This is just one of some 80 files about machining and metalworking and useful workshop subjects that can be read at: http://www.janellestudio.com/metal/index.html ------------------------------------------------------------------ Here are contributor suggestions for metalworking books and magazines and videos; also sites are listed that provide on-line tutorials or copies of old articles that are difficult to find otherwise. We are now in a video revolution on the internet, where companies and learning institutions are making many how-to videos freely available. Additionally, with the popularity of digital cameras, videos as well as digital still pictures are being shot at home by hobbyists and posted on the web to help others. Bravo. Also, suggestions for good books with ideas for metalworking do crop up randomly in messages for any subject. If you don't want to read all the dozens of files on this site, at least look through the "Projects" file. If you got to this file directly from my HOME PAGE, return there by using your browser's back button. BUT if you came to this file as the result of a web search engine, see many additional files on my home page Machining and Metalworking at Home http://www.janellestudio.com/metal/index.html SAFETY WARNING BEWARE: DO NOT ASSUME that any subject matter or procedure or process is safe or correct or appropriate just because it was mentioned in a news/user group or was included in these files or on this site or on any other web site or was published in a magazine or book or video. Working with metals and machinery and chemicals and electrical equipment is inherently dangerous. Wear safety devices and clothing as appropriate. Remove watches, rings, and jewellery -- and secure or remove loose clothing -- before operating any machine. Read, understand and follow the latest operating procedures and safety instructions provided by the manufacturer of your machine or tool or product. If you do not have those most recent official instructions, acquire a copy through the manufacturer before operating or using their product. Where the company no longer exists, use the appropriate news or user group to locate an official copy. Be careful -- original instructions may not meet current safety standards. Updated safety information and operating instructions may also be available through a local club, a local professional in the trade, a local business, or an appropriate government agency. In every case, use your common sense before beginning or taking the next step; and do not proceed if you have any questions or doubts about any procedure, or the safety of any procedure. Follow all laws and codes, and employ certified or licenced professionals as required by those laws or codes. Hazardous tasks beyond your competence or expertise should also be contracted to professionals. Let's be really careful out there. (c) Copyright 2003 - 2015 Machining and Metalworking at Home The form of the collected work in this text file (including editing, additions, and notes) is copyrighted and this file is not to be reproduced by any means, including electronic, without written permission except for strictly personal use. ======================================================================= Date: Thu, 8 Feb 2001 16:54:59 -0800 From: "Craig Libuse" Subject: Re: Re: woodworking articles To all you craftsmen--I was just speaking to Gretchen at Village Press (Home Shop Machininst, Machinist's Workshop and Live Steam magazines). She says they will be working on a special issue of Machinist's Workshop that will be in addition to the usual six issues. It will come out just before Christmas and will feature woodworking projects. If any of you do some interesting wood projects on your Sherline machines, you might consider getting some photos together and submitting an article for the magazine. They do PAY for this, in addition to the fun of being a "famous published author". For information on doing an article for them, call the magazine and ask for an author's packet. Their number is (800) 327-7377. Gretchen Christensen's extension is 3337. Craig Libuse Sherline Products ------- Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2001 22:19:02 -0800 From: "Nicholas Carter and Felice Luftschein" Subject: Re: I'm a new owner I agree with everyone so far, here's how I went about learning: I bought, and continue to buy, every book about machining that I come across in used book stores, flea markets and yard sales. I must have about 200 books by now. Some are slanted towards the industrial user, some towards the home shop machinist, and some are, well, odd. Machinery's Handbook is a must have. I read them all from cover to cover several times. I also have subscriptions to Home Shop Machinist, Machinist's Workshop, and Model Engineer's Workshop. These magazines are great as they cover things that while not immediately useful, always eventually answer some question. I am also amassing a collection of "Popular Mechanics Shop Notes" which were put out every year from 1905 onwards and contain many tips and plans. I am subscribed to rec.crafts.metalworking on the usenet, this group, the 7x10, atlas, CAD_CAM-EDM-DRO, modelenglist mailing lists (and now the one for 9x20 lathes, but no messages yet) I read these every day. You have access to the world with the internet, and you learn lots of things. Surf the web, and follow links - there must be several thousand different machining sites. I get together on Thursday nights for a "open shop" at a friend's shop, where a bunch of guys get together, solve machining problems, show off new tools, generally talk about all sorts of topics - several gun nuts, a locksmith, some old machinists, etc all are in the mix. Often there are local clubs (within 60 miles) of most urban areas now. I have read, from cover to cover, at least 6 to 20 of the big industrial supply catalogs - I can generally find almost anything in the MSC catalog in a minute. Knowing what tools exist really helps. I go to industrial auctions - you meet interesting people, see how shops are laid out, and get tools at good prices. I make lots of mistakes - often I'll pop into the shop to "try something", make a mess, and destroy a cutter, ruin a piece of scrap, but always learn in the end - always try new things. Taking on jobs that are over your head will always teach you something. So I guess what I'm trying to say is just immerse yourself in the subject. See our web pages http://www.casco.net/~felice ------- Date: Thu, 14 Mar 2002 15:40:08 -0500 From: wmbrady Subject: Re: The Jose tapes [see Nick Carter's site for link] >>> Here is a question. You are a newbie with a bit of machining experience. You got enough money to buy 1 Jose tape. Which one would you buy? I have been working with the taig for a little while so is it better to start with the basic machining tape or to move on to something a little bit more advanced? Just wondering. optimus. <<< My advice: Skip the Taig lathe basic and go for the advanced. Next get the gear making tape. Wm. "Bill" Brady, Harwood MD 38°51'30"N 76°41'00"W - Its in the darkest hour that the most stars come out. ------- Date: Thu, 14 Mar 2002 14:09:40 -0800 From: "David Goodfellow" Subject: Re: The Jose tapes He has a GREAT tape on making and using hobs. After watching his tape (a few times) even I was able to do it. Dave Goodfellow Northridge, CA ------- Date: Fri, 15 Mar 2002 18:34:08 -0800 From: James Eckman Subject: Re: Digest Number 675 > Time to hit Jose's site... Also Lindsay may still have "How to Make a Form Grinding Attachment for the Watchmakers Lathe" a very nice little pamphlet on making hobs and flycutters for machining clock gears. Also a much older text on the subject that you might be able to get used or from a library is "Practical Benchwork for Horologists" by Levin. It has a very nice section on toolmaking for clock repairers. Jim Eckman ------- Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2001 22:04:03 -0700 From: "David Goodfellow" Subject: Re: learning books and video From: Daniel Munoz To: >> I've read TableTop Machining, and as a *very* beginner I would like to buy some other book or maybe video materials that describe the use of Sherline Lathe and Mill with a learning approach. TableTop was very interesting to read and give a full perspective of the tools and what is possible with them, but I would like maybe some full project examples and a more explicit *how* to do, starting from the very beginning. I've noticed there's another book distributed by Sherline, "Home Machinist's Handbook" by D. Briney. And also 2 videos, "Steam Engine Video" from R. Kouhoupt, and "Shop Secrets - Measuring tools" by M. Rehmus. I would apreciate your opinion about which one could suit best my learning needs. If the answer is all of them :-) than, which one buy at first place? The videos are very expensive, I wonder if they are a must for learning, instead of buying 2 or 3 books for the same price. Please let me know. Also, do you have any other suggestions for others books or video ? Thank you for your advice, Daniel. << I have them all, and they all have something to offer. But if I were to buy just one, it would be the steam engine video by Rudy. This takes you through a steam engine project with a Sherline lathe and mill. By the time you've built the steam engine, you'll know from experience a lot of basic machining skills -- and you'll have a working steam engine. I liked that engine so much I made three of them -- one for me and two for gifts. Dave Goodfellow Northridge, CA ------- Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2001 23:07:45 -0700 From: Alan Marconett KM6VV Subject: Re: learning books and video I have Tabletop Machining, and I greatly enjoy it! Joe's book is good for giving you ideas, and familiarizing you with the hardware. I'm glad I got it. I also have Home Machinist's handbook, it IS a beginner's book. Stuff you should/could have learned in H.S. shop. But well done, and good coverage if you haven't had it yet. I'll keep it around for my sons. I have Rudy's Steam Engine video (4hrs), and although I thought it was expensive at first, I'm glad I received it for Christmas! He takes you through the steps of building a small engine, and I'm sure you'll pick up some tips. He also has two "Shop wisdom of Rudy Kouhoupt" books out, which I can HIGHLY recommend (I have both volumes, AUTOGRAPHED)! Good steps to follow, illustrations, good projects to build. As you classify yourself as a beginner, I'd suggest Home Machinist's Handbook as a first. Then, if you've a mind to build a very nice little steam engine, go for Rudy's steam engine tape! I haven't built his engine yet (so many engines, so little time...), mainly because I am determined to finish a design of my own, started nearly 30 years ago! It probably depends on how you like to learn. If you can readily learn from books, you might want to get one or both of Rudy's books. If you need to SEE how it's done, then the video will quickly teach you a variety of skills in measuring, layout, and running Sherline mill and lathe. I don't know about "... Measuring tools", maybe sometime later, after someone reviews it! You'll find some measuring in HMH, probably enough to get you started. Enjoy! Alan KM6VV ------- Date: Tue, 21 Aug 2001 22:30:57 -0500 From: "TnT Tech Mods" Subject: Re: Re: Atlas shaper... Rich, If you know which issues of PM the articles are in, you might find them in the Periodical Index at your local library. Mine will order reprints of any article contained therein for a nominal fee. Tom Stubblefield SW Missouri A/C 618 owner ------- NOTE TO FILE: INTER-LIBRARY LOAN. Most small libraries (and some big ones too) will have only limited, or no, collections of back issues of periodicals like Popular Mechanics or other hobby magazines. But they do have access to a wonderful process called inter-library loan. Every library can access libraries and museums elsewhere to obtain a short term loan of a book, or a photocopy of a particular article. Make sure you have specific details as to the book or article needed. If the article was spread across several editions, make sure to ask for all parts. If there is a cost, it will be minimal. (My city library does not charge for copies of articles obtained elsewhere, but that may not be typical.) ------- Date: Thu, 23 Aug 2001 08:43:34 -0500 From: "Koepke, Kevin" Subject: RE: Re: Atlas shaper... Here's a web site that can help find articles and such, for all types of old machinery, including Atlas. It's great! http://www.lathes.co.uk/page21.html -------- Date: Mon, 24 Sep 2001 13:40:42 -0700 From: "John Johnson" Subject: Re: Atlas/Craftsman Manual Being a professional in the printing and publishing industry, I have done some checking into copyright law from time to time and as to the Atlas Lathe Manual, here is what I can tell you. Let me first say that I am NOT a copyright attorney, however, I deal with these issues quite often. When the book was last copyrighted in 1957, an author or publisher could copyright the work for 28 years. At that time during the last year a renewal could be applied for and granted that would extend this another 28 years. Thus the renewal date would have had to have been in 1985. If the copyright had not been renewed at that time, then it would be in the public domain and free to anyone to copy at will. However, in 1976, congress changed the law and said that if a book's copyright was currently in effect, it would automatically be extended for a second period of 67 years instead of the second period of 28 years. That would mean that the renewal automatically happened in 1985, and was extend until the year 2052, a total of 95 years. Many other things changed in 1976 and then amended in 1992 which may also affect the copyright on this book. So, unless you have received permission to make copies of this book from Clausing, you could get in trouble if they chose to press charges against you for violating their copyrights. You can read all about this issue at: http://lcweb.loc.gov/copyright/circs/circ15a.pdf http://lcweb.loc.gov/copyright/faq.html#q46 http://lcweb.loc.gov/copyright/circs/circ06.pdf John D.L. Johnson www.LocoGear.com -------- Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2002 08:10:39 -0500 From: Larry Richter Subject: Re: Shaper? > > If anyone here can ever get a shaper, get one! Auto feed surfacing, > > internal keyway cutting, incredible surface finishes. Flycutting is > > now too coarse of a finish for my taste. Shapers and horizontal mills are the heart and soul of 19th century firearms manufacturing, and I think they are really the dates that brought 19th century manufacturing to the dance. I think both ideas of yours are real ideas, but that using the table drives to power a cutter is bad and the idea of controlling a small tool grinder with the cutting power coming from some other source than the table drives is good. I think your reduction of the shaper to its most basic idea is very good, because it looks like there is opportunity to do and power the basic functions in newer ways -- threaded bore motors, hydraulics, powered jackscrews. There are a couple of books from Lindsey's that are about building shapers. I have one, one of the older ones from the "make a shop from scrap" series. It's interesting from the viewpoint of showing one basic conventional design without any mystery or unexplained aspects, but it is also plain good sense minus frills in style. There has also been a series of articles on making a small shaper in one of the two home machining magazines from Traverse City, Michigan. Here is the list of shaper articles since 1982: Gear Driven Shapers Reviving a Lunch Break Shaper Large Radius Cylindrical Cuts on a Shaper Build Your Own Shaper - Part IV Build Your Own Shaper - Part III Build Your Own Shaper - Part II Build Your Own Shaper - Part I >From the Scrapbox: A Few Thoughts on Shapers More on a Gear-driven Shaper Conversion Conversion of a Gear-driven Shaper to Hydraulic Drive The Micro Machinist: Making a Clapper The Micro Machinist: Old Iron - Part III The Micro Machinist: Old Iron - Part II The Micro Machinist: Old Iron - Part I Here are the issues that have the series of articles on building one (looks like in Home Shop Machining): The URL of their site is: http://www.homeshopmachinist.net/index.cfm Collins, Marsh HSM 1998 Jul-Aug/ HSM 1998 Sep-Oct/ HSM 1999 Jan-Feb/ HSM 1999 Mar-Apr ------- Date: Sun, 7 Jul 2002 15:24:52 EDT From: ToolRoomTrusteex~xxaol.com Subject: OT? A book on screwdrivers Last month a book search turned up a book on screwdrivers. I checked my local library (Timberland Regional Library) and they had it. It is titled "ONE GOOD TURN" and is by Witold Rybczynski with an ISBN of 0-684-86729-X . This is a marvelous work. The author details his attempts to find the earliest mention of the screwdriver and screws in literature and graphically. He describes early methods of cutting screws, their use on armor and so forth. If your local library doesn't have it, try an InterLibrary Loan to get it. If you like reading about metalworking, ask your local public library to get books and magazines on it for you. As adults we don't usually use the public schools that eat so much of our real estate taxes but usually the public libraries get a share too. You can ask your library to buy books. I am proud that my requests caused my local library to get a book on Midget Submarines of WWII, the Sherline book on miniature machining, and the 08/15 trilogy video tapes. They haven't gotten every book that I asked for but some have shown up. If you don't like what the library is getting for new books, they likely won't act on complaints but you can ask for books you like and that may well reduce the amount they spend on books you don't like. Larry Murray ------- Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2002 19:59:08 -0000 From: "Art Volz" Subject: Popular Science & Popular Mechanics Citations-Part I Keith, et al: These citations are the first scrub of articles from PS and PM magazines as listed, by Volume #, in the "Readers Guide...". Search criteria keywords, on this first scrub, were limited to: "shaper", "milling", & "milling machines". On the next scrub will expand terms to include the more general ones of "metal cutting", "machine tools", "machine shop", and "cutting tools". I've included, in this first listing, the articles that popped up in re "lathe milling attachments" as this is often a first method for someone to get into milling. (Somewhere in my picture archives I have a lathe attachment for a lathe: bolts onto the bed, uses the carraige and crosslide for the table and is belted to a pulley attached to the lathe spindle--I'll have to relocate that one; the Australian Strahan (search: "Strahan") has a model that's actuated in this manner also.) This first list arbitrarily starts in July '32 (when people were starting to make a little bit of disposeable income again after the '28 disaster) until February '65 (when too many people no longer cared to get their hands greasy playing with dem dirty tools). A "?" at the beginning of the citation indicates that the citation may not be a metal cutting machine tool. (NOTE: To locate this list again, search "Popular Mechanics".) V9-Jul 32-Jun 35: --Saving time and expense in milling machine work. H.J. Chamberland. PS 121:86-7 Aug 32 --Milling cutters reground without annealing. F.B. Jacobs. PM 63:627- 8 Apr 35 V10-Jul 35-Jun 37: --? Try these on your shaper. PM 67:146-8 Jan 37 V11-Jul 37-Jun 39: --Drill-vise milling unit on small lathe. PM 71:621-2 Apr 39 --? Home-made shaper has ball-bearing spindle. A.C. Larson. PM 68-941- 3 Dec 37 V12-Jul 39-Jun 41 --Make your own milling cutters and accessories. H.J. Chamberland. PM 75:147-53 Jan 41 --Motor-driven milling attachment fits 9-inch lathe. PM 73:781-3 May 40 V13-Jul 41-Jun 43 --Boring and milling table adds to utility of your lathe. C.W. Woodson. PS 139:188-91 Nov 41 --Faceplate miller; machine large work on a small lathe. F.C. Sinex. PS 141:HW 412-13 Dec 42 --How to sharpen milling cutters. H.J. Chamberland. PM 79:146-53 Jan 43 --Mechanics of a milling machine. H.J. Chamberland. PM 78:146-53 Jul 42 --Milling keyways. PS 142:HW 152-5 May 43 --Using the modern milling machine. PS 142:HW 88-91 Apr 43 --How to use a bench shaper. H.J. Chamberland. PM 77:146-52 Jun 42 Continued at Part II: Art (Houston) +++ Subject: Popular Science & Popular Mechanics Citations: Part II Citations continue: V14-Jul 43-Apr 45: --Inexpensive milling attachment for your lathe. PM 80:137 Sep 43 --Milling a T-shaped bar. PS 144:170-3 May 44 --Milling attachment uses lathe compound. PM 83:127 Mar 45 --Cutting gears on the milling machine. PS 143:HW 548-51 Nov 43 --? Jigs adapt a shaper to special jobs. E.M. Love. PS 145:160-2 N 44 --Using the modern shaper: how a steel V-block is machined on this versatile power tool. PS 143:HW 355-8 Aug 43 V15-May 45-Apr 47: --Mill it in the lathe. S. Brown. PM 83:130-4 May 45 --Fundamentals of milling-machine operation. H.J. Chamberland. PM 86:224-8 Oct 46 Shopmade milling attachment fits any lathe. PM 86:201 Jul 46 V16-May 47-Apr 49: --Finishing and setting up a bench mill. W.E. Burton. PS 152:212-15 --How I built a milling machine. W.E. Burton. PS 151:209-12 Apr 48 --Milling practice. H.J. Chamberland. PM 90:218-22 Dec 48 --Collet holds lathe milling cutters. W.T. Warde. PS 153:185 Jul 48 V17-May 49-Mar51: --Quick milling setups for your lathe. J. Tracy. PS 157:196-9 Aug 50 --Lathe milling fixture has compound-angle setting. E.W. Holt. PM 92:22--4 Dec 49 Continued at Part III. Art (Houston) +++ Subject: Popular Science & Popular Mechanics Citations: Part III Citations continued: V18-Apr 51-Mar 53: --Milling in your drill press. W.E. Burton. PS 160:218-21 Jan 52 --Sawing on the milling machine. S. Brown. PM 96:218-22 Oct 51 --Milling attachment for your lathe. PM 96:211-13 Nov 51 --? Add a shaper to your lathe. R. Kielsmeter. PM 99:215 Jan 53 --? Hand grinder drives model shaper. E. Wright. PWS 159:210 Sep 51 V19-Apr 53-Feb 55: --Milling-machine setups with plain and side mills. S. Brown. PM 101:224-8 Jan 54 --? How of straight shaping. PM 101:212-16 May 54 --Know your metal shaper. S. Brown. PM 101:234-9 Feb 54 --Running curves on a shaper. S. Brown. PM 101:208-12 Apr 54 V20-Mar 54-Feb 59: --Milling attachment for your lathe. J.C. Magee. PM 106:223-6 Nov 56 --Metal shaper for your shop. S.S. Miner. PM 104:227-31 Oct 55 V21-Mar 57-Feb 59: --Milling with angular cutters. S. Brown. PM 107:210-12 May 57 --Hand milling attachment. W.E. Burton. PM 108:210-11 Nov 57 --Contour work with a metal shaper. S. Brown. PM 110:218-21 Oct 58 V22-Mar 59-Feb 61: --None found using current search criteria keywords. V23-Mar 61-Feb 63: --None found using current search criteria keywords. V24 March 63-Feb 65: --? Shaper. PS ?:183 Nov 63 Part IV of "Popular Science & Popular Mechanics Citations" will involve an expanded search criteria keywords of "Readers Guide" Volumes 9 thru 24. Art (Houston) ------- Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2002 22:39:47 -0000 From: "Art Volz" Subject: Hear Yea! Hear Yea! New Shaper Book Available! Just ordered a paperback copy of Kenneth Cope's just published "American Planer, Shaper and Slotter Builders" from Amazon. It was only $24.95, but I needed to have an order of at least $25 to get free shipping: so I ordered one of his other books too, "Admerican Lathe Builders 1810-1910", also at $24.95. 50 smacks, 2 machine tool books, and 0 highway robbery stick-up by USPS or UPS. When you go to http://www.amazon.com "search" for Kenneth Cope's other tool and machinery books at "authors". Looks like he has a lot of good stuff available. Art (Houston) ------- Date: Tue, 3 Sep 2002 07:53:27 -0400 From: "Tracy Atkinson" Subject: Re: Totally ignorant questions Original Message ----- From: oldisnew To: sherlinex~xxyahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, September 02, 2002 5:46 PM Subject: [sherline] Totally ignorant questions >>>[BIG SNIP] Also, I've gotten the Tabletop Machining book. Is there any point to getting The Home Machinist's Handbook too? Thanks! <<< Hello, oldisnew: Just to add my two cents worth, I think Briney's book is a far better introduction to the subject. Also, Sherline's website is one of the best in the business for the beginner. Go to their various "instructions" for the machines themselves, and especially the accessories. There is a goldmine of information in these and it is all written for the layman. Another source of excellent books is MAP in England ("Model and Allied Publications". They have a site also. The general introductions to shop- work are excellent, even though to have to guess-translate some of the terms. (I.e. "silver steel" is "tool steel" to us.) Once you have the title you want you can probably find it from a domestic source. I have learned at least 50% of what I know from Briney, and the rest from MAP books - along with from a lot of mistakes and a lot of good, very skillful friends at my live steam club. If you can find a club nearby you will find a lot of good folks very willing to help a novice - it makes them feel good. Tracy ------- Date: Tue, 3 Sep 2002 15:28:20 EDT From: wanlikerx~xxaol.com Subject: Map Machining books > Another source of excellent books is MAP in England ("Model and Allied > Publications". You can get the books thru: wiseowlx~xxsprintmail.com here in the US, also available are many more English and Australian magazines, suggest an email for a catalog. bill CCED ------- Date: Sun, 24 Nov 2002 10:52:10 -0000 From: "atlas101a" Subject: Re:Machinery's Handbook THE place to go is.... www.bookfinder.com. This site contains thousands of bookstores (second hand too). I used to go to www.abebooks.com, they are still great, but bookfinder also includes abebooks and more... Last month i bought a machinery's handbook for $12.50. good luck, PJ ------- Date: Sat, 28 Dec 2002 10:20:56 -0600 From: "Scott S. Logan" Subject: Re: manuals 28 Dec 2002, Harry wrote: > found this manual source on the net. has anyone used them? Are they > selling good manuals. or poor photo copies? > http://www.machinerybrochures.com/shop/page113.html Have you checked their prices? http://www.machinerybrochures.com/pricing.html Many of these manuals are available from the manufacturers, or other sources at a greatly reduced price. For instance, compare some of the following: http://www.machinerybrochures.com/shop/page1381.html http://lathe.safeshopper.com/2/cat2.htm?0 http://www.machinerybrochures.com/shop/page2277.html http://www.southbendlathe.com/manuals.htm http://www.machinerybrochures.com/shop/page177.html http://www.atlas-press.com/servicebulletins.htm Also, don't forget to check out our own compilation of information available FREE for members of this group at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Metal_Shapers/files/ Caveat Emptor. Message from Scott Logan Support the anti-Spam amendment sslx~xxlathe.com Join at http://www.cauce.org/ ------- Date: Thu, 02 Jan 2003 22:52:41 -0000 From: "bambukouk " Subject: Modern Machine Shop Practice just in case it is interesting to somebody else: I have just discovered the above mentioned book (by Joshua Rose 19th century) on the net in: http://digital.lib.msu.edu/onlinecolls/collection.cfm?CID=10 chapter of particular interest to you guys is (Shaping and Planing Machines): http://digital.lib.msu.edu/applied/modernmachine1/AONch16.pdf apologies if this is a repeat, but couldn't resist sharing it :-) rgrds Chris ------- Date: Thu, 27 Feb 2003 05:29:34 -0600 From: "Randy Pedersen" Subject: Re: New to group [GOOD LATHE REFERENCE BOOKS?] Here is a list of books that have been great for me as I had never had any lathe training before I purchased my first lathe. 