"), attaching such a device will require designing it to replace the spindle retaining/adjustment collar -- and you won't be able to close the gear cover while this gadget is attached. Hence my earlier suggestion for the two-diameter bushing. The other situation is when feeding long rods through the headstock in production operations. Here, the goal is to keep the rod from flopping around while allowing it to rotate freely. I suggest cobbling up some supports for a length of angleiron as long as the stock projects out, then strap a piece of PVC pipe into the angle as the guide and restraint for the rod. The PVC pipe should be 2-3 times the diameter of the stock. Be sure you lube the PVC (oil or coolant). ------- Date: Sat, 18 Nov 2000 13:54:06 -0000 From: "William Clemens" Subject: 6" QC Hello, those of you interested in the Quick change gearbox for the 6" machine - building this thing is a great undertaking if you plan to cut all the gears and make the box. I used a single point cutter to cut my gears and had the feeling that while cutting them, the world was passing me by, it took many many hours. You will need an index head to accurately set the divisions unless you can fab an indexing device for the lathe( not recommended). When I drilled and tapped the lathe bed to bolt the box on for some reason I broke the tap, had to have it EDM'ed out$$$$!(plus I had to completely disassemble the lathe). What I'm relating to you is that building this little gearbox is a trial of your talents, ingenuity, resources, marriage, patience etc, etc. plus it is a pain in the a$$. The gears can be purchased and modified from Boston or Berg or someone like that. Mine is not as elaborate as the one in Modeltec Mag but it has never failed me in about 20 years. I'll still send these drawings though! Bill C. ------- Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 16:54:05 -0500 From: "ebower" Subject: Re: Quick Change for the 618 lathe Original Message ----- From: "J. Reid" To: >Well, I received the Modeltec mag's with the articles on constructing the >thing, and wonder if others are or have done the same???? >The main problem seems to be in cutting the gears-or if this is necessary. >The author says that the gears in the train between the spindle and the >gear box can be original Atlas die cast gears. >The question then is what about the gears in the gear box? He doesn't make >such a definite statement regarding them, just goes ahead with advice on >cutting them with your a milling machine and dividing head-which I don't >have (yet, anyway). So does anyone know-can Atlas or other commercial >gears be used? Jack Reid Issaquah WA Jack, I looked into that gearbox, for my 6" Atlas, and the gears in the gearbox must be cut. I also have the plan that was sold in 1976, By Caldwell Industries, and it is almost identical. You do use the gears on the side train but you have to cut the box gears as the thicknesses used are not standard size. Did not make the quick change for my 6". Earl ------- Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 22:47:13 -0000 From: "William Clemens" Subject: Re: Quick Change for the 618 lathe Jack, YOU DO NOT HAVE TO CUT THE GEARS YOURSELF! The gears can be purchased from Boston Gear, Browning, WM Berg , etc, etc. They are 24 Diametral Pitch as are the rest of the gears on the 618. They will need to be modified (faced to .250 and a couple of other things) but a lathe can take care of that! The only problem that you may encounter is cutting the keyways and broaching the gears. Let me know when you get to that point, I'll gladly help you. Bill C. Tom, you can use any combination of gears to feed the gearbox as long as they are not tandemed. If they are tandemed or duplexed they must be identical or you will change the ratio, otherwise all the gears in the chain are idlers and do not change the ratio from the starting gear to the ending gear. The tumbler gears are idlers - their number of teeth makes no difference. Bill C. ------- [Note: following was started as a suggestion for cleaning a lathe (618), that the carriage had to come off once in a blue moon to get rid of metal chips and do a proper job (giving much smoother operation) and that the leadscrew had to be removed in order to do so. Removing the carriage also allows a check to see if there is an obvious problem causing excessive play in the carriage movement gears/parts.] Date: Sun, 07 Jan 2001 00:12:50 -0000 From: "Tim Clarke" Subject: Removing the leadscrew Charles: The leadscrew floats in the feed assy. All the endplay is controlled by the bearing at the tail stock end. Remove the support and draw the screw to your right, pulling it thru the carriage assy. There is a drive key built into the gear, and in the bevel gear in the apron. I don't know what is in the archives, but it seems there is a exploded view in the atlas website. Contact atlas for a parts list, pricing and I think you can still get a book of operation from them. My lathes have alot of play in the handwheel, mostly due to backlash in the gears that transfer the motion from wheel to carriage, I'd like to see a new one, I suspect they weren't real tight when new. Anyone on this site who bought one new may be able to tell us. Regards, Tim ------- Date: Sat, 06 Jan 2001 16:36:30 -0800 From: charles shearon Subject: Re: Removing the leadscrew Tim, just removed leadscrew, was easy. Bore for hand wheel shouldered bolt is worn as well as the bolt itself, assuming it started out as 1/2" shoulder. Found an oil impregnated sintered bearing the correct length and 5/8" O.D. and 1/2" I.D. What do you think about drilling an oil hole in bearing, boring the skirt, pressing in bearing and using new bolt? The gears in pot metal carrier do not appear to be badly worn. If I still have excess play, that assembly will get replaced. Appreciate the good feedback. Thanks. Charles ------- Date: Sun, 07 Jan 2001 01:17:12 -0600 From: Jon Elson Subject: Re: Re: slack in carriage handwheel drive train [NOTE TO FILE: info for a 618 or bigger.] cshearonx~xxtcsn.net wrote: > Is there any "trick" to removing leadscrew? Outboard end looks > straight forward, am wondering about "left hand" end. > Are there exploded pictures of the Atlas 10 in this sites archives? If the right end of your lathe is unobstructed, remove the two bolts from the right end bracket, and just pull straight out. Watch out for a shaft key, as some models have a separate key to drive the shaft. If you don't have several feet to extract the screw, you can remove the bracket, and pull the leadscrew just enough to disengage it from the QC or reversing box. Then remove the two big Phillips-head screws on the top of the saddle, and drop the entire apron. You can then move the entire assembly such that the screw can be slid out of the collar that picks up rotary motion for the power cross-feed and the half-nuts. Jon ------- Date: Sun, 07 Jan 2001 16:25:25 -0000 From: "Tim Clarke" Subject: Handwheel Bushing Charles, glad to hear that you got your leadscrew and apron off, no problem. If you want your handwheel hole repaired you might consider boring for a bushing as you explained. You need to be real sure that you can bore out the hole straight and the same center distance as it was before. Any change in location will alter the backlash and cause trouble, as will getting the hole crooked. It may be tough to center up in a egg shaped hole. I assume the hole is worn mostly at an angle, because of the downforce from the gears trying to move apart. I guess what I'm trying to say is, a 5/8 bit handheld in your makita drill isn't likely to make your problem any better unless you're very lucky. I'd probably set it up on my mill-drill and bore the hole with a boring head which will make the hole round and straight and finish to size with a reamer. Tim ------- Date: Thu, 07 Sep 2000 19:46:41 -0400 From: Ronald Thibault Subject: Re: Re: slack in carriage handwheel drive train >cshearonx~xxtcsn.net wrote: > > The handwheel "crank" travels almost an inch before carriage moves! >This is a common problem and I would like to second the >comments that Jon Elson made. >Make sure the die cast part that holds the gears in place is >tight to the front apron and it is not broken. 95% of the >problem should go away. Every owner of an Atlas lathe should >take time and remove and clean the apron of chips and dirt. >Besides having a clean machine he will know what is going on >down there when things are being operated. The Atlas lathe is >a simple machine and you should not be afraid to work on it. >Get out the manual and do it! Wally Skyrman Central Point, OR If the bracket is broken, it may be possible to repair it with epoxy and a thick strip of metal. I did this with my original lathe. Ron Thibault North Augusta, SC USA Builder Miinie #2 Captain R/C Combat Ship USS Arizona http://pages.prodigy.net/thibaultr/ ------- Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 00:55:07 EST From: catboat15x~xxaol.com Subject: Re: Re: New Big-Bore headstock, was Re: Lathe Bed > I have a 6" Craftsman > which has no separate power feed screw. Does any of the larger Atlas > machines have a separate power feed leadscrew? The normal 12 inch Atlas as sold by Sears under the Craftsman name does not have any separate power feed for the carrage. Some lathes have a feed that does not depend on the lead screw to drive the carrage, but some kind of rod arrangement which gives automatic fine feeds, but avoids the wear on the lead screw which is reserved for thread cutting. I have had two six inch Atlas lathes in my time and on both I added a very simple automatic cross feed which the original "six" lacked. I secured a flanged wheel to the left hand end of the lead screw (drilled and tapped the end) and replaced the handle on the cross slide with a similar wheel. Put a clothes line pulley on the edge of the bench and a good strong string from the lead screw wheel to the pulley thence to the wheel on the cross slide. As the lead screw revolved it wound the string up from the cross slide wheel and imparted a steady motion to the cross slide when facing. Simple, crude and workable. (Of course you have to remember to lock the carrage, or you get funny shapes as the string both turns the cross slide wheel and pulls the carrage along the bed.) John Meacham High Desert of California, Palmdale, Littlerock. ------- Date: Thu, 22 Mar 2001 19:06:34 -0000 From: ballendox~xxyahoo.com Subject: taps was Re: Taig thread sizes [HOW TO MAKE A TAPER ATTACHMENT SIMPLY] Joules, Ya don't need much more than a way to hold the bolt (er,pattern) in line with the crosslide (i.e., a support off the lathe bed) Now that you've got a pattern, you need a tracer. This is a piece of feeler gauge or shim stock fastened vertically (so it's a thin tracing point) to the side of the crosslide. Take out the crosslide screw, replace it with hand pressure, while turning the longitudinal feed... viola, a "tracer" attachment! Hope this helps. Ballendo ------- Date: Mon, 30 Apr 2001 16:33:14 -0600 From: "Maxwell Sandford" Subject: Re: Craftsman 6 in. Re-assembly Problems > Leo (has any one turned a 6" work piece? ON A 6 INCH LATHE!) Yes, I have turned a 6.2" diam. Oak block ~3" thick. I glued the block up from crossed-grain oak boards and cut the block to size approximately with a table saw, mounted it on the faceplace with wood screws, and filed off the high spots with a farrier's rough rasp. Just enough to permit the block to turn and clear the ways, around the maximum 6.25" the lathe can handle. I mounted the tool in a Harbor Freight tool quickchange