1 "Manual of Lathe Operations & Machinist Tables by Atlas Press" Available from Clausing Ind. for about $25.00 2 "How to Run a Lathe The care and Operation of a Screw Cutting Lathe" Available from Lindsay Publications for about $7.95 as a reprint. 3 "Keep Your Lathe in Trim" same as above. 4 "South Bend Lathe Booklets" same as above. 5 "The Care and Operation of a Lathe" same as above but $7.50 6 "Machinery's Handbook" any addition found mine used on ebay about $6.00 7 "South Bend Lathe Projects" Lindsay Publications $11.95 I hope this helps Randy Pedersen Salina, Ks Atlas 618 South Bend 1946 9" A, 1938 9" C Enco 1105 Mill Drill ------- Date: Thu, 27 Feb 2003 06:38:20 -0800 From: "Dee Schuyler" Subject: Re: New to group I would like to add, I found a couple books that really helped me, and they are "Machine Tool Practices" and "General Industrial Machine Shop" by Harold Johnson. These both are school text books that I fiound at flea mkts, swap meets very good and a lot easier to absorb than jumping right into Machinery's Handbook Dee ------- Date: Thu, 27 Feb 2003 12:59:41 EST From: n8as1x~xxaol.com Subject: Re: New to group add machine tool operation by burghardt,,,vol1 covers bench work /lathe work ...vol 2 is mills .grndrs.shapers .planers pub.around 1922-4 ....author was superintendant of vocational studies ion N.J.....still refer back to it after 50 yrs .it provided the bacground & filled in the gaps of my atlas manual,which was my first tutor,& is now in tatters best wishes docn8as ------- Date: Sun, 2 Mar 2003 07:50:37 -0500 From: "George Erhart" Subject: Re: Check out US Patent Full-Text Database Number Search You should know that all patents before 1976 are in scanned image format only. To view these patents, you will need to download and install a TIFF image viewer. You can not search patents prior to 1976 by inventor or keyword searches. The URL that I use for accessing the main search page is: http://www.uspto.gov/patft/index.html George ------- Date: Thu, 06 Mar 2003 16:58:43 -0000 From: "dshulbert7" Subject: Patent Info. on "Hendey" group Some really good info. in the Hendey group was posted today about obtaining copies of patents from the gov't patent office. Also, an interesting post in the file section in the "Patents" folder has a drawing of a hand operated "Planing Machine" the likes of which I've never seen before. Doug ------- Date: Fri, 07 Mar 2003 08:31:16 -0000 From: "Art Volz" Subject: Re: Metal Shaper Videos??? Metal_Shapersx~xxyahoogroups.com, "markhubler" wrote: >I am interested in Metal Shapers and wondered if their are any videos >available. I know of one made by Rudy Kouhoupt, are there any others? Mark-- The only 2 VHS video tapes on shapers that I've seen available are Rudy's, with both being purchaseable directly from http://www.bay-com.com "Operating a Shaper" & "6 Projects for a Shaper", if I remember correctly, are the 2 titles. Most of the shaper manufacturers had ceased shaper making, or were long gone, or were virtually destitute, by the time that video taping arrived on the scene. Some of the manufacturers "may" have dabbled in black and white advertising films, at some time, but with all of them now dead, and long departed, and their records looted and destroyed...who knows what once was. From dust to dust. Maybe, somewhere within the subterrainean bowels of the Pentagon, resides, in some dark and dank lowest level store room, an unknown and no longer remembered WWII Army training film; however, if it was printed on "smokeless powder" film...it's in Fiddlers Green. When you think about it, most of the workers, that once made shapers, and planers, and a lot of the stuff that American middle class workers once made, have also already departed for Fiddlers' Green. From dust to dust: the reward of eternity. Then, looking at it from our point of view...that of a group of hobbyists ...there ain't very many of us either, and not many of us who are willing to fork over 56 clams for a video on shapers. I was one of the few, but only bought Rudy's first. Art (Houston) ------- Date: Fri, 07 Mar 2003 12:42:59 -0000 From: "camonc8" Subject: re videos Being there's no or very few videos to be seen perhaps someone on here who has been using the shaper for many a year could make one for us all too see. I have a good idea of how to use my shaper elliot 10m and I'm yet to do a proper project on it to completion. I think we'd all appreciate a good home made video of someone using a shaper to their full potential so come on guys, anyone out there with the skill and the camera gear to show us how its done... ------- Date: Fri, 7 Mar 2003 08:43:04 -1000 (HST) From: Tom Benedict Subject: Re: Re: Metal Shaper Videos??? On Fri, 7 Mar 2003, Art Volz wrote: > hobbyists...there ain't very many of us either, and not many of us who > are willing to fork over 56 clams for a video on shapers. I was one of > the few, but only bought Rudy's first. Mind giving us a review of Rudy's video? I've been eyeballing that for a while. My first priority is going to be (finally) finishing my shaper once we finally (FINALLY) move into a house where I can work on it. But once it's finished, I was thinking about asking for Rudy's video for my birthday. I've already picked over the Lindsay catalog and snagged just about everything they've got on operating a shaper. Even so, there's only so much you can get from a book. I'm positive I'm missing at least one key point, if not more. Thanks, Tom ------- Date: Fri, 07 Mar 2003 23:45:10 -0000 From: "dreilanderecht" Subject: Re: re videos Well, I learned from a book myself :) Actually, I think I have learned most of what I know about shapers from the school of hard knocks... things like making sure the job is properly secured, and making sure nothing is going to foul in any position that the table or ram will be in while working. Really I'm not too sure that making videos about such a specialist interest is viable, even on a "not for profit" basis. There are actually too many different things that could be covered to possibly fit into a short video, let alone the time it would take to set them all up and film. I'd suggest that what we have here is actually the basis for providing a lot of useful information. If each of us tries to document any interesting operations and maybe take a few pictures, we can put them in the files area and have a mine of useful information. Sometimes seeing how the other guy managed something completely differently will help you to see what is possible and help solve your particular machining problem. Of course, every make of machine is different, and we also all have different measuring and setting up aids....and really, the art of machining, whether on a shaper, a lathe, or one of these new fangled mills, has more to do with figuring out how to align and hold the job than it does to do with actually performing the cuts. regards John ------- Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2003 07:59:46 -0000 From: "Art Volz" Subject: Re: Metal Shaper Videos??? Tom-- Let me answer your question in two parts: this part now, and a later part later. I purchased Rudy's "Operating a Shaper" in the fall of 1999, soon after I had bought my Lewis-10. I ordered it by mail directly from Bay-Com. Several weeks later I received a copy of Rudy's video "Operating a Horizontal Milling Machine". Of course I watched it--starring an Atlas benchtop horizontal--and then returned it saying that they had sent the wrong one. Several more weeks expired before I received the correct video "Operating a Shaper". It came with a multiple-page printed outline. It features Rudy and an ancient benchtop shaper older than he is. It wasn't one of the usual suspects--not a Logan, or an Atlas, or a South Bend, or even an AMMCO--I don't even think it was a crank shaper, but it may have been a geared-drive shaper (rack and pinion). (I just hurriedly paged thru Cope's "American Planer, Shaper and Slotter Builders" and did not see it right off. It might be there and I just missed it...and then it might not be represented at all.) I remember I watched the video once in 1999, immediately after I got the right one, yawned afterwards with a large "Ho-hum!", and put it up on the shelf where it has sat unmolested since that time. I do not remember much about it as it was generally unmemorable. It is, however, very elementary and extremely fundamental and, for outright neophytes, is probably a good place to start...if the tab wasn't 57 green smack-olas. (ppd). I took it down from the shelf one wee morn last week (after the local re- run of a Mash episode on the boob tube), blew off a 3+ year accumulation of dust and grime, jammed it into the tape machine, got it up and running...and almost immediately fell asleep in my Captain's chair. On the other hand, I was tired, as it was almost 5:30 AM...and no one in his right mind ought to be looking at shaper videos (at least not this kind of shaper :-) ) so late at nite or so early in the morning. It was, however, before BMNT, so you can't castigate me on that account. To give the video a fairer shake, let me re-watch it in its entirety...(you know now that I'm a true blue masochist at heart)...and then I'll write and post some more words about it here. But, if you need my opinion, as it is right now, as to whether I would again purchase this video after seeing it once and then storing it there after, the answer would be no. Art (Houston) ------- Date: Thu, 13 Mar 2003 04:40:59 -0000 From: "Art Volz" Subject: Re: Metal Shaper Videos--PART II Tom--I was finally able to complete my second viewing of Rudy K's "Operating a Shaper"--my first viewing was in 1999. The video is...well, let me say it this way: it took me since Monday to go thru the whole thing (2 hours at run speed) again. Pure pain & agony. The only thing that made it bearable at all was my discovery of my button-box-remote's fast forward and very fast forward buttons...but, even then, whenever I slowed down to hear and see what was happening it was as if nothing had happened: like being trapped in a time bubble. Rudy's bench top shaper is a cutie, although after going thru Cope's a second time, I was still unable to locate and identify it. Maybe it was made after 1910; maybe it was not included in the book because it is a 3-incher (I think that's what I heard Rudy say once when I wasn't fast-forwarding). Anyway, it is a crank shaper after all, with an internal horizontal crank arm unlike the Boynton & Plummer's external crank arm. The shaper, itself, is the only star of this video. One of the lessons, that at least I learned from this video, is that making a video is not easy. The outline needs to be written and tested up front, and not after the video has been completed. Really, more than an outline is required for creating a quality product. In the movie business, while they'll start with a script of sorts, will then develop, and re-develop, a story board...until they've got it just right. And that's way before they start filming...and then they have an exact script, worded exactly the way they want down to the dotting of the eyes and the crossing of the tees. To me...and I've got an earned Masters in Occupational Education: Training & Development...this was never done. It is also apparent, again at least to me, that very little research of the available literature on shapers...you really have to hunt for it like I have...was ever done. That being said, I repeat my previous statment that I would not buy this video again, especially after watching it twice. There are many useful purposes for which $57 of hard earned cold cash can be spent: this video is NOT one of them. Sorry...that's the way I see it. I wish it was the other way. Art (Houston) ------- Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2003 03:41:34 EST From: maytagtwinx~xxaol.com Subject: Re: Re: Metal Shaper Videos??? Hi Tom and Art, I have Rudy's video, bought it several years ago before I had a running shaper. About three months ago I watched it (nodding off from time to time) but I did stick with it to the end. When I cranked up the SB 7" the other day for the first time, Rudy's suggestions were helpful. The first thing I remembered was the adjusting of the stroke. Next was the need for clapper action and how to tilt the head to achieve clearance for the return stoke. Now that I have made a few chips, and seen a beginning of what the SB can do, I will go back and watch Rudy's tape again. I'll keep the tape with the shaper and it may be of use to the next owner when I no longer am able to play with it. Art, you asked about the threads for the feet for the shaper base. They are 3/4" with 10 TPI. A farmer friend stopped by and said he had some in his cultch* box. He returned with a set of 4, 5" in grade five. I'll make up some pads for them and mount them head down with locking nuts. We'll be in business. Ron Carroll, mgr Clearmont Research Applications Project (CRAP) P.O. Box 118 Clearmont, MO 64431 *cultch, for the uniniated, is that stuff that collects and fills boxes. It has no present purpose, but is needed shortly after you throw it away. ------- Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2003 17:33:59 +0000 From: Tony Jeffree Subject: I've just heard from my printers that my Taig book has now been printed & is ready to ship (literally ship - it is being printed in Singapore). So I should have copies available in a small number of weeks now. I was amused to notice that Amazon already lists it on their UK website - they obviously picked up on the ISBN number registration. See the entry in my "bookshop" at: http://www.jeffree.co.uk/ModelEngineering.html Regards, Tony ------- Date: Wed, 12 Mar 2003 14:55:04 +0000 From: Tony Jeffree Subject: Taig Book contents The contents looks like this: Contents Acknowledgments i Preface iii 1 Introduction 1 1.1 Applications 2 1.2 Safety 3 2 Assembly and mounting 7 2.1 Assembling the lathe 7 2.2 Choosing a motor 11 2.3 Mounting the lathe 13 2.4 Motor mounting techniques 14 2.5 Maintenance 18 3 Work-holding devices 19 3.1 The 3-jaw chuck 19 3.2 The 4-jaw independent chuck 21 3.3 The face plate 22 3.4 Tailstock drill chucks 23 3.5 Drill chuck arbor 24 3.6 Collets 25 3.7 Blank and special purpose arbors 26 3.8 Tailstock support 28 4 Cutting tools 29 4.1 Tool posts 29 4.2 HSS tool bits 32 4.3 Carbide tools 33 4.4 Replaceable tip tools 33 4.5 Sharpening lathe tools 35 4.6 Boring bars 37 4.7 Making a boring bar holder 38 4.8 Radius turner 40 4.9 Slitting saw 40 4.10 Using cutting fluid 41 5 Standard accessories 43 5.1 The lever operated drilling tailstock 43 5.2 Needle bearing centre 44 5.3 Milling slide and milling vice 44 5.4 Milling cutters 45 5.5 Compound slide 46 5.6 Steady rest 47 5.7 Riser blocks 47 5.8 Chuck depth stop 48 5.9 Grinding wheel set 49 5.10 Tailstock die holder 49 5.11 Spindle wrench 49 5.12 Wood-turner's face plate 50 5.13 Adjustable toolrest 50 5.14 Lathe dog 51 6 Using the lathe 53 6.1 Care of the lathe 53 6.2 Fitting and removing chucks 55 6.3 Using collets 56 6.4 Selecting the right cutting speed 56 6.5 Parallel turning 58 6.6 Turning between centres 58 6.7 Taper turning 61 6.8 Milling 61 7 Checking alignment 65 7.1 Spindle runout 66 7.2 Axial alignment 66 7.3 Checking axial alignment quickly 68 7.4 Checking axial alignment accurately 69 7.5 Adjusting the tailstock quickly 70 7.6 Checking tailstock alignment accurately 73 8 Enhancing the lathe 75 8.1 Spinning handles 75 8.2 Locking knobs and handles 76 8.3 Extending the tailstock lever 77 8.4 Micrometer set-over adjuster 79 8.5 A filing rest 82 8.6 Machining small screws 85 8.7 Handwheel adaptor 88 8.8 Additional chucks 89 8.9 A tailstock travel indicator 91 9 Dividing and graduating 93 9.1 Simple dividing operations 94 9.2 Graduating using the lathe 96 9.3 Dividing heads and rotary tables 96 9.4 Headstock dividing attachment 98 9.5 Building the dividing attachment 100 9.6 Modifying the headstock 102 9.7 The brake shoe 106 9.8 The pinch bolt and tommy bar 107 9.9 The dividing assembly mounting plate 109 9.10 Modifying the 20dp worm wheel 110 9.11 The division components 111 9.12 The primary worm carrier 111 9.13 The secondary worm assembly 112 9.14 The primary worm shaft 115 9.15 Index plate boss 116 9.16 The sector arms 117 9.17 Division plates and hole circles 119 9.18 The indexing arm components 121 9.19 Tailstock support 123 9.20 Putting it all together 123 9.21 Direct dividing setup 124 9.22 Simple and compound dividing setup 124 9.23 Simple division 125 9.24 Compound division 125 9.25 Using a protractor 127 10 Adding a leadscrew 129 10.1 Attaching the drive to the spindle 130 10.2 The tumbler support bracket 132 10.3 The tumbler assembly 134 10.4 The dog clutch 141 10.5 Fitting the clutch 146 10.6 The leadscrew 148 10.7 The split nut assembly 153 10.8 The "banjo" components 158 10.9 Fine feed set-up 161 10.10 Screw cutting set-up 163 10.11 A word on safety 165 Annex A Suppliers and other resources 167 A.1 Taig dealers 167 A.2 Tool suppliers 171 A.3 Other suppliers 171 A.4 Internet resources 172 Annex B Lathe specifications 173 B.1 General Specifications 173 B.2 Capacity 173 B.3 Spindle 174 Index 175 I've had a couple of off-list emails about availability in the USA. Nick Carter has indicated to me that he will want to keep a small stock of copies, so let him know if you want to put your name down for a copy. Regards, Tony ------- Date: Sun, 23 Mar 2003 13:45:34 -0800 From: Alan Marconett KM6VV Subject: Re: steam and stirling book Bill McKillip wrote: > Has anyone bought the book "Steam and Stirling". I would like to > move on from basic wobblers, but I can't find any plans that are just > one step up from wobblers. Or maybe you can point me to a good plan > somewhere on the net that is not too difficult. I have looked at some > of the other obvious yahoo groups. Bill Hi Bill, I have two "Steam and Stirling" books, and can recommend both. I'd also highly recommend the three "The Shop Wisdom of Rudy Kouhoupt" volumes. Also recommended is Stuart Model's "Building a Vertical Steam Engine", Which details the construction of the 10V (and similar) vertical steam engines. I learned quite a bit from this book, and was able to build the engines pictured in the files section under "KM6VV Engines". Alan KM6VV -------- Date: Thu, 27 Mar 2003 17:17:28 -0800 From: "Nicholas Carter and Felice Luftschein" Subject: Tony's book "The Taig Lathe" now in stock I received 100 copies of Tony's book today. The price is $24.00 with free media mail shipping, or $3.00 extra for priority mail shipping in the US. Canadian orders may cost more, I need to do a little research as well as get to Staples and buy some mailing envelopes. Look for a review of the book and details on my website in a day or two. See our web pages http://www.cartertools.com/nfhome.html ------- Date: Mon, 31 Mar 2003 19:21:36 -0000 From: "jeastwoodlm" Subject: Re: steam and stirling book After I built two wobblers I too was ready for something a little more advanced. Allow me to recommend Ed Warren's books: below is an excerpt from a message I sent a while back (search for Ed Warren in this [SHERLINE] group's archives...) "I'll continue my "boosterism" of Ed Warren's plans, described in two volumes titled "Home Made Steam Engines", available from Camelback Press (go to www.4w.com/modeltec/ for one place to order them; Powells Technical bookstore in Portland Oregon also has them in stock.)" Volume 2 of Home Made Steam Engines has several nice engines that I'd call intermediate for required skill/experience level. I just finished his "Miss Too" engine a few weeks back; it has valve gear, unlike a wobbler, and was fun to make and a good way to develop my machining skills. It's of a size that's easy to to make on Sherline equipment. He has several others in that volume that look good too. I'm currently working on the Phil Duclos "Hula" engine described in the Steam and Stirling vol. 2 book; looks like a lot of work, but since I first read about it I've "lusted" after it. Good luck (and have fun!), ------- Date: Thu, 03 Apr 2003 19:21:39 -0000 From: "Walter Anderson" Subject: Tony's book [ON TAIG] My copy just arrived from Nick. I just spent my lunch hour reading it. I have to say I have a MAJOR COMPLAINT about the book... Why wasn't it available a year ago when I was getting started! ;-) This book answers so many of the questions I had. I hope Taig adds this to their product line. Tony, you are to be commended on a fine job. Walter ------- Date: Tue, 08 Apr 2003 08:08:26 +0100 From: Tony Jeffree Subject: Re: Got the book At 00:15 08/04/2003 +0000, you wrote: >Kudos, Tony. Every bit the precisely constructed product we've come >to know you for. Wonderfully laid out. A real Keeper. Thanks! >I just know >it will all soak in as I'm a bit distracted (my natural condition, >really) with projects. I warn you in advance that I may post an "AH- >HAA!" months from now on this group. I look forward to it. And please let me know if you find anything that needs fixing - already started collecting (so far only minor) changes for a 2nd edition. [2005 NOTE: second edition is out.] Regards, Tony ------- Date: Wed, 09 Apr 2003 19:58:28 -0000 From: "Art Volz" Subject: Re: do you ever lube the cutter when shaping? [NOTE: This question was posed with regard to a shaper but the books recommended deal with all types of machining. As Art very correctly points out, metal machining is done on different machines but the actual micro process can be really the same. Metal moves over the cutter, or cutter moves through the metal. Same thing to the metal being cut. Think outside the box and apply lessons from one machine or process to another.] Lynn-- Al is right. It seems, however, that it's time, Lynn, for you to open up your wallet again and fork over some real cash, or go to you friendly local public library and ask them about "Inter Library Loans". Your unrelenting thirst for knowledge needs quenching immediately. A fantastic "quencher" is Steve Krar's "Technology of Machine Tools, 5th Ed." (Glencoe/McGraw-Hill, (C)1997, ISBN 0-02-803071-0, TJ1185.K668 1997, 621.9'02--dc20, LC 96-5183) which has Unit 32 (Chapter 32) entitled "Cutting Fluids-Types and Applications". And then, when you wanna know something else 'bout x-chining it has a detailed index to its 850+, 8-1/2x11 sized copiously illustrated with enumerated procedures, pages. You can't go wrong. With this book in hand you, Lynn, will soon be answering the questions and not asking them. Some may object to the $99 dollar price tag for a new one, but then look for a used one. Borrow one--via Inter Library Loan--from the public library first if you ain't got no coins burnin' a hole thru your pocket. A specific machine tool capability (other than already acquired knowledge) is really composed of 3 main parts: (1) the machine tool itself; (2) tooling and accessories (usually the MOST costly); (3) documentation to include OEM manuals AND textbooks on MACHINING TECHNOLGY. Krar's is the best that I have found on the 3rd requirement; if anyone can discover a better one, currently available, let me know. I used Krar's book as the core text for a university Engineering Technolgy class that I designed, developed, and taught several years ago. Nothing specifically on shapers/planers (older Krar editions had this info--they are featured in my 3rd Edition), but a shaper, if you look at it from a different point of view, is really a "flat cutting lathe"--generally what is true for a lathe is applicable, generically, to a shaper/planer, but you've got to be able to "read between the lines"...to "see" outside of your box. Enjoy! Art (Houston) ------- Date: Fri, 9 May 2003 01:55:09 EDT From: anthrhodesx~xxaol.com Subject: Re: Two important questions [COMPANY'S ATLAS LATHE MANUAL] In a message dated Wed, 7 May 2003 16:42:59 -0700 (PDT), Lemual Moss writes: << --- First the easy one. I have the book manual of Lathe operation, post marked april 25, 1947 .on box. Well it seems that something is missing. Page 61 stops and the next chapter starts with page 157 Is this normal for these books or is there an error here?--->> No, this is not normal. In front of me I have a copy of the book copyrighted 1988 (latest version from Clausing). P. 61 is the 17th page of a section entitled "The Machining of Various Metals" which continues through p. 65. This is followed by sections on "Holding the Work" (pp. 67 through 80) and "Drilling and Boring" (pp. 81 through 91). The section on "Threading" starts on p. 93 and runs through p.174, starting out with general concepts on threading and specs on specific threads, then a sub-section on thread cutting on the 12" with QC, then the 12" without QC, and then the 6" lathe. So you are missing a lot of important information. I also have a 1937 edition, slightly different pagination through p. 93, then it's completely missing the "Threading" section, picking up again at p.157 with the section "Lathe Attachments and Their Uses". It's my understanding that in those earlier years the threading section was provided seperately depending on which model of lathe you had, 6", 9", or 10", or 12", and possibly whether you had a QC Box or not. I also have a xerox copy of a 1937 edition, similar to the above 1937 version but which includes the threading information for the 6" lathe only, running to 61 pages. Hope the above helps. Anthony Berkeley, Calif. ------- Date: Sat, 10 May 2003 09:29:02 -0700 From: Alan Marconett KM6VV Subject: Re: Horizontal Steam Engines [SHERLINE GROUP] Gdavis5000x~xxaol.com wrote: > > I've uploaded pix of a pair of horizontal steam engines > > that I've just completed. Hi George, Dan: Thanks for the kind words! The camera is a Nikon 880, which I like. The book is "Steam Engine Design", a reprint by Lindsay Publications, ISBN 0-917914-10-4. Other good books are: "Building a Vertical Steam Engine" by Andrew Smith "Model Stationary and Marine Steam Engines" by K.N.Harris Alan KM6VV ------- Date: Mon, 19 May 2003 08:57:32 -1000 (HST) From: Tom Benedict Subject: Books on clock gears 16 May 2003 Xeno3579x~xxcs.com wrote: >"I've got another one on tooth profiles for clock gears, and how to >generate the shapes for the cutters. It's completely different from the >involute gear tooth forms, so there's very little cross-over between >this one and the other two." >Could you please tell me the name of the book, and the author's name? Sure thing! There are actually two. One is published by Lindsay Publications (http://www.lindsaybks.com). It's by a guy named "Robert Porter", and is titled "How to Make a Tool Grinding Attachment for the Watchmaker's Lathe for Making Gear Cutters and the Like". I think it shows up in the catalog under "Tool Grinding Attachment". Not exactly descriptive. As the title suggests, the book is focused on making tools to cut clock wheel and pinion cutters. The second is "Clock Wheel and Pinion Cutting" by J.M. Wild. This is more the process involved in cutting the wheels and pinions themselves, though he does go into tooth form. Neither is very expensive. I'm glad I got them both. Tom ------- Date: Mon, 26 May 2003 21:06:12 -0000 From: "Thomas Firecracker" Subject: Shaper Books John, I almost forgot . Regarding the books, you can order them thru www.astragalpress.com . The titles are American Lathe Builders 1810- 1910 and American Planers, Shapers, and Slotter Builders. Both are by author Kenneth Cope and can be bought separately or as a set . Thomas ------- Date: Sat, 21 Jun 2003 10:44:36 EDT From: wanlikerx~xxaol.com Subject: Kozo Hirokas 6/21/2003, sherlinex~xxyahoogroups.com writes: > In fact I have purchased all of Kozo Hirokas books just for the > illustrations of his fabrication techniques. He is a master of it. For anyone just starting out, or with a small limited machine, these are required reading. He will teach you techniques on how to make the most of your machines, and the abilities to fabricate parts without needing castings. If you want follow his teachings from the start you will end up with a nice locomotive, but the education from a master is worth away more than the price of his books. bill CCED ------- Date: Sun, 22 Jun 2003 08:51:02 -0500 From: "Nance, Tom" Subject: RE: Re: Kozo Hirokas [sherline] June 22, 2003 mwhirailer [mailto:mwhirailerx~xxameritech.net] wrote: >> Wow, I found his books. Thanks for the info guys!!! IIRC there are three books covering the Shay, Climax, and Heisler. Which has the most info on machining? Is there one that is a must have before the others? Thanks, Terry << Hi Terry, The books are not a series. That is, each one stands alone and does not require information from a previous book. Each one describes the construction of a fabulously detailed locomotive. The models are made completely from readily available bar stock and does not require any castings. They are built in 3/4" scale and finding tracks at that scale may be a bit difficult. However, if you divide all measurements by 2, (3/8 scale) you get pretty close to G-scale for which track is available almost everywhere. You will have to manually adjust the axle lengths for 1:32 track or whatever you decide you will use. You can also multiply the measurements by 2 to get 1-1/2" scale. There are some clubs that have lines at this scale. As for which book to get first, I'd say get them all. Each locomotive has different machining problems and the solutions of which may be applied to some other projects you may have. If your juices get flowing and you want to build one of these beauties, let me caution you and say that the one book of Mr. Hiraoka that you didn't mention - The Pennsylvania A3 Switcher - may be the place to start. Unlike the other locomotives, the A3 switcher is not gear driven. Working with gears always increases the complexity and lowers the machining tollerances. The A3 has a very forgiving, straightforward design. I would start there. But that's just me. The Shay almost *requires* CNC. I don't see how anyone can freehand some of the mill movements his instructions describe. Tom Nance Corpus Christi, TX ------- Date: Sun, 22 Jun 2003 11:44:53 -0400 From: "Ron Ginger" Subject: Re: Kozo > I did a search with Google and turned this up. > http://plsntcov.8m.com/differential.htm That's my web site; I don't think Kozo is mentioned on that page. The page is about an all spur gear differential I made for a steam traction engine. Kozo has written articles, then turned into books, for LIVE STEAM magazine for about 20 years. As others have noted he is a master at simplification, and his drawings are just amazing. Note his drawings must be all done by hand because his first works were published long before CAD. I think some of his techniques are much like one would do with a solid modeler CAD system. If you wanted to draw a complicated casting like a steam engine bed you would build it up from basic geometry like cubes, cylinders, sheets, etc. If you want to build a one-off model do the same thing, silver soldering the bits together. One of Kozo's major 'secrets' is small brass screws, about 2-56. These are used to hold parts together while silver soldering. After they are soldered the screw heads are simply filed or milled off. I'm not really interested in locomotive models, but I did buy all Kozo's books just for the techniques. It is interesting to compare Kozo and Rudy Kouhoupt. Both have written many articles, both have a unique drawing style and both write very clear and informative text. Rudy builds models that look very simplistic when finished; Kozo builds mechanical masterpieces. Both use simple techniques. ron ginger ------- Date: Sun, 22 Jun 2003 15:35:41 EDT From: catboat15x~xxaol.com Subject: Re: Re: Kozo Hirokas In a message dated 6/22/2003, Tom.Nancex~xxFleetPride.com writes: > The Pennsylvania A3 Switcher - may be the place to start. Yes, the Pennsy switcher is a beginners locomotive. It does call for wheel castings though, but if you get the driving wheel castings for the Raritan 2-4-0 from Tanski Engnineering the castings are the right size for the the switcher. I have both the book and the castings in my stash of "someday to do" things. Also piles of scratch paper sketches to use the Tanski castings, Koso's drawings to make a freelance locomotive using Koso's boiler and valve gear as I don't really care for the Pennsy's looks. Maybe age it a dozen years or so and wed koso's stuff with Tanski castings and make a 2-4-0 with Koso's boiler and valve gear. BTW for you in the states Koso uses metric sizes so keep your calculator warm and convert metric threads to SAE. John LBSC Virginia LBSC Tich 200 some feet of 3.5 inch ground level track ------- Date: Sat, 4 Oct 2003 17:38:49 -0700 (PDT) From: Patrick Head Subject: Excellent Web Link This may be old news to this group, but I just stumbled onto a fantastic one-stop-shopping engineering/mechanical/machining reference web site. It is www.engineersedge.com TONS of reference materials, charts, and standards information, such as: Drill Tap chart Drill Size chart Screw Size chart Trigonometric formulae Tolerance standards ISO and ANSI stanards CAD file standards etc Thought I would pass it along, just in case you haven't been there yet. Also, I don't post to this group very often, but I do read almost every post everyday, and I want to thank everyone for all the invaluable information!! Patrick T. Head ------- Date: Fri, 5 Dec 2003 06:21:44 -0600 From: "Randy Pedersen" Subject: Re: Books [for new owner of Atlas lathe] The best manuals I have found are the Atlas "Manual of Lathe Operations and Machinist Tables", available for Clausing Ind. South Bend's "How to Run a Lathe" available from Lindsay Publications and Sheldon's "The Care and Operation of a Lathe also available from Lindsay Publications. Your shop will need a copy of "Machinery's Handbook" this gives you the information on the strength of materials, gearing, screws, allowances and tolerances for fits, speeds and feeds and tons of other information. The following is a list of places to find parts, accessories and information for your machine: http://www.atlas-press.com/service.htm This is the manufacture of the Atlas equipment and will have a parts breakdown and the manual mentioned above. http://www.lathes.co.uk/index.html This site has a ton of information on just about any lathe. Has very good section on Atlas and South Bend. http://www.mermac.com Meridian Machinery sometimes has used parts. http://www.paramountmachinery.com/ Paramount Machinery Corp. sometimes has used parts. I have no web address for the following: Sobel Machinery All types of used machines and parts. 93 Garry Rd. Closter, NJ 07624, (201) 768-9645, (201) 768-2842 (FAX) Plaza Machinery Co. Used machinery and parts. P.O. Box 14, Bethel, VT 05032, (802) 234-9673, (802) 234-6325 (FAX), E-Mail: amy.bergamox~xxquest-net.com I am sure others on the list will give you some more but this should get you started. Randy Pedersen Salina, Ks Atlas 618 South Bend 1946 9" A, 1938 9" C Enco 1105 Mill Drill ------- Date: Sun, 07 Dec 2003 04:38:33 -0000 From: "noxonje" Subject: Re: Books Try Powell's Books in Portland Oregon. They have a book store that is one whole city block and 5 stories high. They also have a technical books store a couple of blocks away that has 3 floors and is half a block square. I think it is www.powells.com One heck of a place. I have been there a couple of times; it is unbelievable. j ------- Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2003 21:40:35 -0600 From: "Ray Ethridge" Subject: Re: SHAPING SQUARE HOLES Probably the best I know of is to get a copy of "Building a Single-shot, Falling-block Rifle Action" by Walter B. Mueller, from Villiage Press. In it there is a pretty good description of the process, unfortunately set up on a vertical mill. You just have to re-orient it so the shaper is doing the job you need to do, but the instructions are pretty good. [run following two lines together, no space, for address] http://www.homeshopmachinist.net/store/index.cfm?curloca tion=4&dig=1&itemnum=RA&start=1&maxrows=10 Ray Ethridge ------- Subject: Re: Re:Patent search oldtools digest From: Trevor Robinson Date: Tue, 30 Dec 2003 16:19:05 -0500 (EST) You can search patents of several countries by going to http://ep.espacenet.com. US Patents go back to the beginning, but others start later. I think that British start only about 1850. They have, as well, French, German, and Japanese; but I have no experience with those. Trevor ------- Date: Fri, 9 Jan 2004 00:40:25 -0800 From: "Larry Richter" Subject: Re: Re: Injection molding with This book has been around a long time, in a couple of editions. Because what Cannon called "rubber" when he titled the book was really room temperature curing elastomers of a couple of kinds, it edges into small scale production of what amounts to rigid parts. The mold principles apply for any material. The emphasis of what he was interested in seems to have been replacement parts for the consumables in collector market items like cars and old farm machinery. I have had a copy of the first edition for a long time, and have not used one of Cannon's schemes directly, but I have used things that were a reaction to Cannon's ideas. If you can get a look at it, it is probably worthwhile to do so. A lot of them out there in libraries and used. ABE listing-- Cannon, William A. How to Cast Small Metal and Rubber Parts Blue Ridge Summit,PA: TAB Books Inc. 1986. Paper Back. Near Fine/No Jacket. Second Edition. 8vo - over 7¾" - 9¾" tall. Book: Slightly cocked. Lots of photo's and illustrations. ISBN:0830604146 Bookseller Inventory #001230 Price: US$ 10.00 (Convert Currency) Bookseller: River Rat Books, Manvel, ND, U.S.A. There are also genuine technical books on injection molding on ABE, retired ones that went into that retirement when their owners did. I saw one listed on ABE from 1947, which would have been when U.S. "get it done" technology was at it's most robust and flexible, kind of like German chemical industry practice in the wide open 1880's and 90's. Some or all of whatever there has been out there is usually available on interlibrary loan, and you can see from them what the original idea was, and what low cost solutions there were available before huge took over as the only acceptable size for tooling, etc. -------- Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2004 00:26:39 -0000 From: "Walter Anderson" Subject: Re: Books I've put together a machining blibliography that even includes some links to free books available on the web. You can view it at: http://www.geocities.com/wandrson/taig/bibliography.html Walter ------- Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2004 17:07:19 -1000 (HST) From: Tom Benedict Subject: RE: Re: Books On Tue, 20 Jan 2004, Carol & Jerry Jankura wrote: > Hi, Tom: What's your opinion on the usefulness of Tony Jeffree's > book for a NON Taig desktop tool owner? -- Jerry I think it'd be useful. It's Taig-centric in much the same way that Doug Briney's book focuses on Sherline tools, and to some extent the way Joe Martin's "Tabletop Machining" book SERIOUSLY focuses on Sherline tools. Still, I got a lot out of both books, and the only piece of Sherline equipment I own is my rotary table. I think a non-Taig owner would get a lot out of Tony's book. There are some sections that may not be as useful to someone with another lathe. Tony goes into the Taig accessories. That might or might not be useful. Still, I could see someone with a 7x12 lathe going, "Holy cow! I can get [accessory x] and adapt it to my lathe!". Good case in point is Jose's adaptation of the Taig vertical slide as a small milling slide on his Minilathe. The leadscrew section would probably hold no appeal to a Sherline owner at all for obvious reasons. But the dividing head stuff could be adapted to a Sherline headstock without to much re-engineering. If I had a Sherline CNC mill without a rotary table, or if I was doing rotary work on narrow long things, I'd definitely think about making a CNC-ized version of Tony's dividing head out of a Sherline headstock so I could bolt it to my table and use it. I've got that Sherline CNC rotary table, and I'm still considering making one of Tony's dividing heads simply because it's based off a headstock, and can be used in other ways. The non-Taig specific sections that are geared toward getting people new to metalwork up to speed on a small lathe would be useful to pretty much anyone with a small lathe, not just someone with a Taig. All in all I think it's worth a look-see, regardless of the tools you use. Tom ------- Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 02:36:36 -0000 From: "dreilanderecht" Subject: Shapers in ME [Metal_Shapers group at Yahoo] I have uploaded a file to the Metal_shapers_pix group called "Shapers in ME.doc". Sorry all you Linux or BSD users, it is in MS Word format so that I can do tables. It has three tables in it, one being the articles where the "category" is shaper, the second being articles where the title contains shaper, and the third being articles where the notes contains shaper. There will therefore be some duplication. (I dunno how to do "or" in a query!) The index I used contains issues from volume 30 to about now. Vol 30 is 1914. My own collection starts at 1940 which makes it about volume 82. Of course, if I get a sudden rush of requests for photocopies I might have to ask for something to cover costs, but I'm usually happy to photocopy old articles...I like to get a postcard in return...maybe I should ask for a piece of toolsteel! (This is not a commercial.) I can get access to older ones, but not at short notice. I'll probably try and get copies of all of these articles for my own nefarious purposes so later may be better able to help anyone who wants them. For those unfamiliar, Model Engineer is probably the longest running amateur hobby magazine, or at least in the Engineering field. Publication started in 1898. Covers what the Americans would call "home shop" as well as models, but probably strongest on model steam. regards John ------- Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 09:33:14 -0000 From: "dreilanderecht" Subject: Model Engineer Articles I spent half an hour or so tonight and have dug out a dozen or so of the issues of Model Engineer referred to in the tables I posted. These are most of the ones from about the forties to the sixties. Most of them refer to the Perfecto or the Adept. One, about using a shaper as a power hacksaw, was written by none other than Neville Shute Norway, better known for writing "On the Beach", "Trustee from the Toolroom" and some other good reads. Probably best thing to do with these is gradually scan them and post them in the PIX group, although we probably won't be able to leave them posted forever. Most of the articles are things like fitting power to hand shapers and fitting various forms of auto feed. One heretic fitted a milling spindle. Actually I just received a cheque today from Model Engineer for a couple of articles I wrote. One was on using the shaper to make a dovetail novelty...a block of aluminium and a block of steel that appear to be joined by two crossed dovetails. Well of course all is not as it appears, but it makes a very challenging machining exercise. They seem quite keen to have more shaper stuff so I am writing up some other interesting bits. regards John ------- Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 19:12:40 -0000 From: volzmechatronicx~xxyahoo.com Subject: Re: Model Engineer Articles My favorite Nevil Shute (Nevil S. Norway) book was "Sliderule: Auto- biography of an Engineer". The account of the two competing dirigible designs in post WWI England--he was an engineer for the one that was properly designed as the other one, "engineered" with mumble jumble and alchemy, crashed soon after its takeoff for India--is in itself fascinating. I've read it several times, and each time it is better... like old IT wine. Art (Houston) ------- Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 09:17:56 -0000 From: "Jim Knighton" Subject: Re: Dovetail cutting > I've never cut a dovetail (male or female) on a mill. I have a > project that, while it may not be the only way, I want to try it to > learn how. First attempt will be with a 45 degree 3/8 wide dovetail > bit in nylon. Then again in aluminum. I am looking for info on how > to make the cuts, speeds, feeds, gotchas, and wisdom from those who > have done them. Is there anyone here familiar with the procedure or > can you point me to a URL or book with help? Rusty Turley Like you, I was apprehensive about cutting a dovetail and wanted to see it done before trying it myself. Normally, I just jump in and learn from my mistakes. Not this time - I was more worried about screwing up an expensive and fragile looking cutter than anything else. I was sufficiently nervous that I purchased Jose Rodriguez's video on making a miniature boring head. The boring head project has matching male and female dovetails as well as some other interesting and useful operations. I got what I needed out of it and my first dovetail turned out just fine. Who knows, maybe I'll even build Jose's boring head someday. The video isn't wildly expensive and is available in both VHS and DVD from Little Machine Shop. Regards, Jim Knighton ------- Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2004 19:35:40 -0600 From: "Clifton Lowry" Subject: Re: Drawings for Clock Wheel Making Engine Complete plans can be found in the now-defunct English magazine THE CLOCKMAKER. The articles ran from Vol 1#7(Apr/May91) thru Vol 2 # 4 Oct/Nov 92). The author was Eliot Isaacs, FBHI. The plans are VERY complete and even contains detailed instructions for making the necessary division plates. Anyone of the British booksellers should have the bound volumes; if memory serves me, the books cost about $75. Clif San Antonio ------- Date: Sat, 24 Apr 2004 19:47:00 -0000 From: "Marv Paisner" Subject: Re: Drill Bit geometry?? --- In taigtools "steve sc" wrote: > A question for the experts on drill bits. I have been web searching > but cannot seem to find the geometry of a standard twist drill bit. > Of specific interest is the relationship of the cutting edge Some information here: http://155.217.58.58/cgi-bin/atdl.dll/tc/9-524/Ch4.htm#top It is part of the "US Army Fundamentals of Machine Tools" site: http://155.217.58.58/cgi-bin/atdl.dll/tc/9-524/toc.htm hope this helps, Marv ------- Date: Sat, 24 Apr 2004 21:55:12 +0200 From: "Dushan Grujich" Subject: Re: Drill Bit geometry?? You can get all the info You need in "Drills, Taps and Dies" By Tubal Cain ISBN 0-85242-866-9, originally published in 1987 by Argus Books Ltd. of London UK. I believe that You can purchase it at CHRONOS http://www.chronos.ltd.uk/ [or from many machine tool vendors] Best regards from the nice City of Belgrade. Dushan Grujich CMW >>Experience is the name everyone gives to their mistakes.<< Oscar Wilde ------- Date: Fri, 14 May 2004 18:56:04 -0400 From: "Jerry Glickstein" Subject: THE BOOK I have what I consider THE BOOK on cutting tools. The title is "Design and Use of Cutting Tools" It was written by Leo J. St. Clair First Edition 1952 McGraw-Hill Book Company Inc. The Maple Press Company, York, PA. 437 pages. Library of Congress Catalog Card Number 51-12947 I think it is out of print. I have memorized it to a great extent, yet it is a fantastic reference book as well. Covers every aspect . I "inherited" the book from a fellow machinist in 1955. Regards, Jerry G (Glickstein) ------- Date: Sun, 30 May 2004 08:09:12 -0000 From: volzmechatronicx~xxyahoo.com Subject: The Oracle of Delphi: The Secret Book: UPDATE The Machinery Dealers National Association--MDNA--currently publishes a book that has serial numbers for many machines plus other machine tool information. This book used to be called "Serial Number Reference Book for Metalworking Machinery". It has been renamed "Machine Tool Reference Guide" and is available from MDNA for $39.95 + $5 S&H: http://www.mdna.org/publications.html. I just ordered the latest edition for myself. Buy one...and then you too can become the Oracle of Delphi..."herself". :-) Art (Houston) ------- Date: Wed, 09 Jun 2004 11:01:16 -0400 From: Bob Colquitt Subject: ME article list for shapers/shaping [Metal_Shapers Group] I've combined & am modifying JW Early's Model Engineer article index Excel files and did a database sort for shapers & shaping. Yes, I converted the spreadsheets to a database for my antique iMac. Here's the text file for shaping: It does not include the publish date [not in the files]; just another chore to do. The "$-" at the beginning of each listing shows the article has been uploaded either on the Metal_Shapers Yahoo group or one/more of JWE's groups on Yahoo. Hope it's useful.. -=- Bob Colquitt ------- Date: Fri, 06 Aug 2004 15:21:55 -0000 From: "Chet R Biggerstaff" Subject: A cool find! [taigtools group] Last night I was in my shop cleaning up the mess (as we usually do days after we have finished) and I ran across a slew of old (very old) magazines from the 1920's, 1930's, 1940's and 1950's that belonged to my grandfather. They are all like popular science, mechanics illustrated and others of the day. Many of them have quite a few good articles on machining and making parts and tools for metalworking and in particular for the atlas and southbend lathes. I was up until almost 3am just going through the index of one of the types of mags pulling out the ones that had metalworking articles in them. As the are so old I can reprint them or post them to my site without copyright issues. I will be posting them to my site (www.thecarver.net) as soon as possible so that all can look at them and use what they need. If interested shoot me an email. Thanks ------- Date: Fri, 06 Aug 2004 13:19:44 -0500 From: "Bad Brad" Subject: RE: A cool find! Chet, Age of a copyright doesn't mean anything. Always contact the proper people for permission to use their work, if you don't, you could be contacted by them instead and they (Big publications such as Popular Mechanics) have known to be down-right unfriendly. >From: "Chet R Biggerstaff" >Reply-To: As the are so old I can reprint them or post >them to my site without copyright issues. Bad Brad Rabid Weasel Racing Team ------- Date: Sat, 07 Aug 2004 08:17:15 -0700 From: James Eckman Subject: Re: A cool find! If I remember correctly anything before the early 20's is now public domain. 