holder--I pushed the tool longitudinally with manual feed on the carriage. The compound was rotated and racked all the way out. No problem at all, but indeed a tight fit. Then I faced off the block's front side. After turning, I bored the center sufficiently to accept a pressed-in cup bearing insert. I removed the block from the faceplate, grabbed it with the 3-jaw inside the bore I cut for the bearing insert, and then faced and bored the back side. I pressed in bearing cups on both sides and made a shaft and mounting plate to hold equipment. The turned block was then sawed and drilled to create ears for tripod legs. Voila, a 6" tripod head from a 6" lathe. ------- Date: Sun, 06 May 2001 07:35:53 -0500 From: Ronald Thibault Subject: Re: Metric threads setup for 10" Atlas lathe w/96 tooth change gears At 09:35 PM 5/2/01 +0200, you wrote: >Hi Jim >I am perplexed with the 96 teeth gear you are mentioning. In all the literature I have around I have not found any gear with so many teeth for the Atlas. By the way that would be nice to have giving just a demultiplication of 1:1.5 which would have a nice effect on the smallest feed of the leadscrew when finishing parts. If you try to overcome this demultiplication by i.e having a 32 teeth intermediate wheel instead of a 48 teeth one, you should be able to use the settings given in the table(S). It is just a ratio problem. Jean-Claude < The 96 tooth gears came with the early 30s (and older) lathes (Craftsman at least). The difference is due to the tumbler assembly having just a plain 32 tooth gear, not the 16/32 combination of the later lathes. To use the metric chart, find the setup for a thread twice the pitch, and use it. You can get a 16/32 gear and install it so you can use the charts as printed. The 96 tooth then gives you a superb fine feed capability. By the way I have a variant of the chart on your lathe that makes more use of the 64 tooth gears, to save wear on the no longer available 96 tooth ones. It's in the Atlas section of my Web site (address below). Ron Thibault North Augusta, SC USA http://pages.prodigy.net/thibaultr/ ------- Date: Sun, 13 May 2001 08:28:59 -0500 (CDT) From: dswrx~xxwebtv.net Subject: Re: New Member If the 10" is like the 6", the "plunger pin" in the large gear immediately behind the right bearing next to the chuck, is to change from direct drive to back-gear drive. If the pin is "in", the lathe is in direct drive from the belt pulley. If the pin is in the "out" position, there is no connection to between the two. With the pin in the "out" position, pull the lever on the right side of the the gears behind the spindle toward you. This will engage the gears on the spindle and the back-gears. rotate the belt pulleys or the chuck to mesh the gears. Atlas recommends that you engage the back-gears, while leaving the drive-pin engaged to remove the chuck. Putting the chuck key in the chuck and pulling it toward you works every time for me on the 6" model, but I have seen some negative comments on this web-site on this subject. Hope this helps. Leo BTW: On my 6", there is a "set" screw in the pulley cone on spindle. This is NOT to be tightened! Remove it in order to oil the pulley cone bearings when using the back-gears. Replace it so it is just flush with the surface of the pulley cone. There is a screw in the middle of the back-gear assembly that is removed to lubricate the back-gear bearings. ------- From: dba556... Date: Fri Jul 20, 2001 1:28 pm Subject: spindle bushing question on 6" I'd like to replace the spindle bushings on my atlas 6" lathe. The old bushings had oil holes that line up with the oil cup, but the bushings I ordered from Clausing have no holes. I assume these holes are needed to ensure proper lubrication. If so, how can I drill these without distorting the bushing ? Thanks, Dean Anderson ------- From: dswr... Date: Fri Jul 20, 2001 1:52 pm Subject: Re: [atlas_craftsman] spindle bushing question on 6" DO NOT DRILL ANY HOLES!!! (excuse my shouting, but i wanted to be heard over the electric drill) 8-) The bushings should be made of sintered bronze. This is a porous type of metal that will allow oil to migrate to the spindle journals, so they will be lubricated. A plus is that the lubricant will be filtered, trapping possible abrasive particles. These holes may have been drilled because the bushings were home made of brass or none porous bronze. Leo (lots of fun taking the spindle out) :-( ------- From: dswr... Date: Fri Jul 20, 2001 3:13 pm Subject: Re: [atlas_craftsman] Re: spindle bushing question on 6" Dean, call Clausing to be sure they are porous bronze. (would not want to be proved wrong with a bunged-up spindle on your lathe) 8-( I had a bit of trouble inserting the woodruff key when I replaced the belt on my machine. I suggest you check and make sure your belt is in tip-top shape before you replace the spindle and backgear! Leo (my belt was only 45 years old, they don't make things like they did in the good ol' days) 8-) ------- From: "Bob May" Date: Fri Jul 20, 2001 3:54 pm Subject: Re: [atlas_craftsman] spindle bushing question on 6" If you need to drill holes, put the bushing in first and then drill and clean the inside of the hole carefully. Don't forget that drilling a much smaller hole and enlarging it will minimize the distortion of the hole and you may want to ream to size to further minimize the distortion. If the new bushing is a sintered bronze one, I wouldn't drill through but rather make a reservoir for the oil with a bit of milling on the outside of the bearing about 1/3 of the way through the bearing and make sure that the hole fills the reservoir. A sintered bearing doesn't benefit from a full hole to the bearing surface. Bob May http://nav.to/bobmay ------- From: David Beierl Date: Fri Jul 27, 2001 11:37 pm Subject: 618 threading dial query How are the threading dial and gear attached to the shaft on the six-inch Atlas? I'm afraid to either twist them or try to drive them... thanks David Beierl - Providence, RI USA 6" Atlas lathe ca. 1941 ------- From: "Randy" Date: Fri Jul 27, 2001 11:38 pm Subject: Re: [atlas_craftsman] 618 threading dial query David: I looked in my parts break down and it looks like they are just pressed on. It just shows 3 different numbers for the gear, shaft, and dial but no key or anything else. Randy Pedersen ------- From: rweersing... Date: Tue Aug 7, 2001 3:25 am Subject: Re: 618 threading dial query David, they are just pressed on. put the threading dial loosely in a vice gear side up and I used a 5/32 punch to punch the shaft off of the gear. lots of luck bob ------- From: Rufus REDD Date: Tue Jul 31, 2001 3:13 pm Subject: half-nut I have an Atlas/Craftsman 6" engine lathe that is in need of a half-nut badly...Any and ALL help will be appreciated....Thanks ahead of tyme... Capt_REDD ------- From: Bill Aycock Date: Tue Jul 31, 2001 8:52 pm Subject: Re: [atlas_craftsman] half-nut I just ordered one, and the set cost just over $15 plus shipping. The Clausing number for the 618 parts (service dept) is 219-533-0371. Good luck Bill ------- From: R10440P... Date: Tue Jul 31, 2001 10:04 pm Subject: Re: [atlas_craftsman] half-nut Hello Capt_REDD. I also was in need of new half nuts and ordered them from Clausing. The only thing that you need to do is to be sure and order the new casting that holds the new halfnuts because the new ones are wider than the old ones and they will not fit into your old casting. Have fun Rick ------- From: Bill Aycock Date: Sat Aug 4, 2001 7:28 pm Subject: Half-nuts Half nuts have been the subject of a few posts, here, lately. I just bought a pair for my Atlas 618. What I found, when I started to replace them was interesting. I bought the new ones because there was more play in the feed than I wanted. When I took the machine screws out to take the old ones out, I found that much of the play was because the nuts could not close properly, because of chips and hard grease in the assembly. When I had all this cleaned up, the nuts looked pretty good, so, to check, I put it all back together. It turns out that the majority of the play is in the rectangular back to the half nuts, not in the part that clasps the shaft. I intend to take the assembly apart again, measure both the old and new nuts, and the plate they ride in. There has been wear somewhere, and I want to find where. The improvement from just a good cleaning was a lot, so I recommend it to all. Bill Aycock Persimmon Hill, Woodville, Alabama, US 35776 ------- Date: Fri, 19 Oct 2001 06:25:43 -0500 From: "Charles Brumbelow" Subject: Re: QC gearbox plans for 6" Atlas lathe Gabe - I suspect they can be found in back issues of "Home Shop Machinist" and/or "Projects in Metal" -- both Village Press bi-monthly publications. However, I haven't a clue as to which issues. I found them in books 1 and 3 of: METALWORKING BOOK 1 166406 $31.68 $36.00 MS METALWORKING VLGPR Yes METALWORKING BOOK 2 166407 $31.68 $36.00 MS METALWORKING VLGPR Yes METALWORKING BOOK 3 166408 $31.68 $36.00 MS METALWORKING VLGPR Yes listing from http://www.caboosehobbies.com/ which is having additional discounts in its fall sale thru 10/21 2003. They are also available from Village Press' web site. The one in book 3 is an admitted revision of the design in book 1. It includes chain drive from the spindle and homecut spur gears. The book 1 version is all spur gears purchased commercially. I am merely a satisfied customer of the vendors listed . . . Charles ------- Date: Sun, 14 Apr 2002 22:55:45 -0500 From: "Fred & Liz Lusen" Subject: Re: quick change gear box for &Atlas 6" Tommy, There have been three articles published on a quick change GB for the 6". The first was by Eugene Toscano in the August and October issues of Projects in Metal. That article was also reprinted in the hard copy Metal Working, Book 1. The second article was by Glenn A. Pettit in the December issue of Projects in Metal. These articles are both for the Atlas 10100 which is the last model of the 6" that atlas made http://www.lathes.co.uk/atlas/page13.html An 6 part article for the earlier atlas lathes by George Yadon appeared in Modeltec magazine starting with the July 91 issue and ran until Dec or that year. I believe you can still get back issues of that magazine. For a price of course. The author says that this box is applicable to Atlas and Craftsman lathes. The original was designed for and installed on an Atlas Model 618. Hope this helps. Fred Lusen ------- Date: Wed, 22 May 2002 21:37:00 -0500 From: Charles Brumbelow Subject: Re: Atlas 618 quick change gear box The author of this booklet (Yadon), which I understand was published in the early 1980's, had a similar (identical?) QC box in a six issue series in Modeltec. The series is still available from them for $21 plus $4 shipping as I recall. I bought the series recently, when I discovered it via a Google web search, after I was not the high bidder on another copy of this booklet sold by the same vendor (item 1718078633). I had thought the booklet might be unique, but it wasn't. Unlike the two QC boxes described in Village Press publications (which are in volumes 1 and 3 of "Metalworking"), this one is specifically for the old style body (the curvy one) although differences are pointed out. It looks doable, but calls for one to cut a bunch of steel gears as presented. FWIW, I've thrown in a bid on the booklet but don't expect to chase it. More curiosity than anything. Charles ------- Date: Sun, 21 Oct 2001 14:12:17 EDT From: catboat15x~xxaol.com Subject: Re: Re: Should I keep 618 or Atlas Mk2 dkosciusko2x~xxyahoo.com writes: > -- no power cross feed I can't find the photos now, but I added a makeshift power cross feed to my old six inch Atlas. I turned up a drum in place of the handle on the cross feed, put a hole in the drum to take the old handle. Turned a similar drum that I mounted on the right end of the feed screw by drilling and tapping the end of the feed screw. Ran a good stout cord from the drum on the lead screw to a pulley on my bench, from pulley to drum on cross feed. Not a really sanitary solution, but it sure worked to face the face plate, and other facing jobs. Never tried it when using a cut off tool, was afraid the stretch in the cord would give "jumpy" feed which can be a disaster when cutting off. John Meacham High Desert of California, Palmdale, Littlerock. ------- Date: Sun, 21 Oct 2001 20:50:46 EDT From: sleykinx~xxaol.com Subject: Re: Re: Should I keep 618 or Atlas Mk2 In a message dated 10/21/01, cbrumbelowx~xxhome.com writes: > Has anyone kept the 618 and the countershaft > and used a variable speed DC motor? Charles I had one on my 618 and loved it. The countershaft let me slow it down enough to thread without back gears which was a large part of the reason for doing it as mine had munged back gears. ------- Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2001 18:17:31 -0000 From: "Horace Steven" Subject: Re: Atlas 6" Attachments [T-SLOT CROSS SLIDE] > Is there a kit and/or how-to for making a T-slotted > cross slide for the Atlas 6" lathe? I know someone offers > a casting for the 12" lathe . . . Thanks, Charles Charles, I just sold one of the 10/12" kits for the crosslide, it would be an easy project to make one for your 6". Copy the design in steel or alum, scale it down and use 1/4" T-nuts. I have a copy of the drawing scanned into a file, email me if you want a copy. Here is the MLA site with the crosslide kit shown. ------- Date: Sat, 26 Jan 2002 22:40:10 -0600 From: "jerdal" Subject: Re: Re: Cross feed There is an article on adding cross feed to an Atlas 6" in the Oct-Nov 1999 (I think) issue of Machinists Workshop. You can check with the on-line Village press reference, if it is up by now. This is run from the lead screw, via a gear and chain setup, and ought to work OK, even if it looks a bit clumsy. Jerry ------- Date: Fri, 10 May 2002 00:17:56 -0000 From: "breaktimber" Subject: Re: Atals lathe model 618 Belts and pulleys 5/9/2002, breaktimber wrote: > >Hi Roy, > >Well I ambled out to my shop and put a caliper to the drive > >pullies on my 618 Atlas. The 2 step motor pully measures In atlas_craftsmanx~xxy..., David Beierl wrote: >Any chance you could amble out again and take some more measurements of the relationship between the lathe and countershaft assembly (height and distance), belt dimensions (cross-section), and how much minimum clearance you have (and in what belt position) between the belt/headstock cover and belt/countershaft casting? Also, does your belt drag and turn the spindle when it's disengaged in low-speed positions? Asking a lot, I know, but I would dearly love to use a link belt for the headstock, and I haven't found a way to do it without rubbing. David Beierl Providence, RI USA 6 (or 3)" Atlas Model 618 lathe ca. 1941 < OK David, I did a look see for you and came up with the following. First, I misquoted on the belt cross section the first time. It is 3/8" wide and roughly the same in depth. The counter shaft distance when tight is eleven inches center to center, counter shaft to center of head stock spindle. The height of the counter shaft spindle from center in the tightened position is seven and 3/4" to the bench top as is the center of the headstock spindle. With the belt on the big end of the head stock pully and small end of the four groove countershaft pully the clearance to the underside of the head stock cover and the belt is 5/8" and likewise at the countershaft casting. When the belt is on the small end of the headstock pully and the big end of the countershaft pully, the clearance between the headstock cover and belt is 1/4" and at the countershaft 1/2". Some lathe owners mount the motor between the lathe and countershaft motor in line with countershaft assembly. In my own case the motor is mounted to the left of the counter shaft between the lathe and motor. The motor is raised on a pad to allow it to be raised by 3/4" for better geometry. I use a barrel style reversing switch to control the motor that is mounted on a short vertical length of conduit in order to make it easy to reach. I have spent the last six weeks setting this lathe up and have had a merry time of it. The folks at Clausing have been a great help. Debbie has been my contact there. Lemme know how things work out for you. Hope this solves your problems. Cheers, Jay ------- Date: Sat, 11 May 2002 15:49:23 -0400 From: David Beierl Subject: Re: Atlas 618 Lathe Comments Wanted I grew up with this lathe, but IANAM (I Am Not A Machinist). At 02:36 PM 5/11/2002, WV_BILL wrote: >I'm looking for comments from people with experience or are familiar with >the Atlas Model 618 lathe. Just wondering about the quality of the lathe, Quality IMHO is excellent. Castings are nice, things work right. The carriage feed has an idler gear so that the handle turns in the right direction. It has tumbler reverse. It is a lightweight i.e. fairly flexible lathe, but a real one, much more substantial than the 6" AA/Dunlop/Sears 109 lathes. It's light enough for a man to carry without taking off the headstock. The compound slide IMHO is more flexible than it needs to be. Gears, handles etc. are made of a zinc alloy called Zamak -- some people claim this a disadvantage, others don't. I have seen some spirited defense of the strength and utility of zinc-alloy castings by some folks who work with them today. However broken Zamak pieces are difficult/impossible to repair. My lathe (my grandfather's) was made around 1940 and the gears are generally in fine shape. There are sixteen speeds including backgear -- the highest speed in each range of four overlaps the lowest in the next range. The lowest speed is 54 rpm, much lower than most (all?) modern small lathes and very nice for threading. The lantern-style toolpost is too flexible -- things are considerably improved by a block-type toolpost. The cross-slide advances 0.100 per revolution, the compound 0.050. Marks are in .001 of advance but the dials are quite small and cannot be re-zeroed during operations. The dials themselves form part of the thrust bearing for retracting the slides. Power feed is by change gears and the half-nuts -- you have to regear to go between threading and feeding. TClausing has some (very expensive) "Gearsettes" or something similar -- premounted change gears that are mounted more easily than individual gears and allow you to do a range of threads or feeds by changing only the screw gear. No additional function except for being already made up in chunks with a nice label showing the range of feeds or threads possible with the set. The standard harp has two slots. There is a (rare and not available) three-slot harp that allows some combinations not possible otherwise, but they're exotic ones. Such a harp could be fabricated if needed. It's quite likely that the backgear bearings and the headstock pulley bearings have not been lubricated as they should be -- it's somewhat inconvenient as you have to unscrew a tiny grub-screw in the headstock pulley and drip oil into the little hole -- daily. Also the headstock pulley bearings (bronze sleeves) apparently have a tendency to migrate toward the center over long periods of time. Many parts (except major castings) are still available from Clausing and from Sears. Neither is cheap. Sears may possibly have a few parts left that Clausing has run out of, but in general they seem to get the stuff from Clausing and tack on about 40% to Clausing's retail price. Spare change gears seem to be arbitrarily priced based on how many they have left -- or else they threw darts. Fixed and traveling steadyrests are available from Clausing. They use brass pins instead of the earlier flat bronze fingers. People claim this as a disadvantage but I think the current ones are perfectly good. The fixed steady does *not* fold open, old or new. The wood-turning rests from Clausing are a poor substitute for the original ones. They simply mount to the compound slide, and the slide mechanism makes it almost impossible to get a chisel where you want it. I welded a tolerable base from strap steel and square tubing that clamps to the bed like the original ones. It's still a very small lathe for wood turning but it turns up to 3000 rpm. The US specification for the Acme thread changed -- early fifties maybe? If you have an earlier lathe (don't know the cutoff date) and need a new cross-slide nut, you will have to also get the cross-slide screw because the old screw won't fit into the new nut. Also Atlas changed (beefed up) the design of the half-nut assembly slightly at some point. New half-nuts may require a new actuating assembly to fit. > quality of parts (turnings) made with it, I'll leave that for others more skillful than I to say. In general I'd say that it delivers the goods but requires sympathetic and skilled handling -- including setup -- for best results. It also depends heavily on having a good stiff bench -- Atlas recommends minimum 1 3/4" thick edge-glued hardwood for a wooden bench. I've never worked with a big stiff lathe. >and ease of >cutting threads - etc. Easy, except of course that you have to set up the change gears manually. The Atlas _Manual of Lathe Operations_ available from Clausing is far superior to the South Bend or Sheldon equivalents, and has a thorough and lathe-specific treatment of threading. The lathe was sold with a four-page "Instructions and parts list" -- and the sixty-page threading chapter from the _Manual_. The official Atlas threading method (for 60-degree threads) is to offset the compound slide by 29 degrees (29.5?) and do all advance with the compound, and the tables are based on that method. Lowest backgear speed is 54 rpm, very convenient. Early lathes had a 16-tooth gear on the threading dial, later ones a 32-tooth (leadscrew is 8 tpi). There are some uncommon thread combinations (certain double-thread pitches maybe? I forget) where the 16-tooth gear will be right only half the time i.e. every other revolution. Gear presently available from Clausing is 32-tooth. > Also what is the taper of the head and tail stocks? Morse #2 and #1. The spindle will pass slightly over half-inch stock. Spindle thread is 1x10 -- Some Craftsmans were built with 1x8 and possibly there are a few 618s out there with 1x8. David Beierl - Providence, RI USA ------- Date: Mon, 20 May 2002 15:15:00 -0000 From: "jvb442001" Subject: 6" accessory This weekend I made a useful accessory for my 6" Craftsman lathe. I took a 8" 3/4" bolt, cut the head off, mounted it in the 3 jaw and supported it with the tailstock. I turned a MT2 taper and shouldered the extension down to 3/8" and turned a 60 degree point. The point extends slightly beyond the face of my 4 jaw chuck. This allows me to mount irregular shapes between centers and use the 4 jaw as a dog. John ------- Date: Wed, 22 May 2002 20:29:13 -0500 From: Charles Brumbelow Subject: Re: 618 Chuck repair From: "David Beierl" >At 03:31 PM 5/22/2002, breaktimber wrote: >Atlas four inch three jaw chuck that fits a one inch eight spindle. >Just a side note -- I'm pretty sure that most of the actual 618s had 1x10 >spindles...might want to check. I think 1x8 was mostly on the Craftsman >lathes, to let them use Craftsman woodworking gear that was fitted for1x8. Well, well, well . . . I just got surprised. I thought the early Atlas 6x18 units were 1x8 spindles, but my 1941 catalog says 1x10. The timeline on the web site says the 6x12 and 6x18 were introduced in 1936, so it couldn't have been very long -- if at all -- that the Atlas had the 1x8 thread. My Craftsman 6x18 (yes, the Atlas-made lathe, not the AA) circa 1963 has the 1x10 spindle. So . . . the wood lathe hypothesis may be correct. I've seen 4-jaw Craftsman 1x8 chucks named as being for wood lathes on eBay recently. On the other hand, I've got a spindle, supposedly from an Atlas, with the 1x8 thread . . . Charles ------- Date: Sat, 25 May 2002 17:52:35 -0000 From: "breaktimber" Subject: Chuck key substitute My recently acquired six inch Atlas Lathe came minus the chuck key. Bummer! But, I found that the 1/4 inch square drive bit that fits my Milwaukee electric screwdriver is better that the origional T handle wrench for most applications. I no longer have to twirl and twiddle with the chuck as I do with my other lathe that uses a different size key. Chucking pressure can be set with the clutch or just felt as the last turn is done by hand. Really handy!! Cheers, Jay Greer ------- Date: Sat, 01 Jun 2002 17:22:30 -0000 From: "d_c71_2001" Subject: Re: Chip pan [POSTED IN ATLAS GROUP] In atlas_craftsmanx~xxy..., "breaktimber" wrote: > Do any of you have any suggestions on obtaining or making a > chip pan to fit under an Atlas 618? Regards, Jay Greer Jay: Many people have used drip pans available from Autoparts Stores. If your lathe is on a bench, that would likely work out fine. If it's just for chips and a little oil, that should be fine. My Atlas 618 came with its original legs/stand and was mounted to (original) 2-inch thick hardwood plank. About two months back, I fabricated a Chip/Coolant catch pan from 1/8- inch steel sheet using my MIG welder. I cut a base the same size as the 2-inch plank, then cut sides, back, front to act as splash guards. I angled front and back and made cut- outs to allow for lead-screw gear door cover swing-out/opening. Created a sump to allow lubricant/coolant to drain back into SS Tank on the shelf under the lathe from a section of steel channel and welded a pipe nipple to the underside to attatch a return line. Will post a photo in the "Photos" section. It actually turned out really well. The angled front deflector does not interfere with the operation of crank handles. Let me know if you need any other details/info if interested. Good luck with yours. Derek C. ------- Date: Sat, 01 Jun 2002 18:49:40 -0400 From: Ronald Thibault Subject: Re: Re: Chip pan >Derek, >This is what I have been thinking of as I may want to use a coolant pump >in the future. Yes, any more details you might be able to offer would be >appreciated. How did you seal around the mounting bolts? >I look forward to hearing more. Thanks, Jay Jay: Check out the Atlas section on my web site (address below), I made my chip pan from automotive drip pans also. Ron Thibault Warrenville, SC USA http://pages.prodigy.net/thibaultr/ ------- Date: Mon, 03 Jun 2002 19:12:09 -0000 From: "d_c71_2001" Subject: Re: Chip pan - Details Jay: Forgot to mention, I welded a 3/4-inch hose nipple to the bottom of the Channel/Sump. Cut the hole in it first, then welded the threaded end of the hose nipple leaving the barbed end exposed for the 3/4-inch clear vinyl tubing return line. Bought the Hose Nipple and Sealing washers at a local hardware store. Bought the 1/8-inch Flat Steel Strip from a local steel supply company. Just looked through their scrap ends section and found plenty of raw stock, cheap. Cut to length with a hack-saw in a vice. Cleaned up with a disk-grinder. Drilled the (4) mounting holes in the base plate (around 8"x30") Tacked, then welded the front/back splash pieces, then the tailstock end. Drilled hole in the 1x2x8 channel to act as drain. Cut small end pieces for the channel and welded them in place to seal them off. Welded the channel to the bottom end of the pan. It hangs below the rest of the pan off the headstock end, so the gear door can swing out unobstructed, yet the coolant is contained. Derek C. ------- Date: Tue, 04 Jun 2002 01:36:27 -0000 From: "d_c71_2001" Subject: Re: Chip pan - Details Jay: Did you check out the Photos I posted in the "Photo" section? I posted two. Both have "Chip Pan" in the description. I used Sealing-Washers (cupped SS washers with Rubber washer attached) and some silicone sealer for insurance under the lathe mounting bolts. The coolant return line is some 3/4-inch flexible Clear Vinyl tubing. I cut a hole in a piece of channel that I mounted at the headstock end of the pan. The channel (1"x 2"x 8") acts as a sump and allowed the end to be low enough for lead-screw gear door opening. The back splash is 4-inches high and angled out at around 60-degrees, but knotched at the headstock end for belt clearance/gear door opening. The front splash guard is 3-inches high and angled out at around 45- degrees easily clearing the carriage hangles, etc. E-Mail me if you need any more info. I basically fabricated it by hand with the plan in my head. Had to think through a solution to allow the gear door to open (without leaking coolant) and carriage handle clearance, but basically hand fitted it together. Painted it and it came out really nice. Looks good and very functional. Bought a commercial-type SS 1-gallon pneumatic coolant sprayer years back. It has a small door on top that the coolant return line passes through. Derek C. ------- Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 10:47:03 -0600 From: "Microsoft mail Server" Subject: Re: [ALTERNATIVE TAILSTOCK FOR 6"] The small MT#1 tailstock has always been a weak spot on all models of Atlas 6 inch lathes. There is more ready to go MT#2 tooling available than MT#1 tooling. You would be better off getting some continuous cast iron square bar stock (gray iron) and making a more substantial tailstock in one piece. This thing shown is really jury rigged. Contact www.aia-versabar.com and www.durabar.com They offer cutting services for large size stock (up to 14" x 21" square and rectangle bar). Cut off a piece and save foundry expense. They also sell plate stock. You can get 4.25"x 4.25" square stock cut by the inch or foot from www.metalmart.com. This is VersaBar stock. This would do for a tailstock upgrade for a 6" lathe. You can purchase dimensioned tailstock drawings from Clausing Service Center for $10. Well worth having! A proper MT#2 finish taper reamer and roughing reamer run about $37 each. Finish reamers are readily available from most catalog suppliers. Rougher reamers are special order from catalog suppliers like www.travers.com and others. Hope this helps. James Sprott ------- Date: Mon, 25 Nov 2002 00:38:48 -0000 From: "elperkins2003" Subject: Re: Craftsman 6" manual/printed materials Rodent; If the link you list accurately depicts the lathe you have, you do not have a lathe produced in 1980. The late Atlas 6" lathes had undergone a complete redesign and restyling. The countershaft and motor mount was made integral with the unit and not separate. What you do have though is a classic 6" Atlas backgeared screw cutting lathe, as they were made in the 50s & 60s. A great little machine. You couldn't find a better machine to learn on. Cruise around the files and photos in this news group and glean what information you can. Then get a copy of the Atlas Lathe Manual directly from Clausing, or on ebay. The Clausing website will also have exploded parts diagrams and some other information on these machines, in addition to replacement parts and some accessories. When you get the manual you will have an enormous amount of information and a great reference to have around. Have fun getting aquainted with your new toy, and take good care of it for the next guy! Perk in Cincinnati ------- Date: Wed, 27 Nov 2002 08:50:23 -0700 From: "Earl Helm" Subject: RE: Thanks for help on 101.07301 and new question John, 4MTool makes a very nice 4 way tool holder for 3/8 tools for the 6" atlas. They also make a nice boring holder. They are good and cheap I think about 36.00 each. Their email is 4mtoolx~xxdialmaine.com and the guys name it George. He is a great resource for 6" atlas's. Earl Helm ------- NOTE TO FILE: There are many more conversations in the file Toolholders For Lathe that will be of assistance. ------- Date: Thu, 28 Nov 2002 00:21:02 -0000 From: "mac0859" Subject: Re: QC tool post [ONE OF SEVERAL Q THIS SUBJECT] Hello , Thanks for the reply . Did you have to make your own T-Nut for that holder ? I had contacted them about this one tool post some time ago, ordered one and never got it. I had talked to the guy at the phone number and I got the feeling he was either to busy to come up with a set for an Atlas or maybe going out of buisness. He finally sent me to another site that may have some in stock -- they said they did but I would have to make the T-Nut for it and they had no holder for a cut off tool. It sure looks like what I would want but thought I would post here about it to see if anyone out there was using another that may be a little more availible and the same still -- just something about this deal feels funny -- hard to explain I guess. ------- Date: Wed, 27 Nov 2002 18:15:57 -0800 From: Rick Kruger Subject: Re: Re: QC tool post There is a small Phase II QC toolpost available. http://www.littlemachineshop.com/products/product_view.php?ProductID=1672 One drawback to it is it holds toolholders only on one side rather than 2 like the larger sizes. Some have also criticized it for excessive overhang. The TS engineering ones are available thru Little Machine Shop also: http://www.littlemachineshop.com/products/product_view.php?ProductID=1785 Do you have a mill? If so, you could make a set. There are a number of designs out there. Before going to Phase II AXA size for my South Bend and 7x12, I made a wedge style QCTP from 7075 T6 alum. Photos and drawings can be seen here: http://warhammer.mcc.virginia.edu/ty/7x10/vault/Members/RickKruger/QCTP/ Anodizing was done in my driveway. Rick K. Portland, OR ------- Date: Thu, 28 Nov 2002 16:32:42 -0500 From: David Beierl Subject: Re: Chinese quick change tool posts At 12:21 PM 11/28/2002, Rodent wrote: >Harbor Freight sells a quick change toolpost for their 4 x 10 mini lathe >similar to their V-style model -- its about $100 with the boring bar and >knurling tool. Not sure if you could adapt it to the 6" Atlas, and the >quality is so-so, but it lets you change tools without having to readjust >the height every time. www.harborfreight.com -- item # 42806-0VGA I have this and use it on the 618 very successfully. I drilled a second mounting hole halfway between center and point (the one facing you in the HF catalog picture). This gives some choice in how far the cross-slide must be retracted. I mount it on a 1/8" high spacer so it clears the hump on the 618 compound slide, and I put it on a faceplate and turned off some height from the bottom (not a lot). I milled a relief in the lower edge of the parting-tool holder to let it clear the corner of the compound slide (two cuts with a hacksaw would do it if necessary) -- now moot for me as I part from the back with the holder upside down. I forget what came with it in the way of mounting hardware, maybe none. The hole takes a 3/8" socket-head capscrew nicely. Note that it is not a "piston-type" as described on the website. The picture there clearly shows how it works -- the block has female dovetails and is slotted so the dovetails will pinch the male dovetails on the holders when you take up a capscrew on the side. The head of one of the screws is just visible in the picture. The 3/8" chuck (no name, reasonable quality, all machined) has a 3/8-24 mount and is mounted to a 1/2" round bar that fits the boring bar holder. The parting-tool holder takes a half-inch (?) wedge-section blade (one supplied, so-so quality). I milled a little groove so it would also take a T-secton blade which I normally use. david ------- Date: Mon, 02 Dec 2002 14:19:04 -0500 From: Mark Denovich Subject: 6" compound rest slop I have an Atlas MK II 6" lathe. I purchased a AXA sized quick change tool post from HF to go with it. I love the functionality of the quick change tool post. The problem is that it holds the tool quite a ways off center. This highlights the looseness in the compound slide... too deep of a cut and the rest is torqued down on the tool side causing the bit to dig in. I've tried adjusting the gibs to remove this play, and it's still there even with the gibs quite tight. The crossfeed has a some side to side play as well, but very little in comparison. Any suggestions, possible modifications? The TS Engineering QC kit is certianly attractive, and would reduce the ammount of overhang (and thereby minimize the play.) But I'd like to be able to use my current QC tool post, especially since I already own it! Oh, I happen to have a few pictures of a part of my shop on-line. I recently extended my workbench to make room for my newly acquired bench mill/drill (a King Midas) so I took a few picures of the process.: http://denovich.com/cgi-bin/liveframe.cgi/shop I used 2 layers of 3/4" Maple plywood for the top, 2x6s for legs, and 2x4s for the frame. The end result was a very stiff workbench. Mark ------- Date: Mon, 2 Dec 2002 15:07:57 -0500 From: "mertbaker" Subject: Re: 6" compound rest slop My Atlas 618, despite tuning up the cross & top slides, is kinda wiggly, even with my block & pillar type toolrest. Certainly a lot less so than with the original lantern & Armstrong holder, but still. Remember, though, it's a small hobby type lathe, made to sell for a small price, compared to a SB or Logan. Be reasonable in your expectations. Or even try my TP at 60.00. Mert ------- Date: Mon, 2 Dec 2002 15:54:57 -0500 (EST) From: Kirk M Scammon Subject: Re: 6" compound rest slop Mark, I have a similar problem when I am boring, and spoke to a friends father, who worked as a machinst in the steel industry. He said that most likely that the gibs are worn out even if they feel tight. He said that if you take them out and measure them they will have a taper from top to bottom and end to end. He was also surprised when I said that they were made out of steel on my lathe, he thought that they shoud be made from a bronze alloy. I haven't had a chance to check mine since I talked to hime, but plan to this coming weekend. Kirk ------- Date: Tue, 3 Dec 2002 10:32:01 -0600 From: "Microsoft mail Server" Subject: Re: 6" compound rest slop From: "Jon Elson" To: > Mild steel on cast iron works very well, and has been used for many > years. What he probably was thinking of was lathes with hardened steel > ways. A steel gib there would be a disaster. Some machines were built > with cast iron gibs, but they tended to break easily due to the shape. > There have been a number of schemes to deal with this, bronze, teflon > way liner material, etc. Jon I have a model 3950 Atlas 6 inch lathe with the same problem. The gibs seem to be made of plastic. They can be tightened down to where no movement is possible, but anything less loses rigidity if any adjustments need to be made when feeding into a cut. Industrial literature promotes bronze alloy gibs. I think that the compound design is a weak one. The original 1976 manual that came with the lathe warns about excessive overhang of the compound in feeding in or feeding out (for large diameter workpieces). The compound may break. It looks like a minimum design of cast iron. Not really made for big indexable tool posts. The best thing to do is go to www.metalmart.com catalog and buy a piece of cast iron bar or plate and make an adapter, so your tool post sits squarely on the compound "T" slot with minimum overhang in any direction. The compound design is just weak, and it needs any kind of help you can give it. Any kind of overhang of more than about 1/4 of an inch is inviting a broken compound! James ------- Date: Tue, 3 Dec 2002 12:51:38 EST From: JMartin957x~xxaol.com Subject: Re: 6" compound rest slop jts4545x~xxnetzero.net writes: << I think that the compound design is a weak one. You're right - the 6" compound slide is a weak one. I broke one myself, broke in the middle of the T slot. Not much cast iron there. Now, I keep the compound cranked all the way back unless I need the travel. Interrupted cuts, boring to a shoulder and heavy cutoff work can put too much stress on the compound. Asking a small lathe to handle work beyond its normal capacity is something we all have to do occasionally, and occasionally it bites us. The compound I broke was the old round top style, the new one is the square. Doesn't seem any heavier, though. John Martin ------- Date: Tue, 3 Dec 2002 19:50:38 EST From: cmiller231x~xxaol.com Subject: Re: 6" compound rest slop I can't speak for the 6" as i have a 10-f . It also is not very rigid on the compound as Jon has pointed out many times and i whole heartedly agree with. I just want to mention that i found the gib interfering with the dovetail on the cross slide . ( It was a sharp corner on the gib. ) I know this is a long shot but is easy to check This contributed to my chatter problem. My >02 cents chris ------- Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2002 17:46:49 EST From: JMartin957x~xxaol.com Subject: Re: Re: 6" spindle shaft In a message dated 12/4/02, lynn.chidesterx~xxxtp.varian.com writes: << In addition, 1" x 10 hardware (chucks) is much easier to find. My (limited) experience is that the 1"X8TPI (since it is a std. thread size and used on woodworking lathes currently in production) is the easier size to find accessories (used and new) in. What is the group's experience on this? Same as mine, always finding acces. for the spindle thread size you don't have? Lynn C. (in SLC, UT) >> 1 x 8 is a more common thread for woodworking lathes, and if woodworking is what you are most interested in would probably be fine. Most of the 3-jaw and 4-jaw chucks sold threaded 1 x 8 are made primarily for woodworking, and are not as heavy or accurate as the metalworking chucks. If you want to mount the special chucks used by bowl turners, you'll want the 1 x 8. For the better quality chucks typically used by metalworkers, however, you'll find many more in 1 x 10 than in 1 x 8. I have a wood lathe with a 1 x 8 spindle, and a metal lathe with a 1 x 10. I made up two adapters to allow me to use all of my chucks and faceplates on either machine. Actually, I find myself using them mostly to make up special cup chucks and similar on the metal lathe. John Martin ------- Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 10:45:30 -0800 From: "Bob May" Subject: Re: Back Gear engagement? There are two pins that need to be moved to change to/from the backgear. One is on the chuck face of the headstock at the height of the spindle in the front area of the headstock and it goes in/out about 1/4" or so and it is a knob that is just sticking there, not seemingly doing anything. This knob is going into a hole in the big (relative term here) drum that the other sliding pin is mounted on. When the pin is out, the drum will rotate while when you find its hole in the drum and insert the pin, the drum won't turn. The other pin is on the spindle face of that drum and when it slides back and forth across the chuck face after you loosen the finger nut. It moves radially in and out and when in, locks the gears and when out, allows the gears to move. There are, quite obviously, 4 positions these two pins can be in and they result in 4 different things, locked, low speed, high speed and free- turning of the spindle. Bob May http://nav.to/bobmay NEW! http://bobmay.astronomy.net ------- Date: Mon, 30 Dec 2002 12:57:05 -0600 (CST) From: dswrx~xxwebtv.net Subject: Comments on way wipers... I noticed Jon mentioning "way wipers" in his comments, which brings up a question... How many of the A/C line came equipped with these? I know my circa 1955 Craftsman 6" does not have any. Should they be installed, and does anybody have plans, or a description on how to do this? Leo (pearland, tx) ------- Date: Mon, 30 Dec 2002 14:00:51 -0500 From: "Bill Hardin" Subject: RE: Comments on way wipers... Leo: One of the pages in the AADOCS in the file section has a description on making way wipers for the smaller lathes. Fairly simple, the hardest part drilling and tapping holes in the cross carriage. None of the Craftsman 6" lathes originally came with wipers. Bill Hardin www.homeshopsupply.com Craftsman & Atlas Lathe Support ------- Date: Tue, 31 Dec 2002 01:01:17 -0600 From: Jon Elson Subject: Re: Comments on way wipers... My 10" didn't have them, but it had threaded holes where they used to be. I got the parts from Clausing service center, and am glad I did. A lot of chips would get jammed under there and grind away at the bed. If you have threaded holes sideways in the top of the carriage just above the bed ways, that is where the wipers would be attached. I don't know whether the 6" came with these or not. it would be fairly easy to make them, though. The way mine came, there was a piece of cut rubber material about 1/8" thick, then a piece of felt about the same size, and a stamped metal cover to hold it all in place. There is a small hole so you can keep the felt oiled. I always wondered about this design, it seems like it would keep oil OUT of the carriage, instead of keeping it in! But, I followed the directions and put it on that way, with the rubber against the carriage, and the felt on top of it. Jon ------- Date: Tue, 31 Dec 2002 10:00:06 -0600 From: "jerdal" Subject: Re: Comments on way wipers... > There is a small hole so you can keep > the felt oiled. I always wondered about this design, it seems like it > would keep oil OUT of the carriage, instead of keeping it in! Wipers are best combined with an internal oiling system. This can be added by drilling a suitable small hole thru the carriage top over the outer portion of each carriage way, with an enlarged portion to accept a small Gits flip-top oil cup (from MSC, etc). Now the oil thru the oiler will wash out the grit and grime from under the carriage. Works great. A bit of fluffed-out felt in the oiler cup will filter the oil so as to prevent chips getting in while oiling. Your carriage will be floating on oil in no time. This has worked best on ways including a flat and a prismatic way, as the oiler can be placed so as to allow excess to drip around for the lower portion where the gib rides. But it will help even on an Atlas, I would think, although I have not applied it to an Atlas. Jerrold ------- Date: Tue, 31 Dec 2002 15:22:19 -0600 From: "John Glowacki" Subject: Re: Comments on way wipers... I just bought new way wipers and felt way oilers from Clausing. I think they cost $1 a piece. Cheep maintenance item. John Glowacki ------- Date: Fri, 03 Jan 2003 18:03:34 -0000 From: "speedphoto300 " Subject: Re: 618 Atlas metal lathe [ALSO SEE FILE "thread dial and half nut.txt" FOR MORE ON REPAIRING OR REPLACING HALF NUTS] Dennis If you do buy the half nuts, check first