1923? Check the Library of Congress website. Also if it's a dead magazine that didn't survive the 40's, odds are copyright was never renewed. That one's a more difficult call. Jim ------- Date: Thu, 12 Aug 2004 20:32:46 -0000 From: "R. Wade Brooks" Subject: Good Reading I found a site with introductory material and a few movies that I thought the group might enjoy. http://jjjtrain.kanabco.com/vms/library.html They did not include shapers, but does have a nice intro to lathes and mills. Maybe some of our members can give them shaper and planer section. Hope you all enjoy it Wade ------- Date: Tue, 21 Sep 2004 13:59:44 EDT From: wanlikerx~xxaol.com Subject: tutorials >> Are there any books/tutorials that can get the newcomer through the basics of using CAD/CAM CNC software and the CNC lathe? Example would be something as simple as setup for turning something as simple as the shape of a golf tee. << Try these URLs for information. Be sure to look at the LINKS, at every site you visit, some good stuff hidden out there. http://213.10.73.60/majosoft/hobbycnclinks/body_hobbycnclinks.html http://www.davegoodfellow.com/index.html http://www.wokingham.demon.co.uk/prog/programming.htm#G-Codes http://www.homecnc.info/cnc-main.html http://www.machinist-toolbox.com/links.htm http://stcnc.tripod.com/tutorial/ http://stcnc.tripod.com/ http://me.mit.edu/lectures/router/1-goals.html http://www.ktmarketing.com/CNC.html The CCED FAQ is also at this site somewhere, take a look around a lot of goodies there. http://www.welsoft.co.uk/index.html On this one look for the tool setting info, and the microscope but cheaper available. http://www.geocities.com/mklotz.geo/ Non CNC, but DOS machinist utilities, a must see. http://www.metalworking.com/tutorials/ARMY-TC-9-524/9-524-index.html General machining Navy online book, not CNC I have a book "COMPUTER NUMERICAL CONTROL PROGRAMMING BASICS" from "Industrial Press" publishers of the "Machinery's Handbook", that I downloaded and printed from the WWW, you might have to do some Google searching for it. bill CCED ------- Date: Tue, 9 Nov 2004 09:55:00 -0800 From: "Dave Hylands" Subject: FW: New Model engine Magazine [posted on sherline group] Seems like a bunch of people on this list might be interested... Start of Forwarded message ----- As you may know, Robert Washburn ceased publication of StrictlyIC in December of 2002 and the IC segment of the hobby has been without a dedicated magazine. I hope that Model Engine Builder will be able to replace StrictlyIC with a slightly different magazine. MEB will be 'mostly IC,' with a little bit of Stirling and perhaps even Gas Turbine (Jet engines) thrown in. Furthermore, we will also pay attention to beginners and those who have miniature (Sherline-sized) equipment on which to build their models. As an adjunct to the magazine, our web site will have additional help for beginners, expanded (but not necessary) information for the build articles, and a short video with sound of the engines in the articles so viewers can see and hear them before they build them. The first issue will be in reader's hands on March 1, 2005 and we will produce 3 more issues to cap the first year. In 2006, having more experience and more contributor contacts (a strong hint), we feel we will be able to increase the publication rate to 6 times per year. The subscription cost is $29.95 in the U.S. and slightly more in Canada due to the cost of postage. We will have our web site capable of handling subscriptions by mid-November and can also accept mail-in subscriptions where the payment is in U.S. Dollars. The life blood of any hobby magazine (other than subscriptions and advertising) is the quality and quantity of contributions. I welcome any contributed articles (I'll soon have a contributor package finished) as long as they pertain to the IC engine side of the hobby. For obvious reasons, I don't want to tread in the Home Shop Machinist and Live Steam areas of coverage. We hope to have at least 2 engine projects running simultaneously plus shorter articles on building engine components e.g., how to make oil-control piston rings or how to make an ignition system that will work at 10,000 rpm J or a miniature magneto that will run a model farm engine. Right now we have a single-cylinder diesel aircraft engine and a multi-cylinder air-cooled, in-line engine as the first two build articles. The aircraft engine is by Ron Chernich of Australia (here is his marvelous web site http://archive.dstc.edu.au/BDU/staff/ron/ )and the multi is by Randall Cox of Wyoming. Both are good running engines and Randall's design can be build with any number of cylinders between 1 and 6, possibly more. Lastly, we will have a centerfold article in the magazine. This is not a build article but is about an engine and its builder. First out of the gate is the incredible cast iron V-8 Chevrolet Small-Block by Eugene Corl, a BAEM member living in Reno, Nevada. If you haven't seen it or followed its seven-year construction odyssey, this is an engine that externally and internally, looks as if a full-sized engine was given to a South American Head Hunter and they shrank it. It is extremely faithful to the prototype engine. Best regards, Mike Rehmus Editor, Model Engine Builder Magazine www.modelenginebuilder.com Elmwood Publishing ------- Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2005 19:39:38 -0500 From: "Bill Hardin" Subject: RE: Popular Mechanics Shop Tips >Recently came across Popular Mechanics Shop Tips for 1943 and 1947. >Great stuff, lots of tips, some would make OSHA faint dead away. >Where can I get more? How many years were these publications made? >Tim Colbert K3HX I recently bought the set, 26 volumes, 1905 to 1930, from Lee Valley Tools, 29,000 entries. I'd like to find a set from 1931 on. Link to site is http://www.leevalley.com/wood/page.aspx?page=42563&catego ry=1,46096,46131&abspage=1&ccurrency=2&sid= You can buy one book or all. As an extra, they also have the index to all, 512 pages for about $12. For those interested, I acquired the reprint rights to this series, and have started putting those related to lathes on my web site under Hints & Tips. At the current rate, I will never get them all up there, but there are a bunch. Bill Hardin http://www.homeshopsupply.com Craftsman 109 Lathe Support ------- Subject: Re:Image/Text Databases [Oldtools list] From: red_iriex~xxpipeline.com Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 19:57:57 -0500 (EST) Esteemed Galoots, I just wanted to post up some of my favorite image database websites. I know the U. Wisconsin database has been mentioned before but, for those who've not seen, the wealth of woodworking and metalworking text and images it contains is singular. The reference images for future projects (a Galoot can dream can't he?) located in these databases are staggering. I left out American Memory since it is widely known. The British Library app that allows one to "turn the pages" on ancient texts is worth the visit. Enjoy! I would love to hear from the "Biblio-Galoots" out there about other great text/image databases that they've come across. Best, Noel Digital Library for the Decorative Arts and Material Culture U. of Wisconsin-Madison http://decorativearts.library.wisc.edu/ Text collections on decorative arts is located at: http://digicoll.library.wisc.edu/DLDecArts/TextAbout.html Ingenious http://www.ingenious.org.uk New York Public Library Digital Gallery http://digitalgallery.nypl.org/nypldigital/index.cfm British Library Turning the Pages http://www.bl.uk/collections/treasures/digitisation5.html Insight Visual Collections http://www.davidrumsey.com/collections ------- Also see: U.S. National Gallery of Art for woodcarving and metalworking and much more: http://www.nga.gov/collection/gallery/iad.htm Cornell U's Manufacturer and Builder mag from 1869 onward: http://cdl.library.cornell.edu/moa/browse.journals/manu.html U.S. Library of Congress: http://www.loc.gov/ U. Penn's Online Books page: http://digital.library.upenn.edu/books/ Michigan State U's Libraries online http://digital.lib.msu.edu/collections/ Project Gutenberg online books: http://www.promo.net/pg/index.html ------- Subject: Re: State Library of South Australia [Oldtools] From: "Peter Marquis-Kyle" Date: Sat, 23 Apr 2005 17:18:06 +1000 Gary Roberts wrote: > Take a look through this great archive of STUFF.. try a search under > something like 'carpenter' for some images... > http://www.catalog.slsa.sa.gov.au:1084/screens/opacmenu.html Good suggestion, Gary. And to see even more Australian images, try Picture Australia < www.pictureaustralia.org > which gives you a better search and display interface to images in collections all around the country. That way, you can find all the same South Australian material, plus lots more from the other state and national collections. Peter Marquis-Kyle ------- Subject: Re: copper working [Oldtools] From: Kevin Foley Date: Mon, 16 May 2005 18:31:01 -0400 Blake Ashley wrote:>Greetings All, >Have you any suggestions for books on working with copper - as in >forming interesting and useful objects from copper sheets? Thanks! Hi Blake, one possibility is "The Art of Coppersmithing" by John Fuller Jr., Astragal Press. The emphasis here is practical objects -- not a frill anywhere. Good introduction in how to make basic forms and combine basic forms into complex assemblages. Sealing, tinning etc. are included. Orignally published in 1893 so old tools are all that's mentioned but then safety and toxicology also represent the same era. About 400 pages IIRC. Regards, Kevin Foley ------- Subject: Re: copper working From: "S or J" Date: Wed, 18 May 2005 09:14:35 -0400 Blake Ashley wrote:>Greetings All, >Have you any suggestions for books on working with copper - as in >forming interesting and useful objects from copper sheets? Thanks! Hi Blake A couple of very practical paperbacks were (re)published by Dover Publications Inc. I don't know if either is still in publication, but used copies are available inexpensively through used-bookfinding sites such as http://www.abebooks.com/ http://www.bookfinder.com/ http://www.alibris.com/ Abebooks alone has more than a dozen copies of each, at well under U.S. $10. in a search done today. It is well worth getting both books. "Metalwork For Craftsmen" by Emil F. Kronquist ISBN: 0-486-22789-8 Library of Congress Catalog Card Number: 78-160856 This has 55 step by step projects involving copper or other sheet metals (and you can often substitute copper when other metals are specified). 202 pages. "Coppercraft and Silver Made at Home" by Karl Robert Kramer and Nora Kramer ISBN: 0-486-22790-1 Library of Congress Catalog Card Number: 70-178088 This book has fewer projects but more detailed how-to's and tips on creating your own designs. 175 pages. regards Steve -- in Thunder Bay, Ontario, Canada Machining and Metalworking at Home http://www.janellestudio.com/metal/ ------- Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 13:28:56 +0000 From: j.w.earlyx~xxatt.net Subject: JWE's MW Groups [beginnerswkshp group posting] As per recent discussion here is an updated list of the metal working related groups I am maintaining at the current time. There are some others I have contributed content to that are owned and moderated by others. These groups are for educational purposes and not for personal profit whether for myself or others. Because they are educational in nature discussion might drift to points some might consider Off Topic because of the need to explain reality to some who might not have had a complete education. Archive group for the Geometer Beginners Workshop series from the mid 1950s and the Hints & Tips series from the late 1950s and early 1960s. (01) http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Geometer/ Archive group for the Novices Workshop series from the early 1950s as well the tutorial Chuck cartoons by Terry Aspin from the early 1960s are archived here. (02) http://groups.yahoo.com/group/beginnerswkshp/ http://groups.yahoo.com/group/beginnerswkshp1/ http://groups.yahoo.com/group/beginnerswkshp2/ Archive group for the useful hints and tips from Model Engineer that were posted on mlprojects. (03) http://groups.yahoo.com/group/hintstips/ Searchable indexes for Model Engineer magazine from 1939 to 1999. Also partial indexes for some other magazines with metal working content. The one for HSM and PiM/MW are the most complete but not fully verified or commented. (04) http://groups.yahoo.com/group/meindex/ Lathe modification and improvement articles for the MiniLathe and other home shop machines. Alignment, collets, fine feed ideas, tailstock mods and ideas and ideas for quick change gearboxes. (05) http://groups.yahoo.com/group/mlathemods/ Dials, reconditioning tricks and taper attachments. (06) http://groups.yahoo.com/group/mlathemods2/ Making keyways, spherical turning attachments, taper turning attachments and worm gear attachments. (07) http://groups.yahoo.com/group/mlathemods3/ Attachments for milling in the lathe, threading and quick change or improved tool posts. (08) http://groups.yahoo.com/group/mlathemods04/ An idea on how to make a flex shaft tool and the article archive for the Jeynes series. (10) http://groups.yahoo.com/group/mlathemods4/ Discussion and aid with control and motor problems on the mini lathe. (11) http://groups.yahoo.com/group/mlathemods5/ Model building projects mostly related to I/C engines, plus some OT content from time to time as this group was originally started to draw the OT content away from the 7x10 group. (12) http://groups.yahoo.com/group/mlprojects/ I.C. engine projects. (13) http://groups.yahoo.com/group/mlprojects1/ Steam engines and related materials. (14) http://groups.yahoo.com/group/mlprojects2/ (15) http://groups.yahoo.com/group/mlprojects2a/ Steam engines and boilers (16) http://groups.yahoo.com/group/mlprojects2b/ Steam traction and road going equipment. (17) http://groups.yahoo.com/group/mlprojects3/ Steam powered fire engines and pumps, also some interesting articles on hydraulic rams. (18) http://groups.yahoo.com/group/mlprojects4/ Cameras in the workshop http://groups.yahoo.com/group/mlprojects5/ Some old clock building articles from ME and as well discussion on building clocks and special tools and tricks for doing the job. (19) http://groups.yahoo.com/group/mlhorology/ Metal working hints & tips for the beginner as well the more experienced user. Mechanical drawing, measuring tools, cross drilling and pattern-making. (20) http://groups.yahoo.com/group/mwhints/ Duplex on threading and some other hints and projects from this super team. As well some ideas from the past on alternitive power sources. (21) http://groups.yahoo.com/group/mwhints2/ Drill sharpening, tool sharpening, knurling and parting off. (22) http://groups.yahoo.com/group/mwhints3/ Centering work, use of chucks and other work-holding devices and more information on tapping. (23) http://groups.yahoo.com/group/mwhints4/ Some ideas for building your own lathe or improving the one you have. (24) http://groups.yahoo.com/group/mwlatheideas/ Tools and ideas for the small shop milling machine and shaper. (25) http://groups.yahoo.com/group/mwmills/ Indexing, dividing and gear cutting on the lathe and mill. (26) http://groups.yahoo.com/group/mwmills2/ Power hacksaws, saws and other secondary but useful shop equipment. (27) http://groups.yahoo.com/group/mwsmalltools/ JWE Long Beach, CA ------- Date: Sat, 24 Sep 2005 01:59:39 -0000 From: "Art Volz" Subject: Re: SB-7 Parts and Instruction Manuals In Metal_Shapersx~xxyahoogroups.com, "eqreservoir" wrote: > I've looked in all the files and couldn't come up with the SB-7 > Parts and Instruction Manuals other than the Army one. > Did South Bend provide these manuals with the shaper? > Is there a source for these manuals? If you have the Army manual you have the South Bend manual. The only difference, esentially, is that the Army pub is a TM. Note that the TM designation ends with a "P"--that means "and parts". Apparently, the Army manual is a photo lithograpy copy. I have the last two copies of the South Bend manual that I picked up at their then location-in the early 1980's--the old Studebaker Engineering Dept. building--in South Bend. The only current source of "real" South Bend non-Army manuals is on eBay where, every now and then, one appears. So, that said, are you happy? If your SB has a pump, be sure to also download Mike F's file on the pump as well. Lubrication info is on the tag on the outside of your shaper's door. There are also a jillion good ideas and notes hidden away in our message archives. Start your search there with the key words "South Bend". Art (Houston) ------- NOTE TO FILE: "SHOP SAVVY" BOOK Just recently noticed that I had recommended a great book to others but had not listed it here. "Shop Savvy" by Roy Moungovan is a very enjoyable read for any metalworker or woodworker. Dozens (hundreds?) of invaluable tips and jigs and adapters and adaptations along with sage advice. I enjoy reading it again at least a couple of times a year. Mine is a softcover edition published for Popular Science, by Sterling Publishing Co., Inc. New York. ISBN 0-8069-5800-6. There was an earlier hardcover published by Grolier Book Clubs, Inc. It is probably not in print now (2006), but copies can often be found through used book vendors on the Web. ------- Date: Fri, 6 Jan 2006 01:49:44 -1000 (HST) From: benedict-listx~xxhawaii.rr.com Subject: Re: Nasmyth autobiography!! [taigtools] On Fri, 6 Jan 2006, gehaddad wrote: > Thanks for posting the link to the Nasmyth book on your site. I've been > reading it. I love the story of how he built his own slow cooker so > dinner would be ready when he got home from Maudley's shop. Sounds > dangerous with an oil burner for heat! > Can you recommend any other good historical/philosophical books on > lathes, machine tools, tool makers? You got me hooked. Heh! Glad I was able to hook you on that one! Nasmyth is a riot. Here are some others I've enjoyed: "60 Years with Men and Machines" - Fred Colvin Fred Colvin was co-author of the first Machinist's Handbook, among a slew of other books. He started making injectors for steam engines in the late 1800's, and saw the advent of the era of the jet engine. The writing is witty and the viewpoint is unique. "Industrial Biography" - Samuel Smiles Samuel Smiles helped Nasmyth write his autobiography, and is mentioned in it. Industrial Biography starts with the British foundries (before Maudslay ever put tool to metal) and ends with the machine tool firmly established as a cornerstone of industry. The writing is less personal than Nasmyth's or Colvin's, but it covers more ground. "English and American Tool Builders" - Joseph Wickham Roe This is a good companion book to Industrial Biography. It starts later in the period of tool development, and continues past the end of Indistrial Biography. The writing style is very similar, though there are a number of anecdotal stories that do get up close and personal. "Echoes from the Oil Country" - William Osborne These are excerpts from a series of letters written to the American Machinist by Osborne between the late 1800's and the early 1900's and touch on a number of subjects, from hiring practices, to reading material, to what to do with pesky customers who can't keep their hands off the tools. It's full of lively stories from someone who worked in a job shop out in the boonies where you were as likely to get a job making well tooling as you were to get a job fixing a cart axle. Five volumes are in print. There are others, but my books are at home and I'm not. I'll poke around tonight and see what I can scare up. Most of these used to be available through Lindsay Publications. If not, they do show up new and used on Amazon and Ebay from time to time. I like them all. Tom ------- Date: Mon, 09 Jan 2006 06:14:02 -0000 From: "Art Volz" Subject: Shaper Book (ATTN: Brad) > I've been looking to buy a book or several books on how to operate > a shaper. Any advise on which ones are the better ones to purchase? > Thanks, Brad Brad--The book you want is "Shaper Work" last printed by Delmar in 1953. Used copies run over $100 each when found. It's 300 pages and copiously illustrated with exquisite drawings. Errol Groff has kindly made CD copies of this book (plus a lot of other good stuff on the CD) available for $10 which includes shipping. Send Errol a USPS Money Order for $10: Errol Groff 180 Middle Road Preston, CT 06365-8206 errol.groffx~xxsnet.net There's always an ad in the New England Model Engineering Society's "NEMES Gazette" as there is for December of 2005. Errol is a leading member of NEMES. See: http://www.neme-s.org/NEMES_Gazette.htm Art ------- NOTE TO FILE: On 18 Jan 2006 I received this email from Frank Marlow: >>Dear Sir: Please consider adding Machine Shop Essentials to your links. The book is on basic-to-intermediate manually-controlled machine tools for model makers, prototypers, instrument makers, live steamers and engine builders. You can see more about this book on its site: MetalArtsPress.com Should you wish to review this book on your site, just send me your mailing address for a no-charge copy. This book is available in Europe, Canada, and the US. Sincerely, Frank Marlow Metal Arts Press 8461 Valencia Drive Huntington Beach, CA 92647-6033 inquiriesx~xxmetalartspress.com metalartspress.com << As Machining and Metalworking at Home is non-commercial and I have no financial relationship with any metalworking commercial site, the offer of a free book to review was respectfully declined. There is nothing wrong with such an offer, which is normal business promotional practice. I just prefer to remain completely objective and beyond any possible hint of bias in any of my writings here. What I did do was visit Mr. Marlow's website shown above and examined the threading-on-a-lathe example from his book posted there. I then re-read the threading chapters from 6 other books (including the official manuals from Atlas and South Bend). While some of these books gave more background information, none approached the clarity and completeness of Mr. Marlow's step-by-step instructions and excellent illustrations. Most of my books required reading and re-reading and then adding notes before I would have a comparable list of complete steps on how to thread. If the rest of the book matches the threading example, then Mr. Marlow's book merits consideration as a very useful tool in the metal workshop. ------- Re: what's a good book on building model engines? [LittleEngines] Posted by: "Frank Hasieber" fhasieberx~xxyahoo.co.uk Date: Mon Nov 13, 2006 1:53 pm ((PST)) >>Original Message-- [to:LittleEngines at yahoogroups]on behalf Of grant_richardson25 I want to buy a good book that cover all aspects of building model IC engines. Like how to bore cylinders what size piston and ring for what size bore. How to turn cranks and so on. Some one told me a reamer works great for boring small cylinders like less than a inch bore. I need a good book on lathe and mill operation also. Thanks << I don't know of any one book that I can recommend, although there are a number, in Yahoo, there a several groups for IC engines, I'll give the links to those I belong to below, J W Earley's groups have a wealth of information, amongst these groups you should be able to find all the information you could need. I seriously doubt the ability of a reamer to finish a bore to the required standard, honing is the answer after boring. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/bayareaenginemodelersclub/ http://groups.yahoo.com/group/icengines/ http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Min_Int_Comb_Eng/ http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Model_glo_engine_builders http://groups.yahoo.com/group/modelicengines http://groups.yahoo.com/group/R_and_R_engines If you can afford them, all back issues of Strictly IC are still available, this is an exceptionally good resource: http://www.strictlyic.com/ and the newest Magazine which I subscribe to and can recommend: http://www.modelenginebuilder.com/ I hope this is of some help, you could also try searching on Amazon. Frank ------- Nation Builder Books - February 27, 2007 [Min_Int_Comb_Eng] Posted by: "TRUMAN SIMS" JACK-BR549x~xxWORLDNET.ATT.NET Date: Tue Feb 27, 2007 9:52 am ((PST)) Here is a fairly good place to find books if you haven't seen it yet. http://www.nbbooks.com/ Jack Sims ------- Date: Sat, 07 Apr 2007 20:49:21 -0400 From: pleenhoutsx~xxaol.com Subject: [OldTools] magazine Ohio History - digital copies 1887 through 2004 are free and searchable Found an interesting paragraph in one of the weekly web summaries I watch, The Weekly Internet Scout Report. A quick search indicates some articles on Ohio toolmaking may be relevant to our list. "7. Ohio History http://publications.ohiohistory.org/ohstemplate.cfm?action=intro Are you looking for an article about Horace Mann and Antioch College? Perhaps you would be interested in a piece of scholarship dealing with public housing in Cleveland? Both of these topics can be found between the digital pages of the journal, Ohio History, which is offered at no charge, courtesy of the Ohio Public Library Information Network. Over the past several years, they have worked to digitize issues of the journal dating back to June 1887. This site contains all of the issues up to the Winter- Spring 2004 edition, and visitors will enjoy browsing through this publication at their leisure. Amidst all of the 53,000 pages of digitized text, visitors will have no trouble finding articles that suit their particular interest within the world of historical scholarship on all things Ohio. [KMG]" Further information on the Scout Report can be found at The Scout Report, Copyright Internet Scout Project 1994-2007. http://scout.wisc.edu/ Pete in Port Ludlow 50 and partly cloudy - 81 yesterday and clear ------- Re: A Great Place to Locate Rare Books [sherline] Posted by: "ballypatricktollymore" john.morton22x~xxbtopenworld.com Date: Thu Oct 11, 2007 6:34 am ((PDT)) "Jerry G"wrote: > Ladies and Gentlemen of Both Groups; This will help all those who might be trying to find hard to find books... On any subject. www.bookfinder.com They have over 125 million books! Jerry G (Glickstein)< Hello all. Having been a book collector for 40+ years, here are a few more useful links. Copac...Trussels...Clique...Abe books...Amazon rare books... www.booksatpbfa.com All the best for now, John ------- Re: A Great Place to Locate Rare Books Posted by: "Ron OConnor" connor.rx~xxsbcglobal.net Date: Thu Oct 11, 2007 11:30 am ((PDT)) Theoretically bookfinder.com searches Alibris & ABEbooks & Amazon & a bunch more I can't think of. Ron ------- NOTE TO FILE: 2013. The following book recommendations come out of the now extinct MyMyford group, and are largely about Myford lathes, although many ideas could be adapted to other brands of lathes. For Myford owners, there are more books discussed in the file here called Myford Lathe Gems. Myford owners (and others too) should particularly see the thread Re: Identifying maker's intention re guidance of carriage in the Myford Lathe Gems file dating October 2007. As often happens, discussions about machinery and machining tips may include brief mentions of publications. ------- Re: workshop manual [MyMyford] Posted by: "walwatters" 9wombat9x~xxtpg.com.au Date: Wed Oct 31, 2007 6:11 pm ((PDT)) "Norman Atkinson" wrote: > This seems to covered in George Thomas's Model Engineers Workshop > Manual pages 281 and 282. Here we have the classic restrictions on > copyright- sorry. I'm a new member (or a rather old member, depending on how you look at it!) and I would like to know a bit more about George Thomas's Model Engineers Workshop Manual. What is it, and where can I get one? Regards, Wal Watters ------- Re: workshop manual Posted by: "tr0up" tr0upx~xxyahoo.com Date: Wed Oct 31, 2007 8:06 pm ((PDT)) It's an edited collection of GT's best writings, largely on the improvement and use of the Myford 7 series lathes, but ranging widely over the pursuit of excellence in amateur machining and design efforts -- with a heavy slant towards modelmaking and small toolmaking. Some chapters are detailed explanations with drawings of how to build certain lathe or milling machine enhancements: improved topslides with Hardinge-style retraction for screwcutting and offset hand cranks to clear the tailstock, rear toolposts, rotary tables, 4 station turret toolholders, etc... He details small incremental improvements, like dowelling the gib strip on the topslide to give it better feel, or fitting needle roller thrust bearings to the cross-slide -- not, as he points out (correctly, I think), to reduce friction, but to reduce the 'wishy washy' factor whereby the oil film of the thrust faces is a variable resilient element every time you take up the backlash in applying a cut. Now I come to think of it, in the case of the Super 7 these faces are much larger. I've just made this mod and am very happy with the result; I've always been a big fan of needle roller thrusts in the right application, and they represent incredibly good value.) In almost every case he draws up both ML7 and Super 7 variants. Part of the value of a book like his is that it trips you into a mindset where you start looking at machine tools more in terms of opportunities to make little improvements. Provided the improvements are genuine and worthwhile, this can greatly increase the satisfaction of using them for the rest of their working life (which is often extended, either by the mods or the increased protective urges engendered by the mods !) Try your local library, or google the title and author. It's available from amazon.com if you can't find a second-hand copy As a design engineer who at one time made a living designing machine tools, I have a high opinion of his powers of analysis and reasoning. He also had a highly developed aesthetic sensibility which meant that his drawings, as well as his designs, were works of art, better than most professional draughtsmen of the day. Who in turn, without being curmudgeonly, were on average more attuned to producing drawings which translate smoothly into mental images than CAD jockeys of today. It's a bit disappointing looking at the drawings in model engineering magazines these days, (Admittedly, as I'm not a model engineer, I have only passing exposure to them,) ------- Re: workshop manual Posted by: "Norman Atkinson" normanx~xxn-atkinson.wanadoo.co.uk Date: Thu Nov 1, 2007 12:14 am ((PDT)) At no point do I wish to criticise troups excellent precis. I can, however, add some history. Whilst GHT was already a gifted engineer, both professional and amateur, he didn't seem to write very much. It seems a moot point whether he did write an earlier students' book. I simply do not know. The story seems to start with the association of Professor Dennis Chaddock who appreciated the way that GHT explained things. Chaddock was also a gifted engineer designing the Quorn and making superb models. As a lecturer, DC, realised that Model Engineer was not being best served by the majority of contributions sent in. It all sounds a bit deja vu!Troup has got it right! There was a group of enthusiasts in close contact with each other -- probably the SMAE and Chaddock encouraged GHT to put his creations into print so that people like me could understand. If you do get out old copies of ME from the Library, you will soon realise that many writers got round difficult bits in construction by waffling or omitting. GHT took the problem and dissected it! Others, I regret, used Model Engineer to boost their p[ensions on retirement and there is repetition galore. With advancing age, I can say about some writers- 'but he said it in something else'. (I confess doing it as well but it is not for reward and it is for someone that has missed the first lot. In consequence, I do get pissed off.) When GHT fell ill and could not continue, Neil Hemingway continued to supply castings etc. When GHT died, Neil got most of the original stuff and Bill Bennett and his mates put it into a coherrent book form, indexed and sometimes with new photos as we have it today. When Neil retired, the firm Hemingwaykits came into being. It added more to us by taking over Woking Models which had Ned Westbury's stuff. Ned was Editor of ME. Woking had also the Potts range of tooling. Again, Cleeve's Swing tool became part of the range. It would seem that much is being re-drawn in CAD. May I suggest that you take a look at the website. Concluding, I have no connection other than a customer and with Bill, passing the time of day when Christmas Day falls on Ash Wednesday. tr0up - well said! Thanks ------- Re: workshop manual Posted by: "HG" hgx~xxallthemunros.com Date: Thu Nov 1, 2007 1:23 am ((PDT)) The writing, too, is just sublime, particularly for such a technical subject. Eg "..reminds me of a certain foreman who, because of his general build (and to some extent his habits) was known to the drawing office as 'Porky'." I often pick it up just for a quiet browse. Henry ------- Re: workshop manual Posted by: "p_ioannidis" pioannidisx~xxtpg.com.au Date: Thu Nov 1, 2007 7:16 am ((PDT)) Good morning all, I have been following the chat about the work of GHT and other Model Engineer contributors. I too am interested in purchasing some literature that would suggest some improvements for my ML7, there are currently 3 books recommended to me, they are: George Thomas's Model Engineers Workshop Manual, A Man and His Lathe by L.H. Sparey, ISBN 0905100557, Improvements & Accessories for Your Lathe by J.A. Radford, ISBN 1857611055 As I do not have access to all 3 books (as far as I know in Melbourne), I can not physically flick through them to decide which one would best suit my needs. Some of you seem to well read up, and possibly own them already to be able to tell me if one or more of the above double up on projects and improvements, Would it be worth while having them all? Thanks in advance. Peter P.S. Thanks to Philip Tuck for pictures of the clutch & plans (haven't decided on that path yet). ------- Re: workshop manual Posted by: "Tim Ostley" Tim.Ostleyx~xxgooglemail.com Date: Thu Nov 1, 2007 7:38 am ((PDT)) Peter, I have all three books (and one or two others!!). If I had to choose one I would go for the George Thomas one. I have found that you can pick up so much about the approach to machining tools etc just from reading the articles even if you have no intention of making the item concerned. Whilst GHT did indeed use castings, most of the Myford improvements used stock material, or could be fabricated from same. For the above reason I would also recommend the other GHT book (it was two but they have since been combined into one). Lots of good hints, tips and approaches. I would not dismiss the other books, or indeed articles by Martin Cleeve and others (Duplex and E.T. Westbury if you have mags from a while ago). I find there are always things to learn from reading about how other people solve or go about solving a particular problem. Have fun reading... Tim ------- Re: workshop manual Posted by: "Norman Atkinson" normanx~xxn-atkinson.wanadoo.co.uk Date: Thu Nov 1, 2007 7:56 am ((PDT)) Peter, I would go for GHT's Model Engineers Workshop Manual and add Workshop Techniques because the latter will show you how to make a dividing head which will work with the unusual 65 teeth in your ML7's bull wheel. With a bit of fiddling- assuming you do have a mill- you could avoid buying castings. In the second book you could construct the Universal Pillar Tool. I can assure you that it can be made by fabrication from solid and it can be done by welding. Both have been done here by fellow Club members. In addition, I would suggest his Small dividing head- in Techniques book. The drawings for the castings are in it! A wonderful bit of kit! Moving to the EWM, you have a ML7 and therefore would enjoy easier parting off. The drawings and words and music are there. A small rotary table?? Can be made from chunks of metal- GHT did just that on a ML7. You want a way to screwcut. GHT describes 2 tools. I could go on. Let's discuss old Sparey. To my recollection, his Amateurs Lathe is good but very dated. It does deal with the ML7! I have copies of all three which I suggest. I also have Jack Radfords book. JAR writes for the Super 7 but he is a competent worker but wanders and goes back to where he started. He forgets! By all means, get a copy. Whilst you are on, I would get Dennis Chaddocks book on the Quorn. I have built one of these beasts. You will really appreciate having something like this -- if only to show that you have mastered all the foregoing advice. By now, you will be dizzy. I have all the books and have made a lot of the bits. Amongst them all, you have a pretty good list of projects which should see you with a fantastic workshop and the skills which have developed in producing it. Good Luck ------- Re: workshop manual Posted by: "p_ioannidis" pioannidisx~xxtpg.com.au Date: Thu Nov 1, 2007 8:29 am ((PDT)) Thanks Tim, You said, "For the above reason I would also recommend the other GHT book (it was two but they have since been combined into one). Lots of good hints, tips and approaches." What were the titles of the 2 called & the exact title of the revised version? Thanks Norman, I might just scratch JAR's book for now. You also mentioned, "Whilst you are on, I would get Dennis Chaddocks book on the Quorn. I have built one of these beasts. You will really appreciate having something like this -- if only to show that you have mastered all the foregoing advice". I would consider a Quorn, if I knew what it is or does? Thanks again, Peter ------- Re: workshop manual Posted by: "HG" hgx~xxallthemunros.com Date: Thu Nov 1, 2007 8:32 am ((PDT)) What it [Quorn] does is drive you bonkers! Henry ------- NOTE TO FILE: The following videos are actually very useful and provide much clearer information than often found in books. Hopefully other videos in the original series will be found and posted on the web. ------- Lathe Videos. [atlas_craftsman] Posted by: "Joe R" jromasx~xxcolumbus.rr.com Date: Mon Nov 5, 2007 4:24 am ((PST)) There are 8 training videos that can be downloaded and played from the below site. They are mostly from WWII but still apply today. The original poster of the link is David Smith from the South Bend groups. http://www.shinyobjectdesign.com/staff/paul/sbvideo/ Joe Romas ------- NOTE TO FILE: The following message came out of a very long discussion in the MyMyford group about the unavailability of older isues of the U.K. magazines Model Engineer (ME) and Model Engineers' Workshop (MEW). Naturally the Myford lathe enthusiasts were primarily interested in old articles about their models and accessories, but the magazines have articles about all sorts of machines (all brands) and nifty projects, so you might benefit from many articles now out of print. An index to the articles is available free on the web, and after download it can be easily searched within your spreadsheet program. And if you do not have a spreadsheet program yet, the free (and excellent) suite called Open Office can be downloaded from elsewhere on the web (do a search for current download sites). There are a lot of libraries in the U.K. that hold old copies, and readers in other U.K. locations can see them through their interlibrary loan program. A similar program does exist for Canada and the U.S., and possibly elsewhere. Check with your local library. Magicalia, the publisher of ME and MEW, is investigating how it might legally (copyright issues are involved) publish selected groups of articles in books. They might also put selected older articles on their website, perhaps as soon as 2008. Whether the access to such online articles would be free or restricted in some way has not yet been announced, as of early December 2007. ------- Myford Articles [MyMyford group at Yahoo] Posted by: "Tim Ostley" Tim.Ostleyx~xxgooglemail.com Date: Wed Dec 5, 2007 9:14 am ((PST)) Dear All: As an interim can I offer the following? If you go to http://www.groundlevel.demon.co.uk/me_index.html you will find Bill Phillips indexes to ME and MEW which are free to download. If you download a file (I suggest 101-150) and open it using your favourite spreadsheet (if you don't have a spreadsheet get Open Office which is free), you can then search for articles by whomever you wish. I tried the following searches; Find 'Cleeve' (using Edit - Find). I also sorted the entire spreadsheet on Author and then scrolled down to Martin Cleeve (using Data - Sort but remember to select the entire spreadsheet first) This will give you a list of all that author's entries in ME for that range of Volumes including letters in postbag. You can then beg or borrow the appropriate magazine and peruse the article. If you are in the UK then trot along to your local library who will be able to get a volume of ME on inter-library loan for you. I realise that this doesn't generate a freely and easily accessible sets of re-prints but at least it gives you some way of finding out who has written articles and when they were published. Hope this helps. Tim ------- free books on line [LittleEngines] Posted by: "D.C.Clark" dcclark111x~xxcomcast.net Date: Sat Dec 22, 2007 8:26 am ((PST)) Good Morning Groups, While Googling about for some design info, I came across this site: http://www.fastonline.org/CD3WD_40/CD3WD/INDEX.HTM Has a number of interesting titles including: "Model Boilers and Boilermaking" and "Model Stationary and Marine Steam Engines". The site appears to be dedicated to technology transfer to developing countries. Many titles to fuel your survivalist fantasies (Crocodile Farming, anyone?). Also quite a lot of technical educational material including many metal working topics. Enjoy, regards, DC ------- Re: Essential Reading [MyMyford] Posted by: "ian_new" ian_newx~xxyahoo.com ian_new Date: Wed Feb 13, 2008 2:30 am ((PST)) Hello Rod: In my opinion the essential book for model engineers is: The Model Engineer's Handbook by 'Tubal Cain' (T. D. Walshaw) It is really just a giant collection of useful information on all aspects of engineering but viewed from the model engineer perspective. Lots of texts assume that you are in the business of mass production, have a huge industrial capacity lathe/mill and a similarly huge budget. Tubal Cain knows that you have a tiny, under-powered machine, no spare cash and that you are determined to perform miracles. My advice:- Keep your own notebook and write down everything; just be careful to note what worked and what gave you problems! When I was employed in engineering a group of us were sitting in the workshop one lunch time and the conversation got round to the contents of our pockets. Most of us had a small steel rule, a scriber, etc, etc. All of us had a copy of Zeus, a notebook and a piece of chalk. Ian ------- Re: Essential Reading Posted by: "keatinglaurie" steamcatx~xxshaw.ca Date: Wed Feb 13, 2008 10:00 am ((PST)) Scott A Stephens wrote: > What about Guy Lautard's (Think I got the last name right but will have > to check) "Machinist Bedside Reader" series. I have all 3 of Guy's Bedside Readers and can certainly recommend them. They don't deal with model engineering specifically but each one has a wealth of ideas that will get the grey matter working. I find that the more I work in my shop, the more useful these books become. I've built several useful small tools from the plans in the books. Regards; steamcat ------- NOTE TO FILE: I also have all three of Guy's books. Warning, if you have not read one before, you will probably read it cover to cover and may lose sleep. If months later you look up an article, you will find yourself trapped again. Besides dozens of tool and jig ideas, there is an incredible amount of practical advice on how-to's. And mixed in are some great on-topic stories. Guy is a real gentleman and his books can be obtained directly from his website if there is no local source. http://www.lautard.com/ ------- Re: Building plans for a small shaper? [Metal_Shapers] Posted by: "eqreservoir" hotair220x~xxmsn.com Date: Mon Mar 10, 2008 5:10 pm ((PDT)) "jmdiascosta" wrote: > If You can give me some more specifics about magazine issues (and > if it's not a burden to You) i will use that information to try to > buy those back issues. Thanks in advance Dias Costa The shaper plans are in the Home Shop Machinist Magazine July/August 1998--Part 1 September/October 1998--Part 2 January/February 1999--Part 3 March/April 1999--Part 4 If the Magazine issues are not available it may be in one of the project books. Their Phone number (Hope it works for you) is: 1-800-447-7367. Enjoy, HTj ------- NOTE TO FILE: PLANS TO BUILD A METAL SHAPER. The question comes up fairly frequently as to whether there are plans available for building a small metal shaper. Besides the plan featured in HSM magazine mentioned in the last message, the Dave Gingery book for building a motorized shaper is available from www.lindsaybks.com Another manually powered small 3" shaper was written up in Oct 1955 Popular Mechanics. A scan of the article is available for free download from: http://www.vintageprojects.com/machine-shop/Shaper.pdf BUT I was given a much clearer scan of this plan and posted it on a personal site address (not on my main site). Download is free: http://my.tbaytel.net/jstudio/lathe/3inshaper1.pdf I also have another scan where the pages are out of order, but it gives a bit of "color" as to what the original article looked like: http://my.tbaytel.net/jstudio/lathe/3inshaper.pdf ------- Date: Mon, 7 Apr 2008 14:10:19 -0400 (EDT) From: red_iriex~xxpipeline.com Subject: [OldTools] Military Field Manuals Dearest Galoots, It's been a dog's age since I posted but have been dutifully lurking! I wanted to call to your attention this wonderful archive of old military field and technical manuals at http://comarms.googlepages.com/obsoletemilitarymanuals Of note is this circa 1945 technical manual entitled MAINTENANCE AND CARE OF HAND TOOLS (aka TM 9-876). http://cgsc.leavenworth.army.mil/carl/wwIItms/TM9_867_1945.pdf Enjoy! Best, Noel -- The Urban Galoot ------- Dans source listing Parts Models 3 [LittleEngines] Posted by: "DA Dossin" danatlx~xxyahoo.com Date: Mon May 19, 2008 8:36 am ((PDT)) Folks, I am sorry I have to send my Resource list in an email. If someone knows how to convert it for a file, please feel free to either convert it and post it or send me instructions. Thank you for your understanding, Dan Wood strips http://northeasternscalelumber.com/osc/catalog/ Steam powered Air Plane http://www.flysteam.co.uk/index.htm Historic Steam Models http://historicsteammodels.com/ Home Machinist http://www.chaski.org/homemachinist/viewforum.php?f=8&sid=aeff 23c3c3e132123969f78037e6500f Boilers http://maccsteam.com/index.html Boiler water level control system http://home.earthlink.net/~bfindus/index.html Main Steam Models http://www.mainsteam.co.uk/ === LIVE STEAM MODELS http://www.stuartmodels.com/ http://www.livesteammodels.co.uk/modelcat.html http://www.miniaturesteammodels.com/ http://www.mmmachines.com/ http://myersengines.com/ http://www.billreichart.com/index.shtml http://www.john-tom.com/html/SteamPlans.html http://www.tinypower.com/ http://www.ministeam.com/index.html http://www.grahamind.com/stengine.html http://www.acs-engineering.co.uk/index.htm http://www.pmresearchinc.com/ http://stores.ebay.com/The-Steam-Chest === MISC PART AND STUFF http://www.dmoz.org/Arts/Crafts/Metal_Craft/Model_Engineering/ http://www.steamfittings.co.uk/asp/index.asp http://www.westbourne-model.co.uk/index.htm http://www.miniaturepressuregauge.com/ http://www.antiquengines.com/Davis_Model_Suppliers_List_.htm http://modelenginenews.org/index.html http://www.schsm.org/index.html http://www.dmoz.org/Arts/Crafts/Metal_Craft/Model_Engineering/ === Plans ONLY, I guess http://hasbrouck.8m.com/index.htm http://npmccabe.tripod.com/steam.htm http://www.marconettengineering.com/index.htm http://heetgasmodelbouw.ridders.nu/ http://www.john-tom.com/html/SteamPlans.html http://www.billreichart.com/index.shtml === STUFF I would hate to lose the URL http://www.rocousa.com/DETAIL.ASP?PRODUCT_ID=BR5210 http://www.hobbylinc.com/prods/uhu.htm http://www.evaporust.com/ http://rotometals.3dcartstores.com/Lead-Products_c_2.html http://www.alibre.com/support/downloads.aspx http://reviews.ebay.co.uk/BUYING-AND-RUNNING-MODEL-STEAM-BOIL ERS_W0QQugidZ10000000002369243?ssPageName=BUYGD:CAT:-1:SEARCH:2 http://www.metcosupply.com/ http://myersengines.com/ === REAL WORLD steam engines http://www.carferries.com/triple/ http://mysidewheeler.com/ http://www.pioneer.net/~carlich/ISS/ISSfront.html ------- Re: operators maual, 101-27440 [atlas_craftsman] Posted by: "angelo4967" angelo4967x~xxyahoo.com Date: Thu May 22, 2008 11:02 am ((PDT)) Not the manual for your lathe but this manual is great for learning basic lathe operations. Save a copy of it. http://www.bbssystem.com/manuals/Lathe-Tutorial.pdf Angelo ------- Re: Books and Magazines and Posting Designs [LittleEngines] Posted by: "Dirk Tollenaar" dtollenaarx~xxsbcglobal.net Date: Sun Jun 29, 2008 3:35 pm ((PDT)) Hello All, For some reason I am getting in on the end of this thread. What are you all talking about? If it is the fact that all of Elmer's Engine plans are located in the files sections of the four Elmer's Engines Group's, then what exactly are you asking or talking about? If for some remote reason you all think I have done something wrong by placing the plans there for everyone to download and enjoy, then you are incorrect. As I have stated several times before, I own the Copyright to the book, and have made the plans available as a gift to anyone who would like them. There is no Copyright problem here. If and when the original book is ever reprinted, then the four Elmer's Engines Groups will die, and the plans will be removed from the internet. However this will only take place to help promote the sales of the reprinted book. In the mean time, enjoy a free and legal gift, in the memory of Elmer Verburg. Dirk Tollenaar [From an earlier post] Here are the 4 Elmer's Engines groups: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Elmers_Engines_1/ http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Elmers_Engines_2/ http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Elmers_Engines_3/ http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Elmers_Engines_4/ ------- Re: Books and Magazines and Posting Designs Posted by: "a3sigma" dcclark111x~xxcomcast.net Date: Sun Jun 29, 2008 3:47 pm ((PDT)) Hi Dirk, I started the thread talking about bound copies of Model Engineer Magazine I found in a book store. Nothing to do with your Elmer's Engines files. Then the thread became more general regarding the legality of posting updated and revised designs of old engines. Best, DC ------- Re: Books and Magazines and Posting Designs Posted by: "DA Dossin" danatlx~xxyahoo.com Date: Sun Jun 29, 2008 4:01 pm ((PDT)) Dirk, we were only using the Elmer's Engines as an example for a previous discussion. IF at some point you do reprint is, please larger print. And color pics would be nice. Thank you for making the plans available for all to enjoy. Dan ------- Re: Books and Magazines and Posting Designs Posted by: "James Early" j.w.earlyx~xxworldnet.att.net Date: Sun Jun 29, 2008 4:23 pm ((PDT)) Dirk: I really do wish you could find a way to get the book reprinted. But I also hope you would do it in matte paper, not gloss. JWE Long Beach, CA ------- Re: Books and Magazines and Posting Designs Posted by: "Dirk Tollenaar" dtollenaarx~xxsbcglobal.net Date: Sun Jun 29, 2008 5:02 pm ((PDT)) Hi JWE: Hopefully that will take place sometime soon. There is also hopefully to be a rebirth of Model Tech, and a few other