to see if your old ones are .5 or .75 inches wide, the ones available from Clausing are the more recent wider ones. If yours are the narrow ones you either need to get the M6-13A guide or widen the slot in your old one. Joe ------- Date: Tue, 07 Jan 2003 17:08:39 -0600 From: Rodent Subject: Re: toolposts for 6 inch lathe > I am returning to the list after a lengthy silence, mostly because of > surgery and related problems, so forgive me if my question has been > covered recently. > I am considering getting a toolpost set, as the Aloris or Phase II > typeam concerned about sizes. The smallest listed is "up to 12"" > swing. the question-- is this size right for the Atlas-Craftsman > 618 lathe? An additional question. of course is-- What opinions > do the group have about them? www.mscdirect.com item # 75544825 -- apparently fits 5-8" swing item # 09047002 -- fits 0-8" swing Even though they are a bit cheesy, the $100 Harbor Freight set with the knurling tool and drill chuck should work. I have one on my 4 x 10 lathe using the $20 5-piece carbide insert tool holders and it does pretty well. ------- Date: Wed, 08 Jan 2003 09:46:07 -0500 From: SZuiderveenx~xxaol.com Subject: Re: toolposts for 6 inch lathe I believe this product is so new that a lot of folks do not know about it yet There is a new Phase II tool post that is smaller than the 100 or AXA type. I have had one in my hands and it look neat. The following link is the cheaper place to get it, although presently out of stock. http://www.littlemachineshop.com/products/product_view.php?ProductID=1672 It is also stocked by MSC (and presently in stock), but at a much higher price. http://www.mscdirect.com/PDF.process?pdf=1657&Keyword=Y Steve Zuiderveen -------- Date: Sun, 26 Jan 2003 13:27:06 EST From: LouD31M066x~xxaol.com Subject: Re: Atlas 6-18 lathe If a set of used will do you any good you can have for price of shipping. These are standard bearings available thru your local industrial bearing house for about $30 to $40 complete. Helps if you have the old bearings to pick part number off. old bearing Timken 07196 cup 07079 bearing 07196 cup 07100 bearing (larger bore) New Timken have same numbers. Does this help? Bearings I removed are in decent shape,got new because I am trying for A plus rebuild. Some if not all of your other needs are available thru oem Clausing Atlas most probably sole source of new parts. Bearings are available more reasonably locally. Look in yellow pages under bearings or an internet based supplier. If used will do or it on tight budget free for shipping. Louis ------- Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 14:01:47 -0500 From: "mertbaker" Subject: Re: Cross slide table for Atlas 618 I assume you would like a milling table sinmilar to, but larger, than the one that used to be sold for the Unimat. I can make anything within reason,and could do this for you. You would save a lot of money, tho' if you made it yourself. I would suggest making a pattern of threaded holes in it , rather than the commoner T-slots. Much easier to make & to use, and no non standard T-bolts or nuts.. Mert ------- Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 20:07:49 -0000 From: "elperkins2003 " Subject: Re: Cross slide table for Atlas 618 Mark; a few years back, Bower Machine was making a T Slotted cross slide for the 6" Atlas Craftsman lathe. At the time, I had purchased a T slotted cross slide casting for my South Bend 9" from Metal Lathe Accessories, and sent it to Bower to get it machined. Andy Loftquist at MLA had a deal going where if you bought the casting from him, he would send it directly to Bower to get the machining done and Bower would forward it to the customer when finished. When I got the finished cross slide, I got a catalogue of parts, accessories, and tooling for the Atlas 6" that Bower was making. In this cataloge, he listed a slotted cross slide. I don't remember the phone number for Bower, but I'll bet if you call Andy Loftqist at MLA, he would have it. MLA has a website now where you can probably find out how to contact Andy Loftquist. If I remember, Bower was somewhere in Pennsylvania. He made a very nice T slotted face plate for my 6" Atlas for a very reasonable price. I eventually also had him machine a MLA 9" T slotted faceplate, along with an MLA precision ground angle plate, both for my South Bend. Both Bower and MLA were very good people to do business with. Perk in Cincinnati ------- Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 15:10:31 -0500 From: "Bill Hardin" Subject: RE: Re: Cross slide table for Atlas 618 Earl Bower can be reached at: ebowerx~xxlcsys.net He is a nice guy to deal with and does wonderful machining to order. Bill Hardin www.homeshopsupply.com Craftsman & Atlas Lathe Support ------- Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 18:08:16 EST From: n8as1x~xxaol.com Subject: Re: Cross slide table for Atlas 618 easy to make ......bore out some 1 + in flat stock ,turn a flange ,& drill 2 holes ...use compound as a guide........ & drill 1/4x20 hole pattern for clamping stock on table .........no milling necessary & wwaaaaaaay cheaper than if someone like earl bowers made it for u (even tho the products are well done & priced fairly)......save ur money for an angle plate to make a vertical slide.(that mounts IN PLACE of compound).......the atlas 6in mill attach is outrageously high on e bay , but i can take a .030 deep full 3/8 cut on steel w/ mine..( & thats good!). best wishes docn8as ------- Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 23:17:32 -0600 From: "jerdal" Subject: Re: Cross slide table for Atlas 618 > easy to make ....bore out some 1 + in flat stock ,turn a flange ,& drill > 2 holes ...use compound as a guide......... & drill 1/4x20 hole pattern Got to agree, using a table is fine, up until you discover that you have no "Z" movement, it all happens with shims. Any milling attachment is better in that respect, but I will warn you there isn't a one of them that is remotely close to the worst milling machine in usability. The best is probably the MLA, which bolts right to their slotted crosslide. Won't work for you, both parts are way too big for the itty bitty crosslide way on the 6". You are better off with the milling attachment. BUT, at the prices I have seen for ebay ones, why diddle around? You can start to look at the small import dovetail column mills at about $500, and they will work 100 times better than the attachment. So for $275 for a poor substitute, or $500 for a workable machine, it looks like a no-brainer. Jerrold ------- Date: Thu, 27 Feb 2003 19:24:01 -0400 From: "James E. Baldock" Subject: Re: QC Tool Post, Where can I get one? Charlie Davis wrote: >I want to purchase a Quick Change tool post for my Atlas 6" lathe. >I have purchased 2 so far and neither one is the right one for my lathe. >Can someone tell me what brand and where to purchase one. I bought >one from Enco, and it is to big, the flyer said up to 12 inch, but it is >way too big, and the other from Little Machine Shop.Com, it is too small, >will fit Taig and Sherline, and says it will fit Atlas, but alas no. Please help. Thanks Charlie Ventura, Ca Charlie, I just bought this one. It looks like a winner. I have not had a chance to use it yet. Its aluminum but well done, and a bit pricey. http://www.home.earthlink.net/~rmteo/index.html Jim ------- Date: Sat, 01 Mar 2003 08:48:18 -0800 (PST) From: helpx~xx4mtool.com Subject: New 6" Atlas Parts - links corrected Humble apologies to those who couldn't get these picture links before. The correct ones are posted below- Regards, George O'Connor georgex~xx4mtool.com Here is a list of 6" Atlas items available directly from us. We are a machine shop and manufacturing facility, and manufacture items such as these, as well as other items we make (sheet metalbbrakes and accessories for cutoff bandsaws). Currently the price for the blocks (and picture links)are: 6" Atlas: Turning block with (2 or 4) 3/8" slots =$36.00 (#4M6T38) Turning block w/ 10mm slots (2 or 4) =$36.00 (#4M6T39) http://members.dialmaine.com/perocon/web/turna.JPG http://members.dialmaine.com/perocon/web/turnb.JPG http://members.dialmaine.com/perocon/web/turnc.JPG We have carbide tipped bits available, cutting towards the headstock ("AR" type) or threading ("E" type) available for $3.00 each, 3/8"square shank. We can and have supplied these blocks for 1/2" tooling, but our experience is that 3/8" works better. Boring Block for 1/2", 3/8" & 5/16" bars =$35.00 (#4M6B50) http://members.dialmaine.com/perocon/web/borea.JPG http://members.dialmaine.com/perocon/web/boreb.JPG Indexing 4 Way toolpost. 16 position indexing turret tool post for this small sized lathe.=$105 (#4M6I38) http://members.dialmaine.com/perocon/web/indexa.JPG http://members.dialmaine.com/perocon/web/indexb.JPG http://members.dialmaine.com/perocon/web/indexc.JPG Radiusing fixture uses 1/4" bits. =$130 (#4M6R25) The one in the picture is on one of our Atlases, Showing ball and cavity work, as well as side turning of a radius. It replaces your compound with a ground 4340 tool steel base, and is capable of turning male radii to 1", and even larger female diameters. The tool bits it uses are standard 1/4" bits turning. http://members.dialmaine.com/perocon/web/rada.JPG http://members.dialmaine.com/perocon/web/rad2.JPG http://members.dialmaine.com/perocon/web/rad3.JPG 1"-10 threaded Backplate blank- =$36 (#4M6BP210) This is face ground tool steel, which is 3" diameter, and threaded for the spindle nose. There is a chamfer on the headstock side for the indexing pin. Just what you need for that plain backed chuck or special driving need. It can be drilled tapped or milled to suit your needs. We do upon request offer 1"-8 (#4M6BP218) ones as well ($36)- Also 4" Diameter plates are available (#4M6BP310) at $40. http://members.dialmaine.com/perocon/web/bplate.JPG Shipping of the blocks via priority mail are $5.00 each, the Radiusing fixture or the backplate are $7.25 each. We will give you costs on UPS or other shipping methods, as well as combined shipping costs. We soon will offer other items, including gears in brass and plastic(24dp) to mesh with your existing Zamak ones, tee slotted cross slide tables (another item no-one makes yet- this one was from a customer's suggestion), and other items in the design stages only (email your suggestions!) We also make similar blocks for SouthBend model "A"'s, Logan 11" ones, Craftsman 12", as well as some other models. Our website (www.4mtool.com) is only "Under construction" right now, but feel free to email us for any info more info. We also offer these items for auction on eBay.com (our user name is "forem"), which often seems to show the pictures faster then the links below. Our # in the daytime (EST) is 1-800-603-0323- but as we do commercial work here as well, I am not always available to talk, although I will return calls and emails. Our Address is: 4M Tool 1044 Riverside Drive Vassalboro Me 04989-4119 Money orders, personal or business check are fine for purchases. I can also now take credit cards via paypal.com (see data below) Regards, George O'Connor Info for credit cards on paypal: Please use georgex~xx4mtool.com or foremx~xxdialmaine.com for email and leave optional boxes blank. Link: www.paypal.com or https://secure.paypal.com/refer/pal=4mtoolx~xxdialmaine.com ------- Date: Wed, 5 Mar 2003 14:29:28 -0800 From: "S or J" Subject: Re: ID Craftsman Metal Lathe Anthony wrote: >I think, but am not certain, that the 1"x8 TPI and 1"x10 TPI spindles are interchangeable. Even if they are, why would