books that were printed by the original publisher. Only time will tell, and I'll make sure that your comment on the Matte Paper is a consideration. I'm not in the publishing business, but I really do not think there would be a cost difference. In the mean time, enjoy the Elmer's Groups. Thanks, Dirk Tollenaar ------- model engineering books [MyMyford] Posted by: "grampys2002" d.wainx~xxxplornet.com Date: Sun Aug 31, 2008 4:02 pm ((PDT)) Hi As a newcomer to the model engineering field I wonder if any one can recommend one book that covers lathe work (Myford ML7) and milling (Chinese machine). Thanks David W. ------- Re: model engineering books Posted by: "furkaoberalp" a.websterx~xxsympatico.ca Date: Sun Aug 31, 2008 5:43 pm ((PDT)) David, the standard works are: L. S. Sparey - The Amateur's Lathe * Ian Bradley - The Amateur's Workshop * Ian Bradley - ML7 Lathe Manual * Tubal Cain - Workholding in the Lathe Tubal Cain - Milling in the Lathe Ones with asterisks I recommend getting immediately. Wonderful books you will refer to constantly. Excellent toilet reading BTW. Buy one of those Ikea wall-mount book racks, put it in the loo, and load it with these books. I think you will find that 50% of us do this and the other half won't admit it! Between these there is plenty of info relevant to a Chinese vertical mill. They are rough and ready but quite conventional. Andrew Webster ------- Re: model engineering books Posted by: "tr0up" a.troupx~xxemail.com Date: Sun Aug 31, 2008 11:27 pm ((PDT)) You did say "one book" - that's a pretty tall order, and if asked to specify 5 books it would have been hard to improve on Andrew Webster's superb recommendations - with certain caveats. I'm an old fashioned guy when it comes to engineering, so these books have particular appeal for me. #2 on his list is the nearest thing to a single reference for both the topics you mention, and it's an outstanding book, but to put it in context: it was originally written well over half a century ago, before the Myford Super 7 was released, let alone before I was born, in an era of astonishing austerity in the UK, when there was virtually none of the current plethora of affordable (if sometimes rather junky) accessories and tooling. Some of the recommendations in all these books will suit a person who wishes to be extremely self reliant, but the emphasis tends to be on building the basics: such things as live centres, milling cutter holders, wigglers, knurling tools and such. (Changing hats now to devil's advocate, or devil's horns, depending on your point of view): Nowadays it invariably costs more to buy the raw materials for high- volume selling items like these than to buy them finished and of reasonable quality. It seems to me that for *most* people it would to make sense to focus on the sort of project which is either less available (usually because it is less generic to a range of machines) or less affordable when bought ready made. I'm thinking of things like centre height gauges at one end of the spectrum through to say a special purpose milling spindle for a lathe cross slide at the other. What's more: In all these books there is a distinct lack of information on how to use such things as carbide tooling, HSS taps, spotting drills, or ER collets, to instance just a few. Some of the advice will consequently be misleading: carbide and even cobalt lathe and mill tooling can occasionally be prevented from chattering by speeding up and often by increasing the feed rate; HSS ground thread taps often work better (especially for thru holes) tapping under power with no reversal and definitely no stops on the way thru; spotting drills have several advantages over centre drills in some situations (especially on a mill), and ER collets (truly a wonderful invention, one of the crowing achievements of the 20th century) violate some of the traditional rules of collet use, and relegate the once incomparable Autolock to the role of a minor player. Consequently some of the advice will mislead, or at the very least confuse, the newcomer. Generally speaking, amateurs are just now very well served by the affordable availability of the professional tooling of yesteryear, on the likes of eBay, often as new, but at a tiny fraction of the original prices. This 'industrial strength' stuff did not rate a mention in the amateur literature of yesteryear: it would have been like advertising stretch limos in a council housing area. In case you fall more into the second group of modern-minded pragmatists than aligning yourself with the crustaceans like myself, I'd like to make a recommendation - it doesn't specifically raise all the issues I've instanced, but it's a very comprehensive modern take on model engineering practice, and covers topics other than milling and lathe work at a level suitable to the newcomer who needs a limited but fundamental grasp on many fronts. It's "Model Engineering: A Foundation Course" by Peter Wright, reviewed by ordinary users at: http://www.amazon.co.uk/review/product/1854861522/ref=dp_top_cm_cr_acr _txt/203-7467174-7823919?%5Fencoding=UTF8&showViewpoints=1 Usual disclaimers apply: I don't even own a copy, but borrowed it from the library, and found it to be a superb reference for a newcomer to the field. ------- Re: model engineering books Posted by: "Ian Newman" ian_newx~xxyahoo.com Date: Mon Sep 1, 2008 4:18 am ((PDT)) Hi, Adding to the titles you have already been posted, I think that "The Model Engineer's Handbook" by Tubal Cain is essential. Full of useful information, data, theory, explanations, etc. covering all aspects of model engineering. I first started using a metal turning lathe in 1969 and I still make frequent references to the above book. (I'm on my second copy - the first one eventually fell to bits through wear and tear.) Ian ------- Re: model engineering books Posted by: "iainlockerbie" iain.lockerbiex~xxbtinternet.com Date: Mon Sep 1, 2008 4:55 am ((PDT)) I've just bought a few of these. Cheapest place I found was Amazon - the Bradley and Sparey books were from memory just over a fiver each. I would echo comments made by others that the Sparey's book is an excellent read, although it was written in the late forties, it does show you what you can do with a capable home lathe like an ML7 or a Super 7. It is true though that things have moved on a bit and I would echo the comment that it will probably be a lot cheaper to buy some of the tooling and accessories you might want rather than make them. Certainly in my case as my skills are a bit limited, and my lathe is no longer as accurate as it was when it left the factory! ------- Re: model engineering books Posted by: "furkaoberalp" a.websterx~xxsympatico.ca Date: Mon Sep 1, 2008 8:21 am ((PDT)) Um, yes, I suggested five books not one. The best all-round manual for model engineers is indeed Pete Wright's Foundation Course. I have it but it does cover all tools, techniques, and materials and so the lathe and mill treatment is sound but minimal. Probably the best choice if you are new to model engineering in general. No Myford owner should be without the Sparey lathe book. Probably we'd all agree there. It's the one I started with and Sparely wrote for the ML7 owner. The Bradley Myford ML7 manual has just appeared after 30 years out of print, and it is stuffed with Myford-specific lathe info. Both are small and easily hidden in the sink cabinet, in case an Ikea magazine rack is out of the question. BTW - For those wondering, I am uncharacteristically scurrying frenetically about in the wood-chippings of my cage because my wife has me machining a steel goldsmith's mandrel from a 2.5" diameter high- chrome rod. When this is done she can no longer complain that the lathe is bloody useless and we should have rebuilt the bath instead! There is a lesson in this somewhere, I think... aw ------- model engineering books Posted by: "c j.s" callinicus1953x~xxyahoo.co.uk Date: Wed Sep 3, 2008 12:33 pm ((PDT)) Hi David, If one wants a book on model engineering (more correctly light engineering, perhaps) George Thomas's "MODEL ENGINEERS WORKSHOP MANUAL" is hard to beat, especially if one owns a Myford. There is something to be said for bound volumes of "Model Engineer" magazine, if you can't afford bound, loose will do. Aim for the forties on, this is a time when things were in short supply in the UK, so you had to "make do and mend". Now things are much easier to buy but the philosophy still holds. Writers like Duplex make you realise that even the most 'compicated' items can be made by amateurs. Such things as pressure regulators for spraying are small potatoes to their readers. These days there is no way you would build you own refrigerator but reading ME of the period. you realise you could. Lesson to be learnt; anything is possible, well almost, so don't be phased by, say, a 5" loco and its valve gear. If all you do is buy things for a lathe, what is the point in owning one? (written with a smile) Stepping off soap-box now. CJS ------- Fantastic info resource for home shop metalwork [MyMyford] Posted by: "tr0up" a.troupx~xxemail.com Date: Wed Nov 5, 2008 7:29 pm ((PST)) http://www.homemetalshopclub.org/news/article_index.htm I came across this quite by accident. It's amazing how much good stuff one can stumble across... Best I've seen -- check out the tip for maintaining position over a hole when the need arises to crank the head up or down on a round- column mill-drill: http://www.homemetalshopclub.org/news/aug02/aug02.html#maintaining Another which caught my eye was something I have also done, either for using drills whose taper shank is larger than the tailstock will accept, or when the taper is correct, as a precaution, when I'm concerned that the torque (especially if the drill grabs on breaking through) might spin the drill shank in the barrel (NOT recommended): http://www.homemetalshopclub.org/news/oct04/oct04.html#taper I'm going to take a break from regular visits to this and other metalworking sites for a while -- getting a bit behind on a few projects ... Hasta luego, todos mis amigos ! ------- NEMES download info source [Metal_Shapers] Posted by: "harryg862" hg4570x~xxsbcglobal.net Date: Fri Jan 16, 2009 1:04 am ((PST)) Maybe this is "old news" to some, but it isn't to me, so here goes... I was looking thru some old threads here, and ran across mention of a CD from Errol Groff that contained pages from old shaper books that are getting hard to find. The CD was mentioned in the NEMES newsletter, so I e-mailed Errol about buying a copy. He responded that I should "hang onto my $$$" because all the info from the CD is now on the NEMES website for download here: http://neme-s.org/Shaper%20Books/shaper_book_page.htm As Errol said, "...there's a lot more info there too, and it represents a TON of scanning". Enjoy! Harry ------- Atlas Manual Of Lathe Operations [atlas_craftsman] Posted by: "BERNARD POKORSKI" calchuckx~xxprodigy.net Date: Mon Feb 9, 2009 6:47 am ((PST)) Hi: Regarding the Atlas Manual Of Lathe Operations, I have two different original editions of it here at the house. There is a 38-year span between the copyright dates of the two editions. One edition has black cover on it, and and the it's backside of its title page, it reads: Copyright 1937 Atlas Press Company Printed in U.S.A. Price One Dollar in U.S.A. The other edition has a gray cover, and the backside of its title page reads: Twenty-Ninth Edition Copyrighted ATLAS PRESS COMPANY Printed in U.S.A. Reprinted 1938, 1939, 1940, 1941, 1942, 1943, 1944, 1945, 1946, 1947, 1948, 1949, 1950, 1951, 1952, 1954, 1955, 1957, 1960, 1961, 1963, 1965, 1967, 1968, 1970, 1971, 1973, 1974, 1975. The photos of the lathes in these two books differ, along with the individual page layouts. The first edition (1937) has some photos that the 1975 edition doesn't and that's likewise with the 1975 version. The 1975 version is better for my 1950's Atlas/Craftsman 12 x36 lathe (101.07403), as it covers the QCGB (quick-change gear box) that came with my lathe. The information in the two books also differs to an extent. The 1937 edition has 238 pages, while the 1975 edition has 249 pages. Regards, Bernie....A Little Bit South of Grass Valley, CA 'Son of a Singer Man' http://community.webshots.com/user/sonofasingerman ------- Re: Atlas Manual Of Lathe Operations Posted by: "BERNARD POKORSKI" calchuckx~xxprodigy.net Date: Tue Feb 10, 2009 7:14 am ((PST)) Hi, Mike asked: "Other than the QCGB is there anything thats changed signifigantly, or more specifically, is there a reason one would want the older version other than historical reasons." Although I haven't actually sat down and compared the two manuals page for page, I don't really see anything that different between the two manuals. I just happened to buy a used first edition (1937) of the manual before I knew any better...Live and learn! Once I realized that the manual didn't contain any information about the QCGB, I located and bought the later 1975 version, which did. Regards, Bernie....A Little Bit South of Grass Valley, CA 'Son of a Singer Man' http://community.webshots.com/user/sonofasingerman ------- Re: Centering the mill spindle [sherline] Posted by: "a3sigma" dcclark111x~xxcomcast.net Date: Sun Feb 15, 2009 5:01 pm ((PST)) "DW Holtman" wrote: > Hamilton, > Thank you for taking the time to respond. I already read that. All it says is, "is by indicating the hole in the rotary table". I'm kind of new and I think it means using a DTI? I have a Starrett Last Word indicator I picked up on Ebay. The way I have been mounting it in the spindle for aligning the milling vise etc it is not centered in line with the spindle. Doesn't it need to be in line with the spindle? < DW, Watch this video beginning at the 43 minute mark to see how it's done. http://techtv.mit.edu/videos/84-machine-shop-5 Then start at the beginning of the series: http://techtv.mit.edu/videos/142-machine-shop-1 and watch all 10 of them all the way through. You will get a very good, comprehensive, 8 hour machining course. DC David Clark in Southern Maryland, USA ------- NOTE TO FILE: The above address at M.I.T. does indeed provide a very good introduction to using the common machines and accessories found in a metalworking machine shop. Some information is basic but there are other machining tips and safety procedures that I have never seen in the many books I have. And watching a procedure versus reading about it is always instructive. Free and worth watching. ------- Navy book [atlas_craftsman] Posted by: "nynjjoex~xxaol.com" Date: Mon Feb 23, 2009 11:01 am ((PST)) Recently there was a posting about the Navy Machine Repairman Manual. These type of manuals are usually quite comprehensive and informative. A check of Alibris, Amazon, Powells and Abe books showed no results. Only Amazon had it on cd and they wanted you to purchase the "Kindle" reader. Still, I'd like to have the hard copy right on my bench for reference. I'll continue looking. Does anyone have any other sources? Many thanks for all the great information, tips, and ideas that have come across this great group. Best wishes, nynjjoe ------- Re: Navy book Posted by: "mondosmetals" jwreyx~xxusa.net Date: Mon Feb 23, 2009 12:33 pm ((PST)) I do not know of any source distributing copies in print; you may find one at a used bookstore. But... You can download the whole 1993 edition of the manual as one big fat 15MB pdf at: http://www.metalwebnews.org/ftp/machinery-repairman.pdf [NOTE TO FILE: SEE NEXT MESSAGE FOR A BETTER VERSION WITH ALL PICTURES.] Make up a notebook by selecting and printing only those pages you want close to the machine and putting them into a binder. You can always print and add more as you go. Be aware that some of the illustrations are not included as they were deemed unfit for public consumption in electronic form by the Department of the Navy. raymond ------- Re: Navy book Posted by: "Starlight Tool Services Ltd" starlight_toolsx~xxtelus.net Date: Wed Feb 25, 2009 5:39 pm ((PST)) Link to Document: http://www.scribd.com/doc/7827348/US-Navy-Course-NAVEDTRA-1416114162-Mac hinery-Repairman Title: "US Navy Course NAVEDTRA 14161_14162 - Machinery Repairman" Ok guys here is the link to the Navy Repaiman Manual with all the pictures. It is a large file so be prepared. You will have to be a member of Scribd but that is free and easy to do. I downloaded, printed and used the plastic sleeves for a binder. I did not find any pictures in there that could have been considered "not Applicable for public consumption" Walter ------- NOTE TO FILE: The following messages were from a conversation about making gears, but the video source has useful videos on many other aspects of machining. Should be much cheaper than buying videos. ------- Re: GEAR CUTTERS [LittleEngines] Posted by: "Rupert" rwenig2x~xxxplornet.com Date: Wed Feb 25, 2009 2:49 pm ((PST)) John wrote: > There is a pretty good CD from Smart Flix that you can rent for 9.99 > that explains the terms used in gear making. It also shows how to make > a hob, that replaces those involute cutters. And for those that don't know, Smart Flix will rent videos across the line into Canada too. I haven't rented a video from them yet that I didn't think I got my money's worth from. I haven't found a Canadian movie rental place that carries instructional videos of the same caliber. Rupert Rupert Wenig Camrose, Alberta, Canada. http://users.xplornet.com/~rwenig/Home/ ------- Re: GEAR CUTTERS Posted by: "Rupert" rwenig2x~xxxplornet.com Date: Wed Feb 25, 2009 6:34 pm ((PST)) Ken Strauss wrote: > How do they ship to Canada? What are the "handling charges", duty and > taxes? Hello Ken: There is a good explanation on how it works at There are no customs charges, duty or GST. Unfortunately, we Canucks are stuck with paying the return postage unless we live close enough to the border to return post the video on the US side. I've been more than happy with the metalworking videos I have rented. Rupert ------- Re: GEAR CUTTERS Posted by: "Rupert" rwenig2x~xxxplornet.com Date: Wed Feb 25, 2009 7:55 pm ((PST)) Ken Strauss wrote: > Yes, I read "NOTE: shipments to Canada do not include return postage; > Canadian customers are responsible for affixing all required postage for > return shipment." However, it says nothing about how the item gets here > and if any customs charges apply. If it is shipped via USPS then there > is normally a $5 handling fee by the post office plus GST+PST. Have > you used the service from Canada? Hello Ken, Sorry. I misunderstood. The item comes in via priority international mail. There are no customs charges on orders under #20CAD. I understand the amount before charges are charged has risen to $40 but haven't tested that yet. That means no GST and no post office handling fee for orders under those amounts. I can't speak for PST as I live in Alberta where there is no PST. I usually pay the return postage as priority mail too as I get a tracer number that way. You may get a message from Smart flix asking about the where abouts of the DVD shortly after you get it. I believe this message is a standard message sent out by computer if the disk isn't back by a certain date. I didn't have any problems keeping the disk for the week as I kept them posted as to its whereabouts. Hope that answers your question better. Rupert ------- Re: Machinery's Handbook [atlas_craftsman] Posted by: "Wayne" outlawmwsx~xxyahoo.com Date: Wed Mar 25, 2009 11:12 am ((PDT)) In atlas_craftsmanx~xxyahoogroups.com, Kirk Hillman wrote: >Being a fan of old texts and vintage books puts a person in a bit of a >puzzle. Opinions have been expressed that favour buying an old or >vintage version of Machinery's Handbook because there may be content >which is now omitted in new versions. One would certainly lose all CNC >info in the older editions. Does someone have first-and knowledge about >the pros and cons either way? In spite of the allure of a vintage book, >the new copy with CD is appealing just for the ability to search rapidly. >Comments, opinions? Cheers, Kirk I have four copies of MHB (not counting the duplicate 20th version I gave my son), and will buy any copy I see if cheap enough. My first one was the 19th edition bought new for my work as a designer. I bought a second hand copy of the 14th so I had one at home. I have since added a 16th and a 20th. None have the CNC data, and as was mentioned earlier, I don't miss it since any CNC work is long behind me (16 years behind) and that was all done as a design engineer making models for the CNC machinists and programmers to use. The older copies have about anything you might conceive of, and also have material that is no longer covered. If you feel you need the CNC info, buy a new one, then watch for an old copy at used book stores, yard sales and flea markets. Having older information when dealing with old machinery can be handy. Outlaw ------- Re: Machinery's Handbook Posted by: "Raymond Jerome" mondosmetalsx~xxyahoo.com Date: Wed Mar 25, 2009 6:54 pm ((PDT)) I have a new 28th ed with CD. I can search the hard-copy index faster than the computer (1.7 GHz processor with half a gig of memory) can search the CD, even after loading the entire contents of the CD onto the hard drive! I have no idea what I am missing (of old references) by having the most recent edition. But I do have a 1932 edition of (Lionel S.) Mark's Handbook which is loaded with machinery information. It contains many standards in use today that have not changed. raymond ------- Re: Machinery's Handbook Posted by: "catboat15x~xxaol.com" Date: Fri Mar 27, 2009 10:00 pm ((PDT)) I purchased a "Marks Handbook for Mechanical Engineers" when in college and switched my major from E.E. to M.E. (I was working as a Mechanical Engineer so thought it might be wise to change my major, and found I needed to take three more units of American History as a M.E. major. Never did figure that one out.) Anyway long after that my wife led me into an antique store that she was browsing around. I noticed on one piece of old broken down furniture there was a book (Placed there for effect) that was part of a set of encyclopedias of mechanical engineering. The title page said published in 1912. I asked the lady who ran the store if they had any more volumes and she went into the back room and found all twelve volumes. Full of information about old time machine shop practice as well as locomotives, ships, building construction etc. A real treasure trove of information on lathe tools (carbon steel of course) methods and techniques. Most of the stuff on milling is for horizontal mills though. Fun to just leaf through, but good for looking speeds and feed and how to grind that special tool you need for a job. Apparently it was part of a course in Mechanical Engineering from a correspondence school of that time. That set of books was a double prize for me. Not only did I get a great reference for basic machining, but also my wife never dragged me into another antique store again. John Meacham Littlerock, California 12 inch Atlas lathe, Mini-mill, band saw and a rusty file. ------- Re: Machinery's Handbook Posted by: "Michael Fagan" woodworker88x~xxgmail.com Date: Fri Mar 27, 2009 11:25 pm ((PDT)) My 14th edition includes information about sizing leather flat belts and matching pullies, which was very helpful for restoring my 1887 Barnes and 1918 Wade lathes, both of which use flat belts. It also includes information on some more unusual fasteners and nonstandard threads, both of which are common on old machinery. Finally, many of the cutting speed and feed charts are designed for carbon steel and HSS tooling, which is more appropriate for much of the work we do. ------- Tool changer update [SherlineCNC] Posted by: "Fred Smith" imservx~xxvectorcam.com Date: Fri Apr 3, 2009 6:27 am ((PDT)) We released a video of our tool changer project last summer. After a lot of development and testing, it is now complete. I have a couple more recent videos that show PCB trace isolation milling, and enclosure panel engraving, done with a Sherline spindle. PCB: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U755sLfnxUw Engraving: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vemv24jdxo4 This one may be of interest to some group members. It shows automatic tool length measurment of all the tools in the rack. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RBz_HQ6vcT8 Info about the toolchanger is at this link: http://www.cadcamcadcam.com/toolchangesystem.aspx Fred Smith - IMService http://www.imsrv.com ------- "New" shaper [Metal_Shapers] Posted by: "Don Kinzer" dkinzerx~xxeasystreet.net Date: Sat May 2, 2009 2:27 pm ((PDT)) Kirk Hillman wrote: > Has anyone come across a proper manual for the SB 7" shaper? I have PDFs of manuals for several shapers on my site (link below) including a U.S. Army manual for the SB7. http://www.kinzers.com/don/MachineTools/techman or http://tinyurl.com/c9axny Don Kinzer NOTE TO FILE ===> Quoting from Don's page there: "Machine Tool Manuals I have collected scans of machine tool manuals from various places around the web or, in some cases, scanned them myself. The numbers to the right indicate the approximate size of the file. Most of the scans are contained in PDF files. Burke #4 Horizontal Mill (Army Manual) 220K Sheldon #0 Horizontal Mill (newer version) 1.7M Sheldon/Vernon #0 Horizontal Mill 1.6M AMMCO/Delta/Rockwell 7" Shaper 1.1M Sheldon 12" Shaper 2.4M Atlas 7B Shaper 800K South Bend 7" Shaper (Army manual) 700K Shape-Rite 8" Shaper 26M Logan 8" Shaper 1.6M Logan 8" Shaper (individual hi-res page images) 35M Manuals and other information for the Ellis dividing head may be found here." ------- NOTE TO FILE: Project Gutenberg is placing many out-of-copyright books online for free downloading. The main site is: http://www.gutenberg.org/wiki/Main_Page I have not found many metal working texts there using the search feature, but more will come with time. In the meanwhile, here is a neat book about old woodworking tools: http://www.gutenberg.org/files/27238/27238-h/27238-h.htm ------- Help for newbies in this post, video links. [MyMyford] Posted by: "aboard_epsilon" aboard_epsilonx~xxyahoo.com Date: Mon Sep 21, 2009 4:16 am ((PDT)) No drivel here, just good honest free video links. Watch this lot and the "know your lathe book" will be forgotten. MIT Full Machine Shop Beginners/advanced Course free to watch streaming machine shop course..many hours from the MIT USA http://techtv.mit.edu/collections/ehs-videos/videos Basic Beginners Course on Machining 4 vids on the basics of machining, free to watch from Harvey Mudd College USA http://www.eng.hmc.edu/E8/Videos.htm Virtual Machine Shop Massive resource of machining related tutorials http://www.jjjtrain.com/vms/library.html How to run a lathe videos based on south bends by south bend 1940s..rating excellent...click and save (do not stream) ...they are quick time videos http://www.wswells.com/video/index.html all the best markj ------- NOTE TO FILE: There comes a point in time when every intelligent person must consider when enough is enough. In computer software, the manufacturers bring out annual upgrades with a few new "must have" features that you probably really do not need. If your present software is comfortable to use and does well what you really need, then save yourself a few (many?) bucks and do not upgrade each time the program is changed. (Chances are you will buy an updated version someday, probably after several upgrades in the interim that individually you did not need and did not waste money on.) The next message talks about one person's decision to not renew a wood- working magazine. His thought process is just a valid for a metalworking magazine, or any hobby's magazine. Personally I have found that the first two dozen magazines from any publisher contain great tips and ideas and projects and motivation. But eventually most editors fall into a repetitive formula of rehashing old articles and similar projects. If the magazine arrives and you find yourself quickly flipping through it and finding nothing really new, chances are you are becoming disappointed with this publication. Perhaps you read a few articles only because you already spent the money on the subscription and don't want to feel your money was wasted. Perhaps you feel an obligation to continue the subscription because you have a complete set, from #1. Are you a collector or a user? I'll bet you will get more pleasure out of such a magazine by cancelling the subscription and re-reading your pile of earlier issues. Lots of tips there you have already forgotten. Also a few neat projects you never got around to. ------- Date: Thu, 8 Oct 2009 22:29:22 +0000 From: Moshe Eshel Subject: Re: [OldTools] WW Mags On Mon, Oct 5, 2009, Ron Harper wrote: > Bought two yesterday and will not name them, but they had nothing new to me in them that I found of interest. To be fair, probably not the fault of the publication. If you are a woodworker who prefers hand tools and you stay around for a while. You will eventually exhaust the "WW ing" editors' ability to produce new stuff. I mean there are only so many ways to cut a mortise and tenon joint by hand, or to hone a scraper. Fortunately I have boxes full of old Mags. < I came to realize a few months ago that finding something new in a magazine is a rare find and is to be cherished (although it will probably be found on the net way before the publication), also found out that not everything written in magazines is correct or good practice (no names). So I decided not to renew any of the magazines I currently subscribe to -- I love glossy pictures, but the little bits of knowledge gained are not worth the money -- and most certainly reading is no substitute for skill and practice.... So I will try and spend my spare time and money on my shop and projects in it, instead of on paper... Moshe ------- NOTE TO FILE: 31 Oct 2009. There are a couple of British magazines dedicated to the metalworking hobby. Model Engineer is well over a hundred years old and concentrates on how-to articles about making steam engines and clocks and the like. Model Engineers Workshop is more recent and concentrates on home workshop metalworking tools and techniques. Just a couple of months ago the publisher finally joined the computer age and got up a website: http://www.model-engineer.co.uk/?source=23&utm_source=NSL0049&utm_me dium=NSL0049&utm_campaign=NSL0049 Some parts of the website are available to any viewer. Some parts like forums require free registration in order to post messages, but you can read the forums without subscribing. Some site content like the current copy of the news-stand magazines (including all prior copies for 3 years back) requires you to be a paid-up subscriber to the particular magazine. Recently, the Editor added some free (to any site visitor) magazines that are long extinct. Online right now are the first issues of an old British magazine called Model Mechanics. More issues will be scanned and become available. See: http://www.model-engineer.co.uk/news/article.asp?a=5462 Other orphaned pubs will be added later. The site is busy and in England, so the PDF's take a few minutes each to download. The magazines are kinda nostalgic to skim, both for the articles and the now old-fashioned ads. But there are many excellent projects and how-to articles. ------- NOTE TO FILE: There are a lot of online books free for download from the following site: http://www.evenfallstudios.com/woodworks_library/woodworks_library.html Books there are on wood and metal working and other crafts. Well worth visiting and bookmarking. ------- centring tip [MyMyford] Posted by: "sardinesarnie" sardinesarniex~xxyahoo.com Date: Sat Nov 21, 2009 1:59 pm ((PST)) Hello all. I came across this youtube tip on centering a component in the lathe. Copy and paste the link to your browser bar: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tn7A9PqNftY Simple to make the required tool, and seems to work very well. Thanks to popnstart for posting the video. ------- NOTE TO FILE: The following message is not actually strictly about metal publications, but rather improving the search engine tools you use to find metal stuff (or other stuff) on the internet. I used to use only Google, but it has recently gotten ridiculous -- it now gives you more hits on any search term you enter, but many of the hits are useless, unrelated to what you are searching. For example, if you want to look for information on the Myford brand lathe, the results include thousands of wrong hits about Ford cars. So I have added several search engines to my Browser that provide much tighter results for my searches. Bing is from Microsoft but is far (far!) better than one might expect from that company. See: http://www.bing.com/ Then there is Delicious, which provides results based on the number of persons out there that have bookmarked a site. In effect, it gives the most popular sites featuring the search terms. See: http://delicious.com/ And now thanks to this conversation, I have added the search engine Startpage from Ixquick: http://www.startpage.com/ which does not track your browsing habits to feed you ad results, and also indicates site popularity. ------- [shopbuilttools Yahoo group] Something to get through the Ho-Ho-Holidays Posted by: "Paul" pfrederick1x~xxyahoo.com pfrederick1 Date: Thu Dec 24, 2009 1:46 pm ((PST)) In shopbuilttoolsx~xxyahoogroups.com, "Tom Jones" wrote: > Paul, if you use ixquick and set it up for the advanced mode, it will always display in the advanced mode and allow you to search with the strings of words you wish to use without worrying about quotes or plus and minus this or that, which saves you time, but better than that it searches all the major search engines on the internet and gives you a rating of how many other search engines rate what you are searching for. You get to and find what you are looking for much faster. It is the best search engine I have found and I have been using it for many years and also setting up all my computer customers to use it. When the internet first came online I was a tester for Alta Vista, which I believe was the first ever search engine site and is still out there, but the name never caught on like Yahoo and Goggle, so lost its popular appeal. Web sites are indexed many ways and web site designers try to design a site to be findable and the criteria of each search engine can be different and site designers can somewhat cheat while doing a site and get you to their site by using false info either in the content or in the meta words. It is all about hits to the website owner and making the site stickie and fast. < I've added Ixquick to my browsers personal toolbar and have been trying it out lately. I have found that quite often the very best links come from groups like this one. People who've already sifted through all of the nonsense, or have just stumbled across something worthwhile. And on that note and because it's the season of giving, I'll toss up a few links I like in no particular order: http://www.owwm.com/ http://www.theworkshop.ca/index.htm http://www.gadgetbuilder.com/DrillSharp.html http://www.vintageprojects.com/machine-power-tools.html http://blog.modernmechanix.com/category/diy/ Hopefully some fun stuff there for all to browse through while sipping on some eggnog. Merry Christmas! P.S. I hope others add to this list so we're all adequately entertained this time of year. Paul ------- NOTE TO FILE: Check out the videos on the Glacern Machine Tools site: http://glacern.com/ They have some introductory milling videos free online that are an excellent introduction to machine tool terminology and what cool stuff is available industrially. The videos will also be useful: a. to show a spouse what machine tools can do; b. to help your argument that YOUR hobby tools are downright cheap, and she should be grateful that you are so frugal with your purchases ;-) ------- Re: 101-07403 guards and paint color? [atlas_craftsman] Posted by: "mf205i" mf205ix~xxyahoo.com Date: Fri Jan 1, 2010 10:35 pm ((PST)) It seems that Sears stopped using blue paint on Craftsman tools in 1940. BTH the end gear cover is probable off a ten-inch model, not your twelve. The spindle should align with the hole in the cover. If you are new to this and you would like to get a good start, check out these. http://www.bbssystem.com/manuals/Lathe-Tutorial.pdf http://metalwebnews.com/machine-tools/fmt.html See HTRAL at http://www.wswells.com/index.html http://www.jjjtrain.com/vms/library.html https://atiam.train.army.mil/soldierPortal/appmanager/soldier/start?_nfp\ b=true&_pageLabel=rdlservicespage http://opensourcemachine.org/node/10 http://www.metalwebnews.org/ftp/machinery-repairman.pdf http://www.americanmachinetools.com/...se_a_lathe.htm http://www.sherline.com/grinding.htm And don't forget to download your FREE copy of Machinery's handbook, Edition 5, at Google books. http://books.google.com/books?id=VkEYAAAAYAAJ And then, the mother load of machining information, the 27th edition of the Machinery's Handbook at Scribd, http://www.scribd.com/ Join and download, its also FREE! ------- Date: Mon, 4 Jan 2010 17:52:17 -0500 From: "S or J" Subject: [OldTools] Re: Percy Blandford "Steve Lineback" wrote: >Am I the only one who buys anything by this guy whenever I see one in >a used book store? I just found my fourth one "The Woodturners Bible" >and it appears to be as easy to understand as the first three. What I >really like is the ease of understanding. Very seldom do I have to >stop and think (a d#$n good thing)about what he's trying to say. I >will say though that his "Illustrated Handbook of Woodworking" joints >has a few I have never seen or heard of before. < Hi Steve, You have had the luck of finding Percy's stuff in used book stores. Personally, I've only been able to read some of his books at the local library. Another of his books in our library details bookbinding. It is typical of his books in that there are detailed drawngs and/or photos as appropriate for how to make and use special tools or jigs. A check today of Amazon and Alibris or other online book stores indicates literally dozens of titles by this prolific author. Besides several on woodworking, there are others on blacksmithing and country tools. Most such are relevant to this group's members' interests. And none are trivial. Yes I'm a fan. Your reminder prompted me to order several online today. Curses....another slippery slope. regards Steve Bachanek -- in Thunder Bay, Ontario, Canada Machining and Metalworking at Home http://www.janellestudio.com/metal/ ------- Date: Mon, 4 Jan 2010 20:22:03 EST From: pleenhoutsx~xxaol.com Subject: [OldTools] Re: Percy Blandford Saw an interview with Percy Blandford several years ago in which he said he's written over 99 books...his first being a book on netmaking, as I recall. He wasn't sure exactly how many he'd written, as he'd lost count for a while in the 20's and 30's. Pete Port Ludlow WA ------- Re: book [atlas_craftsman] Posted by: "fegenbushx~xxnetzero.com" Date: Sun Jan 10, 2010 6:27 am ((PST)) Here are a couple links I have found that should be very beneficial, especially to the beginner. This guy on youtube gives great tips on techniques, including grinding of HSS tool bits for different purposes: http://www.youtube.com/user/mrpete222#p/u/1/QADD2XQFDds This site has some basic info in the learning library: http://www.kanabco.com/vms/index.html ------- Re: book Posted by: "n9gtm" jim.n9gtmx~xxgmail.com Date: Tue Jan 12, 2010 9:36 pm ((PST)) william boswell wrote: > I was talking about anything dealing with the lathe. There's tons of freebies on the web for that. Mike's list is an excellent start. In fact, he mentioned so much stuff I'm not even going to cull my list to remove duplicates (too lazy). Since you asked your question in an Atlas/Craftsman forum, and already have an Atlas/Craftsman lathe, I'm going to emphasize those machines. There's a wealth of stuff at lathes.co.uk, check: http://www.lathes.co.uk/latheparts/ http://www.lathes.co.uk/atlas http://www.lathes.co.uk/atlas6inch/ http://www.lathes.co.uk/craftsman http://www.lathes.co.uk/page2.html http://www.lathes.co.uk/page13.html http://www.lathes.co.uk/page27.html http://www.lathes.co.uk/books.htm http://www.atlas-press.com/servicebulletins.htm#6%22%20Lathe%20Bulletins http://www.clausing-industrial.com/service-std.htm http://clausingsc.com/sc-home.htm Tons of text files which are extracts of posted messages from various forums: http://www.janellestudio.com/metal/#metallathes Forums: Don't believe for one instant that all the good content is only in the Messages section - check Files and Links, too. If you're new to Yahoo forums, you'll quickly learn to hate the Yahoo message archive search function. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/atlas618lathe/ http://groups.yahoo.com/group/atlas_craftsman/ http://groups.yahoo.com/group/atlas_craftsman_pics/ http://groups.yahoo.com/group/atlas_craftsman_projects/ http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AA_109_Lathe_Users_Group/ http://www.machinistweb.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?s=25f8 1f837a4d0b0ae7709f4339b33bcd&f=6 Little Machine Shop http://littlemachineshop.com/Reference/reference.php http://littlemachineshop.com/Info/getting_started.php http://littlemachineshop.com/Products/products.php Lathe comparison: http://www.annisquamgranite.com/lathecomparo.htm http://littlemachineshop.com/Info/minilathe_compare.php Not strictly Atlas/Craftsman, but worth a visit: http://www.finelinehair.com/home/ http://www.finelinehair.com/home/Manuals%20Tables%20&%20Schematics.htm http://www.finelinehair.com/home/Table%20of%20Contents.htm http://www.mini-lathe.com/ http://www.metalwebnews.com/ http://www.metalwebnews.com/ed.html http://www.mermac.com/advicenew.html http://warhammer.mcc.virginia.edu/ty/7x10/machining_reference_info.html Sadly, this guy's Javascript-based navigation makes the site significantly less valuable (to me) than it would be without it. Check the Getting Started articles, then poke around a little. http://www.thms.tedatum.com/ Metrology - if you've got a lathe, you'll need to measure. Strong opinions from Long Island, NY: http://longislandindicator.com/ Metallurgy - know your materials: http://home.sprynet.com/~monel/metallurgy_faq_v11.htm http://www.materialsengineer.com/A-Metallurgy.htm http://www.onlinemetals.com/productguide.cfm http://www.metalwebnews.org/ftp/metals-for-craftsmen.pdf Clubs: http://www.neme-s.org/ http://www.homemetalshopclub.org/index.html Ooh, aah: http://gadgetbuilder.com/ http://homepage3.nifty.com/amigos/index-e.html http://www.americanmachinetools.com/how_to_use_a_lathe.htm Hope that helps. Jim ------- Re: book Posted by: "n9gtm" jim.n9gtmx~xxgmail.com Date: Tue Jan 12, 2010 10:10 pm ((PST)) Rexarino wrote: > Perhaps this is the intended link > That seems very likely, thanks. It looks remarkably like the Army TC 9-524 Chapter 7 material, although it does not seem to suffer from the last page or two of HTML formatting weirdness in the two links I posted before for it: http://www.metalwebnews.com/machine-tools/fmt.html http://es.machinetoolhelp.com/Learn/armymachinetool/fundamentalcnc.html There's also a 7.1MB PDF floating around "out there" but I neglected to save the URL where I got it from. Oh well, I like the scans from the single-chapter PDFs better. They seem to be crisper and easier to read. Thanks again. I like the one you posted best of all the ones I've seen. The hosting server sometimes goes to sleep for awhile, but it does play real good for free. Jim ------- NOTE TO FILE: Another metalworking forum site with many free machine manuals and how-to books and other good information can be found at: http://bbssystem.com/ ------- NOTE TO FILE: SCRAPING. The subject of reconditioning a lathe or other machine comes up periodically. My curiosity on the subject led to viewing several excellent YouTube videos showing the processes in detail. These particular free videos are all by the same machinist, MuellerNick. I am providing the links here in a sequential order, because they were scattered about YouTube and kinda tedious to sort out. Saves you the trouble. Will take about an hour to watch. The first set of seven videos deals with a major overhaul of a Myford manual cylindrical grinder, which includes a variety of flat sliding surfaces to be scraped as well as an internal round bearing surface. The machinist uses a motorized BIAX BL40 scraper for some parts of the work, and some simple manual scrapers for other parts of the project. Scraping in a Myford MG12-M part 1 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=90KpLbyvlPk&feature=related Scraping in a Myford MG12-M part 2 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O-R0c-Xa8mA&feature=related Scraping in a Myford MG12-M part 3 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IovsVVNu6vY&feature=related Scraping in a Myford MG12-M part 4 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-g0Ie1l_nfs&feature=related Scraping in a Myford MG12-M part 5 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pVB3WuxrAG0&feature=channel Scraping in a Myford MG12-M part 6 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t7m2lkkpcnA&feature=channel Scraping in a Myford MG12-M part 7 (the end) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iJd8Zwd9L1k&feature=channel And some general subjects: Hand scraping: preparing the plate http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8kWbIxB4z3s&feature=related Hand scraping: sharpening http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uIvxXMDeCIc&NR=1 Scraping in a lathe's bed http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uHF7TtHVSWE&feature=channel The (unmastered) art of flaking http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7yeqSjT7UBE&NR=1 Provides a pretty detailed demonstration. Usual disclaimer. regards Steve -- in Thunder Bay, Ontario, Canada Machining and Metalworking at Home http://www.janellestudio.com/metal/ ------- Re: Time for the thinking toque [atlas_craftsman] Posted by: "n9gtm" jim.n9gtmx~xxgmail.com Date: Tue Feb 2, 2010 8:42 pm ((PST)) wheezer wrote: > A new machinist group in Mexico is looking for PRACTICAL > projects to work on as they develop their lathe / mill skills. What's not to love about Junk Yard Projects? http://www.green-trust.org/junkyardprojects/FreeHomeWorkshopPlans.html Old-Time project ideas http://www.vintageprojects.com/ Bit of duplication from what you listed, but some new stuff like foundry work, powder coating, shop crane ... http://www.homemetalshopclub.org/projects/project.html Build your own music instruments & unusual tools http://frets.com/FRETSPages/pagelist.html Amateur Telescope Makers (maybe not so practical unless they consider their work production for sale/trade) http://www.atmsite.org/ Watch making (random site, LOTS of 'em out there), probably well-suited to Old World Craftsmanship products but slow startup/steep learning curve http://www.csparks.com/watchmaking/index.html I don't think you can mention junkyard without thinking about this weird, wonderful project http://groups.yahoo.com/group/multimachine/ Hope that helps; more if I think of anything else. Jim ------- NOTE TO FILE: This webpage (and a second webpage there) has a detailed Army manual on how to use a metal lathe. Well worth saving a copy. http://www.americanmachinetools.com/how_to_use_a_lathe.htm ------- Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2010 16:10:19 -0700 From: "Cliff Rohrabacher, Esq." Subject: [OldTools] Machinery handbook #28 Not an old tool exactly, but lots of old school knowledge http://www.industrialpress.com/ext/StaticPages/Handbook/MH28De mo/MH28/Handbook.pdf ------- Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 10:43:27 -0400 From: Nichael Cramer Subject: [OldTools] Wooden Books (publisher) GG: 1] In the discussion of proportional dividers there was some mention of rule and compass construction. Recently I picked up a really nice little book called "Ruler & Compass" by Andrew Sutton. Everyone has their favorite source on this topic and while this one is not that large, there were many cool items that I'd never seen before. Overall it is quite nice and I thought I'd mention it. In addition to most of the "expected" constructions, it also has sections on interesting topics such as "Rusty Compass" (constructions that be performed with a single, fixed Compass setting) and "Neusis" (this is the extension to the basic "rules of construction" --roughly "drawing a dot on the ruler" -- that allows you to do some things that you can't normally do within the normal rules, such as easily trisecting an angle, or taking cube roots. I had always heard these pseudo-constructions were possible, but I've never seen examples before.) And, to keep things on-topic, lots of cool layout techniques. 