you want the 8 TPI spindle? I believe 1" x 10 TPI chucks and attachments are much more readily available. Anthony Berkeley, Calif. < Hi Anthony: a very good question that made me examine my experiences. When I acquired my Atlas 618 a few years ago with 1" x 10 tpi spindle (and only one chuck -- a 3-jaw), I learned this spindle thread was the most common for this Atlas model. While looking for a new 4-jaw, I confirmed your observation that there are more backing plates available prethreaded for 1" x 10 tpi , with or without a plain-back chuck included. Then I met an engineer with more than 60 years experience on metal lathes (he got his first at age 17). He pointed out that in his youth, the now-common 3 or 4-jaw engineering chucks were very costly, and quite rarely used by amateurs and in small metal shops. Round parts were commonly turned between centres driven by a dog on the ever-adaptable faceplate. Most amateurs learned their other metal turning using faceplates with the work clamped to it. When parts they used were irregularly shaped, such as small lumpy castings, they were best mounted on a faceplate anyway. The same faceplate clamping, with spindle locked, was used for milling with a separately driven arbor mounted on the cross-slide. To set up holding jigs for various parts, it became practical to have several specialized faceplates. Some had home-made jaw-clamps that emulated the 4-jaw chuck; work could be perfectly centred. To reduce costs, faceplates were quickly made up by an expedient on the smaller lathes (say equivalent to our 6" or smaller Atlases, Sherline, Taig, etc.). They simply acquired a good, common nut for their spindle thread. To this they welded a flat steel plate, and then faced it flat while on its spindle. It could then be customized to your heart's content and there was no big deal if new needs dictated drilling and/or tapping more holes until it looked like swiss cheese. Ruined it? No big deal; a new one was a few minutes and maybe one buck away. I know some will say this is not a high quality faceplate, but customized to an individual lathe, it is much more than "good enough" for small work. My friend had several small flat-back engineering chucks bought used, also mounted on backing plates made the same way as the faceplates. His hobby metal turning on his home metal lathes resulted in some little gems of internal combustion engines. As the retired chief engineer of a large aircraft manufacturer's plant here, I figured he knew his stuff. Fine idea, so I went looking for some 1" x 10 tpi nuts to make some inexpensive faceplates (compared to Clausing'$ new one). Well golly, couldn't find one in this town or in my catalogues. Funny thing though, retailers kept asking me whether I really meant 1" x 8 tpi nuts, as they thrust handfuls at me. So I still have no nut-based faceplate. Okay, so I'd start from scratch. Internal threading was not, and is not, my favourite thing. Many have suggested that threading on the lathe is no biggie if you get close and then clean up at the end with a tap. I guess they were talking about little threads because I soon found 1" x 10 tpi taps were neither common nor remotely close to free. They are listed as specialty items while the 1" x 8 tpi are standard items. So here is my new slant on the 1" x 10 versus 8 tpi choice. ****** 1" x 10 TPI. 1" x 10 tpi is fine for a slightly better selection in engineering chucks, where the backing plate is prethreaded. There are no current companies that I have found that make their standard woodturning chucks and accessories in 1" x 10 tpi. ****** 1" x 8 TPI. 8 tpi prethreaded nuts are easily available for quick light faceplates. The longer so-called coupling nuts have enough length so that their headstock end can be perfectly fitted to the register. Same for backing plates for small chucks of misc origin. Taps and dies are much more common in 8 tpi. All your 1" x 8 tpi chucks, faceplates, and collet sets are useable on your 1" x 8 tpi woodworking lathes which are fairly common. And in the woodworking catalogues there are literally dozens of woodworking chucks (fine metal-class engineering chucks too) and faceplates and collet chucks available in 1" x 8 tpi that can be used on your metal lathe. ****** So I still have my 618 in 1" x 10 tpi, but I now kinda envy the other guys. Steve in Thunder Bay ------- Date: Wed, 5 Mar 2003 14:46:44 EST From: LouD31M066x~xxaol.com Subject: Re: Re: ID Craftsman Metal Lathe Kinda like beta max vs vhs ------- Date: Wed, 5 Mar 2003 15:17:01 EST From: JMartin957x~xxaol.com Subject: Re: Re: ID Craftsman Metal Lathe On the subject of 1 x 8 vs 1 x 10 spindle threads, don't forget that the 1 x 10 are stronger. Wouldn't make too much difference on a solid spindle, but the roots of the 1 x 8 thread seem awful close to the #2 Morse bore. I've got the best of both worlds, however - two lathes, each with both 1 x 8 and 1 x 10 capabilities. How's that, you ask? Well, my Atlas 6" metal lathe came with a 1 x 10 spindle. My Delta wood lathe came with a 1 x 8 spindle. So on the Atlas I threaded a piece of 1-1/2" 12L14 round to 1 x 10 internal, mounted it on the spindle, and threaded the end to 1 x 8 external. Then I threaded another piece to 1 x 8 internal, mounted it on the adapter I had just made, and threaded the end to 1 x 10 external. The first adapter is not all that useful. I needed it of course to make the second, and also use it to make cup chucks and other special chucks for the wood lathe on the Atlas. The second adapter I often use to mount the 3 jaw or 4 jaw Atlas chucks on the wood lathe. Neither is as accurate as a threaded spindle, but are OK for my needs. John Martin ------- Date: Fri, 7 Mar 2003 08:27:11 -0500 From: Nick Hull Subject: Cheap 1-10 faceplates A previous poster made a good case for making cheap expendable faceplates by welding a nut on a disk and drilling it custom for each job. The problem is that 1-10 nuts are so hard to find. Let me throw out a suggestion and see if anyone bites; How about someone casting cheap Zamak (or aluminum) 1-10 faceplates? I envision a 2-piece open mold, the top (face) being open and a threaded insert providing the 1-10 cast in thread. The user would face the register and the face. Being just a rough casting hopefully woulf keep the proce low enough for it to be an expendable. Anyone volunteering to try this as a project to supply a AC need? ------- Date: Fri, 07 Mar 2003 19:28:50 -0000 From: "tomin130" Subject: Re: Cheap 1-10 faceplates Grizzly has threaded inserts available in 1"-8 and 10 tpi, as well as 1 1/2"-8 tpi. (plus a number of other sizes). These are in the wood lathe section of their catalog, p. 87 (2003). You could make a faceplate out of a piece of plate which can then be bolted to the insert. They're only $6.95 ea. I've been thinking of doing this myself. Tom ------- Date: Sat, 08 Mar 2003 17:37:07 -0000 From: "Torne Lignum" Subject: Re: Cheap 1-10 faceplates In atlas_craftsmanx~xxyahoogroups.com, "tomin130" wrote: > Grizzly has threaded inserts available in 1"-8 and 10 tpi, as well as > 1 1/2"-8 tpi. I have a number of these. They make a great base for utility woodturning faceplates. They are similar to an iron pipe union but are tapped at one end (at 3 equidistant points) for cap screws which are included. Also try MSC. . They have some really odd size threaded nuts, including some reverse threads. doc ------- Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2003 15:45:24 -0800 From: "S or J" Subject: Atlas 618 Lathes 4-Inch 3 & 4-Jaw Chucks There are more than a few 4" diameter chucks readily available new for use on the 1" spindle Atlas 618 lathes. In Canada for example, Busy Bee at www.busybeetools.com had suitable flat back scroll 3-jaw chucks with 2 sets of jaws as follows: 440504 3-jaw 3 inch diameter for $105. Cdn; and B019 3-jaw 4 inch diameter for $99. Cdn. Can also be reached in Canada at 1-800-461-2879. Usual caveat: I am just a happy customer. Both chucks will require a backing plate as from any number of suppliers, either prethreaded to an Atlas standard or a plain casting, or a welded up plate, or some even turned one from a weightlifting bar stop. Of course if you already have a worn out Atlas chuck, just use its backing plate with the new chuck. I see from the Atlas archives that Taig once offered their normal light- duty 3-jaw chuck with customizable aluminium jaw inserts prethreaded to fit an Atlas 1" x 10 tpi spindle. The larger US suppliers should have several 4-jaw independent chucks in 4" diameter sizes. They will range from okay Chinese manufacture to the better Bisons. Prethreaded or rough casting backing plates are widely available. Original Atlas-brand chucks come up at auctions but may prove to be in worse shape than the chuck you are replacing. Since even Atlas bought third-party chucks, there is no harm or shame in putting a brand new chuck on. I would suggest anyone looking for a new chuck visit http://www.janellestudio.com/metal/ and read the files Atlas 618 Gems, Atlas Backing Plates for Chucks, Atlas Chucks General, and Chucks General for much of what has been said in the past in the Atlas e-groups on the subject. There are more than enough tips there to get a new chuck found, bought and mounted. Other metalworking problems? 75 more other files that save a lot of time compared to wading through the e-groups' archives for Atlas, Taig, Sherline, & shapers. And no ads. Now wasn't part of the magic in this metal hobby the months or years we spend with our classic machines trying to tune, repair, and hunt down old parts? Then we make tools and accessories. In my next lifetime, I might actually get to make something unrelated to the hobby ;-) Steve in Thunder Bay, Ontario, Canada ------- Date: Fri, 21 Mar 2003 15:34:11 -0800 From: Marc & Marilynn Subject: 618 quick change tool post Just purchased a quick change tool post for my 618 and have a few minor fit problems. I'm not sure if the t-nut machining on the compound is the same for all series of this lathe and the maker (quick change) probably doubts what I am telling him. Anyone have insight to variations in this component from Atlas? The t-nut was too tall for the slot by .020 and the spacer between it and the tool holder was also too tall. I could not get a bit down to the chuck rotational centerline. Marc Nichols Age & Treachery Racing, Ltd. Grass Valley, CA ------- Date: Fri, 28 Mar 2003 01:52:59 -0600 From: "Randy Pedersen" Subject: Re: Anybody retrofit spindle bushings with bearings on 6 X 18 lathe? From: "snagglexr650" > I've got an Atlas/Craftsman 6 X 18 on the way. I know some came > with Timken spindle bearings. I'm pretty sure the one I bought > doens't have ball bearings. However, I read on lathes.co.uk that > some of the Craftsman branded lathes (mostly bushed headstocks) left > the factory with Timken ball bearing like the Atlas branded lathes > had. I've been wondering if it was possible to "retrofit" the bushed > headstock with the Timken or similar ball bearings. Has anybody > heard of such an 'upgrade'? > If anybody has a 6 X 18 with the Timken spindle bearings, could > you get the Timken part numbers for the bearings, and/or the OD, ID > and thickness dimensions? Any info would be great. Thanks alot. I don't believe there is enough material in the bushing style headstock to take the larger Timken bearings. If you look close the bushing type has the small caps that bolt down to hold the bushings and they are just large enough to hold the thin bushing. If the spindle has to much play you can sometimes find Timken headstocks on Ebay. Randy ------- Date: Fri, 28 Mar 2003 07:50:39 -0600 (CST) From: dswrx~xxwebtv.net Subject: Re: Anybody retrofit spindle bushings with bearings on 6 X 18 lathe? Randy, I think you are right about the lack of material in the head stock for ball or tapered roller bearings, at least stock (not custom made) items. I have a circa 1955 Craftsman (made by atlas) lathe. The bearings are held completely in the headstock casting, not by caps bolted on. The area in front (operator's side) of the spindle is slit. (Makes it look like a cap at first glance.) There is one screw (allen head) for each bearing that is in front (operator's side) of the spindle that is used to adjust the snugness of the bearings. The manual that was supplied with the lathe gives instructions on how to adjust the bearings. If anyone is interested, I can look up these instructions and post them here. Sintered bronze (oilite) bearing are very good bearings, as long as they are kept well lubricated. (my opinion) They may not take high speed operation as well as roller or ball type. Leo (pearland, tx) ------- Date: Sun, 30 Mar 2003 06:38:55 -0800 (PST) From: helpx~xx4mtool.com Subject: Re: What are collet options on Atlas 6x18 (101.21400) The easiest option is a #2 Morse Taper Collet. These were popular in the 50's thru 70's as Bridgeport Milling Machines which used the "M" head (before the current J or J-2 type head), had them. Bridgeport and many other makers (Scully-Jones, Collis, etc.) made them. They have the standard taper (#2MT on the outside, which is the headstock taper on your lathe, but also have internal threads (3/8"-16 NC) for a drawbar. If you can find them (perhaps eBay) they are simplicity itself. Simply make your own drawbar with a 3/8"-16 hex head bolt, a couple of jam nuts, and a fender washer (to help protect the threaded end of the back of your headstock spindle. Regards, George O'Connor georgex~xx4mtool.com ------- NOTE TO FILE: There are many collet options and sources discussed in the Cutters, Collets, and Arbors text-file. ------- Date: Mon, 31 Mar 2003 14:31:10 EST From: anthrhodesx~xxaol.com Subject: Re: What are collet options on Atlas 6x18 (101.21400) In a message dated Sun, 30 Mar 2003, David R. Kuechenmeister writes: << I think the 3-C collet series goes to 3/4 inch, but I don't know about the range of shapes. There have been several discussions about making a collet adapter for the lathe within the last couple months. >> The original question was posted by Bruno. The drawback to MT-2 collets is the limited number of sizes available (by 1/32" intervals I believe) and the tendency to lock into the spindle since Morse tapers are a self-holding taper. This can require "rapping" on the back of the drawbar to loosen the collet, and that can be injurious to the taper roller bearings. It would be less of an issue if you have an Oilite bushing headstock. All the Atlas-built 6" lathes have a spindle bore of just over 1/2" and an MT-2 internal taper. I believe this also applies to the AA-built 6" lathes but I can't guarantee that. MT-2 has a nose opening of .700". The only way you would mount a 3C collet to these lathes is with an adapter sticking well out from the spindle, more than 2-3/4". If you were going to do this you might as well go to 5C though that would require at least 3-1/2" beyond the spindle nose. The original collet setup for the Atlas 6" lathes was a proprietary offering from Atlas, Part #M6-750. Later it was offered as 6AT, also an Atlas proprietary design. As far as I know M6-750 and 6AT are identical but I can't verify that. I have a drawing for the Atlas #M6-751 Collet that is used with the M6-750 design but I don't have the adapter drawing (though that can be inferred from the collet drawing) and I don't have any specific information on the 6AT components. Per an old Atlas catalog I have, the 6AT collets to fit the M6-750 Collet Attachment were available in 1/32" increments from 1/32" thru 9/32". There are *no* alternative collet setups available as a direct replacement for the M6-750 design. Of the Cataract series (3C, 5C, etc.) the closest is 2C. The 2C adapter has a nose opening of .608" and a parallel bore of 31/64", collet drawbar thread is .442" x 30 TPI. You could probably squeeze this in but where would you find 2C collets. I'm certain that Hardinge would be happy to make them for you but the price would be outlandish. The other serious possibilities are to adapt to use 8 mm or 10 mm collets as used on watchmakers' lathes. These are somewhat more readily available than either the M6-751/6AT or 2C collets but still not cheap. Standard 8 or 10 mm collets are available at 0.1 mm intervals, approximately .004". Hope the above is informative. Anthony Berkeley, Calif. ------- Date: Mon, 31 Mar 2003 13:22:47 -0700 From: lynn.chidesterx~xxxtp.varian.com Subject: Re: What are collet options on Atlas 6x18 (101.21400) The best suggestion I have for 6X18 collets is to purchase most of the items needed for small metric double angle collets in the form of a MT-3 collet set (as used on the 7X10 type mini-lathes and mini-mills). While this doesn't match with the factory supplied accessories, and will require the user to machine part of the collet chuck in place (on their lathe), the collets are available new, and are inexpensive. Also, the full headstock bore can be used, as the collet chuck would mount on the spindle nose. Lastly, these collets have no threads, and so can be easily made (in pairs, nose to nose) on the lathe between centers. Check out Grizzly, Little Machine Shop, Harbor Freight, or Homier as possible sources. Lynn C (in SLC, UT) ------- Date: Wed, 02 Apr 2003 19:23:31 -0000 From: "Hank" Subject: Brand new group for Atlas (Craftsman) 618 lathe With the recent 618 activity here including Vince, the new 618 owner, I guess it's a good time to announce that there is a brand new yahoogroup now for Atlas and Craftsman 618 lathe owners. It's called , and here are the direct links to view and sign up for it: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/atlas618lathe/ http://groups.yahoo.com/group/atlas618lathe/join A search on "atlas lathe" from any yahoogroup page will get you to Atlas 618 too. All 618 people are invited to sign up so we can get some good posts going. We'd like to feature your 618 lathe installation photos, especially those that show variable speed drives or quick change tool posts. Hank ------- Date: Wed, 02 Apr 2003 19:53:18 -0000 From: "ihc1965" Subject: Re: WooHoo!! I finally got a lathe! --- In atlas_craftsmanx~xxyahoogroups.com, "Bob May" wrote: > With all that glee, don't forget that the 618 lathe has > a weak spindle so don't go overboard with the cutting of chips. Thanks for the advice Bob. That actually brings me to my first question. The 3-jaw chuck that came with this lathe does not appear to be an Atlas chuck. It has a back plate that is probably about 2" thick and the whole thing is very heavy. (I haven't weighed it, but I would guess that it's at least 5 pounds.) Do you think the spindle will be able to handle this much weight? Vince ------- Date: Wed, 2 Apr 2003 14:13:16 -0600 From: "Randy Pedersen" Subject: Re: Re: WooHoo!! I finally got a lathe! Vince: I don't believe the weight is going to be a problem but the amount of overhang from the register shoulder of the spindle should be kept to a minimum. I have own my 618 for nearly 20 years and I don't agree that the spindle is weak. I would see about narrowing up the back plate so you can move the chuck back closer to the register. Neither my 3 jaw or 4 jaw chucks are mounted on backing plates that thick. The AA lathes sold by Sears under the 109 model are the ones with the weak spindle they bend quite easy. Enjoy your new tool Randy Pedersen Salina, Ks Atlas 618 South Bend 1946 9" A, 1938 9" C Enco 1105 Mill Drill ------- Date: Wed, 2 Apr 2003 22:08:35 -0800 From: "Bob May" Subject: Re: Re: WooHoo!! I finally got a lathe! 2" thick for a backing plate is rather quite thick! Typical backplate thickness is more like about 1/4 to 3/8" thick for these lathes. I'll note that it isn't weight on the spindle that is the problem so much as sudden high forces on that spindle that bend them. Working cast iron castings is something that is best left to the larger stronger lathes as far as I am concerned. These are more of aluminum and brass lathes. Also, what do you consider a backplate? 3 jaw chucks tend to be less liable to have a backing plate for these lathes. If you can pull the back plate off of the chuck and have all the interior parts stay then it and it is indeed 2" thick then somebody really didn't want to do any excess work to get the chuck on the lathe. Bob May http://nav.to/bobmay NEW! http://bobmay.astronomy.net ------- Date: Thu, 03 Apr 2003 18:38:37 -0000 From: "ihc1965" Subject: Re: WooHoo!! I finally got a lathe! Bob, I took another look at my 3-jaw chuck. It's the kind where the jaws move by turning a ring on the edge of the chuck. Immediately behind this ring is what I am calling the "backplate." It's about two inches thick, but half of that is turned down to create a narrower shoulder near the spindle end. The whole thing is about four inches thick and weighs 9 lbs. The odd thing is that the chuck and backplate are both threaded all the way through, making me wonder if someone added the plate at a later date. I can't see any way to take the plate off -- no screws anywhere. There is a single small (3/16") hole on the back of the backplate that looks like it might have been used with a rod or wrench to remove the chuck from the spindle. If this plate isn't necessary, it sure would lighten the load on the spindle. Vince ------- Date: Sun, 6 Apr 2003 06:51:23 -0600 (CST) From: dswrx~xxwebtv.net Subject: Re: Re: milling adapter // was Howdy!! The Sears/Atlas milling adapter also required that you remove the compound slide in order to mount the adapter. The vise that was supplied with it left something to be desired. It required that you mount the workpiece between two loose jaws. and clamp with two bolts. (i found that it was best to remove the vise so it would lay flat on the workbench when you mounted the workpiece) You could remove the vise (mounted on a circle identical to the compound mount, and replace it with the compound slide. (I never found a use for this.) I did find a use for the vise, replacing the compound slide and installing the vise in its place. I mounted a slitting saw on the spindle and use the carriage and cross slide to make precision cuts. The milling adapter has very limited range in the x, y directions. To make larger milled parts, I adapted a drill press to perform the milling. Now, I have a Grizzly mini-mill, an excellent machine and a size companion for a six inch lathe. Leo (pearland, tx) BTW: I have a 6x18 Craftsman/Atlas lathe, purchased new in 1955. ------- Date: Wed, 9 Apr 2003 20:20:20 -0600 (CST) From: dswrx~xxwebtv.net Subject: Re: specs for tool post rocker Tool post rocker for the original lighthouse tool post holder on a Atlas/Craftsman 6" lathe. Length of rocker: 2.057" width : 0.378" This part represents a circular segment, As such, the height of the segment is; 0.263". The radius of the curve at the bottom is 4.3627". The top surface is flat, rough, similar to a knurl pattern. The corners of the ends are slightly rounded. The bottom surface edges are rounded with a 5/64" radius. Hope this helps, Leo (pearland, tx) ------- Date: Thu, 17 Apr 2003 14:46:43 -0400 From: "mertbaker" Subject: Re: Proper procedure for engaging half-nuts on 6" From: "azbruno" To: > I have recently started using an Atlas