2] Beyond this, I liked the book itself. It's a compact hardcover (12$US) and is clearly part of a "cool little books" series. I had never heard the publisher, "Wooden Books" before, so while preparing this note I checked out their website and got another very pleasant surprise. http://www.woodenbooks.com/ In short, it appears that most of their books are browseable online at the link above. However: - Non-members have access, but apparently it is "time-limited" (but there seems to be enough time to do some useful looking around; I've not had any problems yet.) - If you're still using it, browsing doesn't seem to work very well in Netscape. - If you try browsing a book use the "page dots" across the top of the page (i.e. rather than the clicking on the image of the book to "get the next page".) So, as I say, for those interested in such things, it's well worth checking out. (Finally, in the context of the earlier discussion, there's also a nice book on "The Golden Section".) Enjoy, Nichael ------- Re: Grinder Tool Rest Question [sherline] Posted by: "Art Fish" 1art2fishx~xxcomcast.net Date: Sun Mar 28, 2010 8:04 pm ((PDT)) This link http://smartflix.com/store/video/58/Grinding-Lathe-Tools gives some good instruction on sharpening tools, also a nice little tool rest. I built this one and use it all the time; it's not hard and the instructions are pretty good. I drew lines on the base for the angles I needed for my tool bits -- makes setup for the different angles pretty fast. It is pretty slow moving video, 105 minutes long, will tend to put you to sleep, but the info is good. Just one more source for learning. There are a lot more videos on machining on Smartflix, some good, some bad, but most are worth the $7 rental. Art Fish Corvallis, OR USA Back in Time Clock Repair ------- [atlas_618lathe] Just uploaded Craftsman Installation and Operating Instructions PDF Posted by: "pdjohnson07" pdjohnson07x~xxyahoo.com Date: Thu Apr 1, 2010 11:15 am ((PDT)) Hey everyone, I just uploaded the Craftsman version of the Installation and Operating Instructions sheet for the Milling Attachment. It came with my lathe and I scanned it in case anyone wanted the Craftsman version. The file name is milling_attachment.pdf in the Files section. Enjoy! ------- Uploaded Craftsman Manual in PDF format [atlas618lathe] Posted by: "pdjohnson07" pdjohnson07x~xxyahoo.com Date: Fri Apr 2, 2010 12:05 pm ((PDT)) I didn't see one uploaded so I scanned mine and then added some pages from the scans that were already in the files section. I took most of the scans from my manual as the ones already uploaded are very large and would have created a large file. As it is, the PDF I uploaded was just under the limit. The manual is under the Craftsman Manual folder in the files section. File name is Full_Combine.pdf. ------- [atlas618lathe] Uploaded 3 and 4 Jaw chuck maintenance and mounting instructions... Posted by: "pdjohnson07" pdjohnson07x~xxyahoo.com Date: Fri Apr 2, 2010 12:05 pm ((PDT)) I know there is already a PDF in the files section but it did not include the maintenance instructions that are on the back side of the mounting instructions, at least it is that way for mine. Anyway, I thought that some of you might find it interesting. The file name is chuck.pdf and it is in the files section. ------- Re: Advice requested [atlas_craftsman] Posted by: "BRIAN GLACKIN" glackin.brianx~xxgmail.com Date: Thu Apr 22, 2010 5:32 am ((PDT)) http://wiki.owwm.com/ is a good resource on old Machine Restoration. It's aimed at woodworking machines, but many of the topics easily cross over. ------- Old Reading Materal [atlas_craftsman] Posted by: "metal2" bigmetalpaulx~xxyahoo.com Date: Sat May 15, 2010 8:48 am ((PDT)) For some of you like to read old lathe stuff. It may give you ideas too. Please check it out. I know it's not craftsman but the idea. http://www.wewilliams.net/SBLibrary.htm ty Paul ------- NOTE TO FILE: The link in the last message is for a site with a couple of dozen scanned documents featuring South Bend machinery, but there is lots of good info contained in these docs for the user of any brand. Many how-to manuals with detailed procedures for machining operations. ------- Re: What can this be? (And Atlas Lathe Manual) [atlas_craftsman] Posted by: "Mike Nicewonger" twmasterx~xxtwmaster.com Date: Thu May 27, 2010 7:46 pm ((PDT)) On May 27, 2010, at 3:56 PM, David Beierl wrote: > Check out the Hercus lathe -- South Bend clone made in Oz... > http://www.lathes.co.uk/hercus/ Thread convergence.... Speaking of Hercus. They, like other lathe manufacturers, produced books on how to use their machines. Hercus was one of these firms that wrote their own book. The Text Book of Turning by P. F. Hercus. I downloaded this book and instantly fell in love with it. Somehow they managed to explain a few concepts I had trouble grasping with simplicity and clarity that I immediately understood. A PDF of this great book can be downloaded by this direct link: http://www.bbssystem.com/manuals/Lathe-Tutorial.pdf Enjoy. Mike N ------- Information sheets [myfordlathes] Posted by: "hassydirekt" hassydirektx~xxyahoo.com.au hassydirekt Date: Wed Jul 28, 2010 6:44 pm ((PDT)) Hi all; Further to my post on Myford brochures I've also created a folder for 'Information sheets' to hold the various 1-pagers issued by Myford over the years. I've uploaded a couple of these to get it started and hopefully others will too, so that we can share this info around. I've also uploaded (into the relevant folders) some older brochures on the ML10, ML7 and Super 7 lathes, ditto. As per my earlier comments if this offends anyone or breaches the group's rules please (Moderator) delete thse files and let me know. Cheers Dave ------- Price lists [myfordlathes] Posted by: "hassydirekt" hassydirektx~xxyahoo.com.au hassydirekt Date: Wed Jul 28, 2010 8:55 pm ((PDT)) Hi all; Have uploaded some old (March 1970) price lists for the ML7, Super 7, ML10 and Ancillary equipment to the relevant folders in the Files area. While the prices are 'amusing' (Read 'em and weep!), the value of these is in the codes (part numbers) and descriptions. However space in the Files area is limited so if others (ie the Moderator) think these a waste of space then feel free to delete them. Also uploaded is a small brochure on the Quick setting lathe tools (in the 'Accessories' folder) which may be of interest. Cheers Dave ------- "Instructions" And the Manual of Lathe Operations... [atlas_craftsman] Posted by: "dougrl3" dougrl3x~xxaol.com Date: Tue Aug 3, 2010 7:01 am ((PDT)) In a recent post, the question of "instructions" and the printed editions of the Atlas Manual of Lathe Operation and Machinists Tables was brought up. Here are some of the answers to that: Sears sent a basic instruction sheet composed of about 6 pages on very basic set-up and operation as well as a parts list. Sears also sent a copy of the Atlas manual. Clausing sells the 33rd Edition of the manual, which was printed in 1988. The previous editions were published / re-printed in: 1937 - 1st edition Re-prints / editions: 1938 / 1938 / 1940 / 1941 / 1942 / 1943 / 1944 / 1945 / 1946 / 1947 / 1948 / 1949 / 1950 / 1951 / 1952 / 1954 / 1955 / 1957 / 1960 / 1961 / 1963 / 1965 / 1967 / 1968 / 1970 / 1971 / 1973 / 1974 / 1975 / 1978 / 1980 / 1981 / 1988 My lathe, a 12" 101.27440, was bought from Sears in May of 1952. The Timken bearings in the headstock are dated 1949. This lathe came with the 1937 edition of the manual. Even though the lathe came with the quick change gear box. The 1937 edition has no mention of the quick change. I assume it also came with the paper instructions about the quick change. My 1937 edition has an Atlas cover, but Chapter 7 on threading has an insert for the "Threading Supplement to adapt the manual of lathe operation to Sears Master Craftsman lathes..." My 28th edition of the book, circa 1974, has a Craftsman logo on the front of it. Information inside mentions Clausing Corp. Chapter 7 "Threading" now includes information on the Quick Change gear box. Finally, the 33rd edition has the Atlas logo on the cover, but the information inside mentions Clausing. From NOS manuals I have seen, they were packaged in a fitted cardboard box stamped either "ATLAS" or "SEARS" on it. This notation on the box indicated if the book was sent with a Atlas branded lathe or a Craftsman branded lathe. Happy hunting. Doug in VA ------- Re: "Instructions" And the Manual of Lathe Operations... Posted by: "carvel webb" carvelwx~xxabsamail.co.za Date: Tue Aug 3, 2010 12:18 pm ((PDT)) In addition to Doug's comprehensive response, it might be worth noting that Atlas published a separate booklet on the Quick Change gearbox. Regards, Carvel ------- Date: Sat, 21 Aug 2010 11:06:39 +1000 From: "Peter Evans" Subject: RE: [OldTools] Popular Woodworking reprint of a classic (copyworkexpired text) You are lucky -- many Google Books scans, including this one, are not available outside the USA. Some titles are available on Internet Archive, including this one --- so if you are outside the USA, check out Internet Archive, in this case http://www.archive.org Cheers Peter Evans Sydney, Australia ------- NOTE TO FILE: The above site http://www.archive.org/ is a download friendly site for many metalworking books also. See: http://www.archive.org Lots of other subjects too. Although the books are old, some techniques have not changed very much and often the methods are useable by folks without a lot of money for fancy modern machines. ------- Another Online Source For Free Metalworking Books [atlas_craftsman] Posted by: "S or J" jstudiox~xxtbaytel.net Date: Sat Aug 21, 2010 5:02 pm ((PDT)) Hi Folks Most of our U.S. members are aware of the many older metal working and turning texts that are out of copyright and have been scanned for the web by Google Books. Many of these books are still very useful, showing techniques that are virtually unchanged until today. Occasionally they have some tips that have been long forgotten. In all cases they are an interesting look into the past. Unfortunately for Canadian and many overseas members, Google detects our web connection ISP origin as other than the U.S. and locks us out of downloading most of these texts. Google's apparent rationale is that copyright varies greatly outside the U.S. so they avoid any legal problems by simply blocking us. Fortunately there are other resources for many of these books. One very good source is: http://www.archive.org/ Just do a search on a subject like metalwork and get a long list of publications to either read online or download. If you want to check out just one small book that would be useful for lathe beginners, see the 1917 text Elementary Lathe Practice: http://www.archive.org It is fairly elementary but well presented and has lots of useful tips. regards Steve -- in Thunder Bay, Ontario, Canada Machining and Metalworking at Home http://www.janellestudio.com/metal/ ------- Re: Another Online Source For Free Metalworking Books Posted by: "oldstudentmsgt" wmrmeyersx~xxsbcglobal.net Date: Sun Aug 22, 2010 7:31 am ((PDT)) Thanks, Steve, I've stolen and posted the link on my Mini-Lathes Yahoo group. BTW, anyone interested is welcome to join. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Mini-Lathes/ Bill in OKC ------- Date: Fri, 27 Aug 2010 11:31:41 +1000 From: travis anderson-bond Subject: [OldTools] Good Galooty book series: "Bushcraft" GGs, Largely on topic: I **highly** recommend the "Bushcraft" series, by the late Ron Edwards -- http://www.ramsskullpress.com/crafts.html (I've read 3-4 of them at my local library.) If you like books within the Eric Sloane, Foxfire vein, then you'll enjoy these. Written by a rural Australian guy, about traditional rural and bush techniques on hut-building,improvised tools, rustic furniture, making fences out of local materials, and etc. Trying desperately to document the rapidly-vanishing bushcraft of Australia. Lots of WW handtool (and leatherworking! and farmyard blacksmithing/ ironworking!) info. Loads of sketches, each one accompanied by a paragraph or two of explanation. Re: Woodworking -- Actually includes brief entries on mortising axes, hewing, adze use (and types), twibils (from memory; pretty sure), and the like. Loads of down-home advice. Also butter churning, rope splicing, making camp cots from sticks and burlap bags, etc., etc. Organized by chapter with different topics -- although within each chapter it's fairly non-linear. But, that's fine. :) AU$50 each (softcover), and a ten-volume series. But, **great** stuff. I **totally** intend to buy the whole ten volumes... No affiliation, etc. Travis ------- Date: Thu, 26 Aug 2010 23:35:22 -0400 From: "Bill Taggart" Subject: [OldTools] Interesting old book Last year, at the Richmond Antique Tool Society's Winter Gathering, in which there always is held a donation auction to raise money for the club, only one item in the auction attracted my interest. It was an old book, originally published in 1917. Alas, another club member wanted it more and I dropped out as the bidding hit $35. So the next day I Googled the title, and lo and behold, not only is at available as a Google book for free, I also found an excellent condition original copy of the "New and Revised" 1927 edition for a mere $14 from Alibris books. What is this small treasure, you ask? It is titled, rather uninspiringly, "Non-Technical Chats on Iron and Steel," by LaVerne W. Spring. Some of the contents of the book originally appeared as a series of articles in "Valve World," the company publication of Crane Company of Chicago (U.S. Galoots should recognize that name; it still exists today as a very large maker of plumbing valves and fixtures). The idea was to provide an interesting discussion and explanation of the history of the manufacture of steel and "modern" manufacture methods and varieties of steel, but, as the title reveals, do so in a "non-technical" way. Instead of presenting highly technical discussions that only a PhD metallurgist or lab chemist could love, the author uses a conversational, story-telling tone - i.e., "chats." It also contains "Three hundred and forty-two illustrations and diagrams." I'm sure most Galoots will find this book interesting and enjoyable. Git yourself a copy while the gittin' is good. I'm sure Alibris, Half.com and ABE books will now suddenly find themselves having a run on this book... If so, download the Google books version for nuttin! Bill T. ------- Date: Fri, 27 Aug 2010 14:32:45 +1000 From: "Peter Evans" Subject: RE: [OldTools] Interesting old book As per usual bl**dy Google will not allow international download. Try Internet Archive if you are not in USA. http://www.archive.org There may be some way to get around Google, but IA is the easiest. (There are some books that are on Google, and not on IA unfortunately.) Cheers Peter Evans Sydney, Australia Skype peterrevans ------- Date: Fri, 27 Aug 2010 07:19:10 -0400 From: Ken Shepard Subject: Re: [OldTools] Interesting old book There is also a 1992 reprint, and a 2010 scanned print-on-demand reprint. Amazon and all the bigger booksellers have the 2010 version available. Ken in TN ------- Date: Fri, 27 Aug 2010 21:48:20 +1000 From: Tony Blanks Subject: Re: [OldTools] Interesting old book Bill Taggart wrote: > What is this small treasure, you ask? It is titled, rather > uninspiringly, "Non-Technical Chats on Iron and Steel," > by LaVerne W. Spring. and Ken Shepard wrote: > There is also a 1992 reprint, and a 2010 scanned print-on-demand > reprint. Amazon and all the bigger booksellers have the 2010 version > available. But while the 1905 first editions are available from a variety of vendors so cheap, (and I'm paying in Aus $$, aka South Pacific Pesos), and in such good condition, why not go with the Old Tool? I'm all for supporting small 2nd hand booksellers who cater for those of us with obscure tastes. Suport them or lose them. Amazon Books and Barnes and Noble (for those down the North American end of the porch) are fine for the bulk market and those who can download, but here on the outer edge of the known world (not actually the edge, but you can see it from the hill behind our house), give me a small specialist bookseller, with a reputation to uphold. With luck my newly purchased copy will be here in a week or so. Thanks to Bill for the pointer, and to Peter in Perth WA for the impetus. Regards, Tony B Hobart, Tasmania ------- NOTE TO FILE: The following webpage has links to some interesting sites for machinists. You can find some free plans or suggested projects or helpful lessons depending on your interests. Well worth a visit. [Join the 2 lines of the web address together with no space.] http://www.thomasnet.com/articles/custom-manu facturing-fabricating/machinist-machining-resources ------- NOTE TO FILE: You might want to look at this free book online at Project Gutenberg, which publishes thousands of copyright-expired books. The subject is Turning and Boring, but really covers all the operations needed for your metal lathe. http://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/34030 There are quite a few other free machining books out there, but this one has some really good illustrations. Books at Project Gutenberg can be downloaded in HTML format and read on your computer; they can also be downloaded in various e-book formats to suit electronic portable readers like Kindle. The site in the following message has books for download in different formats including Kindle. One interesting observation, the book in Kindle format is only a tiny fraction (about 10%) of the size of the PDF file. The Kindle version can be read on any computer by downloading the free Kindle For PC program from Amazon's website. You do not need to own a Kindle for this. ------- Starrett Book for Machinists Appentices [sherline] Posted by: "ian_new" ian_newx~xxyahoo.com Date: Sun Mar 6, 2011 1:58 pm ((PST)) Hi, the following download from archive.org might be of interest to some people: http://www.archive.org It is a scan of the Starrett Book for Machinists Appentices, published in 1917. Ian ------- New man in the group. [atlas_craftsman] Posted by: "twidget56" johns.ed24x~xxyahoo.com Date: Sat Apr 9, 2011 9:31 am ((PDT)) Howdy. My name is Ed and you can call me most anything except "late for supper." I joined the group as I have inherited an Atlas 618 and a large box of goodies from an EE for a large paper mill and a genuine packrat. Since retrieving these jewels, I have also picked up some extras here and there; a post grinder from an alien site and an Atlas attachment that permits doing small flat machining from the bed of the lathe. As far as usage of the lathe, I have used wood lathes before but this is the first metal lathe I've tackled. I am in the process of getting to know the terminology of the device and as soon as I figure out how to connect the reversible motor, will turn it on and see what flies off. Any recommendations on texts to pick up for self education on these machines will be well received. I'm looking forward to meeting you and hearing your expertise dribble across the wires. edj ------- Re: New man in the group. Posted by: "jo barden" jobarden422x~xxmsn.com Date: Sat Apr 9, 2011 1:55 pm ((PDT)) Hi Ed. Have a look at www.lathes.co.uk excellent site, good description of the Atlas and a bit about use, as for good read you can't go wrong with "The Amateurs Lathe" excellent novice/middling or experts read. Just my opinion Jon G6UWK ------- Re: New man in the group. Posted by: "Bruce Freeman" freemab222x~xxgmail.com Date: Sat Apr 9, 2011 8:43 pm ((PDT)) GET BOOKS. You can find used book stores these days by keying in your town in Google Maps, then doing a "Se5arch Nearby" for "used book stores". Many such stores do not have technical stuff, but a lot of them still do. Find old books with good sections on the metal lathe. As a novice, everything you find will be new to you. Used books have the advantage of being cheap, and you might not feel so bad when you get greasy fingerprints on them. Watch out for HS textbooks. The new ones tend to be sh*t. "This is a lathe. Can you say 'lathe'?". The older ones (like, pre-1970) can be truly works of art -- complete instructions how to use engine and turret lathes written for a 15-year old. If you don't have the Atlas Manual of Lathe Operations, contact Clausing and buy a copy. It will set you back $25 or so. ------- Re: New man in the group. Posted by: "Scott Henion" shenionx~xxshdesigns.org Date: Sat Apr 9, 2011 9:02 pm ((PDT)) On 4/9/2011 Bruce Freeman wrote: > GET BOOKS. Here's some online: http://www.wewilliams.net/SBLibrary.htm Lots of good books there. Mostly southbend but they are similar to A/C lathes in operation. Also check out the MIT videos: http://techtv.mit.edu/collections/ehs-videos/videos > If you don't have the Atlas Manual of Lathe Operations, contact Clausing > and buy a copy. It will set you back $25 or so. Lots of info on using the lathe and also the accessories. I used mine to learn things. Still use it for looking up odd threads and things I have forgotten. Scott G. Henion Craftsman 12x36 lathe: http://shdesigns.org/Craftsman12x36 ------- Re: New man in the group. Posted by: "Doc" n8as1x~xxaol.com docn8as Date: Sat Apr 9, 2011 9:32 pm ((PDT)) machine tool operation vol 1 by burghardt ... he was super of industrial ed in NJ... used books all over the net ....vol 2 is shaper, planer, mill grinder ....vol 1 is bench work & lathe ....any edition from 1921 to 41 ... well suited to the home shop .....50+ yrs later i still refer........shd be able to get both for $10-15. atlas manual of lathe operations ....& later, advanced machine work by smith (MIT shop instructor) has every operation you will ever need to do in student lesson form ....reprint by lindsay at abt $30 ... my original has abt 1300 pages... best wishes docn8as ------- Re: New man in the group. Posted by: "BRIAN GLACKIN" glackin.brianx~xxgmail.com Date: Sun Apr 10, 2011 7:21 am ((PDT)) Another source of books are antique "Malls" There are often stacks of books used to "pretty" up the shelves of expensive furniture. I picked up a set of Audell carpentry manuals for $27 and a copy of "the boy mechanic book 1" for $3. Both are well worth the price. ------- Re: New man in the group. Posted by: "jerdalx~xxsbcglobal.net" jerdalx~xxsbcglobal.net Date: Sun Apr 10, 2011 9:48 am ((PDT)) Lindsay Books has tons of reprinted books on machining. The Robert Smith book "Advanced Machine Work" is very good, and not as "advanced" as you might think.... quite suitable for starting out. I got it from Lindsay. JT ------- Re: New man in the group. Posted by: "Rick" rgsparberx~xxaol.com rgsparber Date: Sun Apr 10, 2011 10:11 am ((PDT)) Books are an essential source of information as are the people on this BBS. But you can't beat having face to face discussions with a machinist who is generous with their knowledge. Often these people are not computer savvy so reaching them via a BBS is not possible. Rick ------- Re: New man in the group. Posted by: "db45acp" db45acpx~xxyahoo.com Date: Sun Apr 10, 2011 10:21 am ((PDT)) Hello Ed. Check out this link to "mrpete222" on YouTube. http://www.youtube.com/user/mrpete222 He has a series of videos he has uploaded that are very helpful with some of the lathe basics, some specific to Atlas/Craftsman lathes. As others have mentioned, books are a great source. The Atlas and South Bend books are excellent starters. Dan ------- Re: New man in the group. Posted by: "mf205i" mf205ix~xxyahoo.com Date: Sun Apr 10, 2011 11:03 am ((PDT)) Then start with these. http://www.scribd.com/doc/34415359/Manual-of-Lathe-Operations-and-Machin ists-Tables-Atlas-Press-Co http://www.bbssystem.com/manuals/Lathe-Tutorial.pdf http://www.youtube.com/watch#!v=npJfKhkS0QE&feature=related Tubalcain videos, Watch them all http://www.wewilliams.net/SBLibrary.htm http://southbendlathe.org/?tubepress_page=1 http://techtv.mit.edu/collections/ehs-videos/videos http://www.archive.org http://metalwebnews.com/machine-tools/fmt.html See HTRAL at http://www.wswells.com/index.html http://www.jjjtrain.com/vms/library.html http://www.americanmachinetools.com/how_to_use_a_lathe.htm http://www.sherline.com/grinding.htm http://www.machinist-guide.com/lathe-threading.html http://www.formrolldie.com/new_page_1.htm And don't forget to download your FREE copie of Machinery's Handbook. Edition 5. http://books.google.com/books?id=VkEYAAAAYAAJ And if you have an Atlas or Craftsman product. First go to Tony's site: http://www.lathes.co.uk/page21.html http://www.roseantiquetools.com/id116.html Have fun, Mike ------- Re: Gear Cutters [atlas_craftsman group] Posted by: "Bruce Freeman" freemab222x~xxgmail.com Date: Fri Apr 15, 2011 9:37 pm ((PDT)) For what it's worth, these videos are interesting: http://www.youtube.com/user/Hobbynut [There are several videos in this series, so use links at youtube to find all of them made by Hobbynut.] ------- NOTE TO FILE: I checked out the video Bruce suggested and found it was just one of many videos made by Hobbynut on Youtube (Shorty Leatherwood) with web address: Shortyleatherwoodx~xxyahoo.com and home site: www.leatherwoodplayground.com To save you a bit of time, I have posted the links here (in order) of a series Shorty made about making gears on a Sherline lathe and mill. Don't be put off by the "CNC" in the title. Every gear can be done on manual machines but will just take a bit more time. And you can do this on any make of metal lathe and mill (or lathe with milling attachment). These videos are an excellent teaching aid. And lots of tips and tricks along the way that will help you on other machining projects no matter what brand of equipment you are using. Sherline CNC Gear Cutting Part 1 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MItgd-faHFw&feature=related Sherline CNC Gear Cutting Part 2 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vQGAK06JLQg&feature=related Sherline CNC Gear Cutting Part 3 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rBMRJ_K14IA&NR=1 Sherline CNC Gear Cutting Part 4 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7ETcZLJrWXE&feature=related Sherline CNC Gear Cutting Part 5 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=62ymeJ0l9VM&feature=related And here is his excellent series on making homemade hobs. These things were always a bit of a mystery to me as I have never seen one in person, and book explanations were less than clear. Now they make sense. Thanks! Home made Gear cutting Hobs on my Sherline (part 1) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nMS2un-kbg0 Home made Gear cutting Hobs part2 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ykSOOXww0U0 Using W1 water hardening drill rod for the hob. Home made Gear cutting Hobs part3 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UqnqswBl6HA Home made Gear cutting Hobs part4 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8UBxNPbg0ls Home made gear cutting hobs part 5 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9bfJ_ARfP4I Home made gear cutting hobs part 6 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NebcXM-nZk4 Home made gear cutting hobs Conclusion http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WCUO-JkdxAo And a quick update for this last hob series. Hob vid Correction http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nFrc90Nzmio&feature=related ------- [Restoring Babbitt Bearings] Re: what to do... [atlas_craftsman] Posted by: "oldstudentmsgt" wmrmeyersx~xxsbcglobal.net Date: Mon May 23, 2011 6:38 am ((PDT)) There is a Gingery book on pouring Babbitt bearings, available from Lindsay's Technical Books for about $10 that tells you pretty much all you need. www.lindsaybks.com/ There is also the Magnolia Bearing Book available free on the internet as a PDF, from one of the old manufacturers of "improved" babbitt-type material. http://www.metalwebnews.org/ftp/bearing-book.pdf HTH! Bill in OKC ------- Re: 618 Atlas Emblem [atlas618lathe] Posted by: "BRIAN GLACKIN" glackin.brianx~xxgmail.com Date: Fri Aug 5, 2011 9:38 am ((PDT)) On Thu, Aug 4, 2011, Hey You!! wrote: > I have just finished a year long rehab of a 1941 618. It is great, > but I need a decent Atlas metal emblem that goes on the front of the > headstock. Has anyone got an extra for sale? I haunt ebay but have > missed the few there because I couldn't match the price. > thanks Paul Andreasen Lompoc, CA You can create your own if either you have the original artwork or can find the artwork. Take a look at this site (it's the wiki for Vintagemachinery.org) and look at section 2.4 on decals. http://wiki.owwm.com/MainPage.ashx ------- NOTE TO FILE: The above website is ostensibly for restoring old woodworking machinery, but also has many how-to articles that will be useful to metalworkers and any hobbyists with workshops. ------- NOTE TO FILE: This next message announces one of a new series of free how-to machining articles published by Rick Sparber on his website: http://rick.sparber.org/ Rick combines detailed word explanations with clear diagrams and close-up photography. A marvellous site that is well worth checking regularly in order to read the latest lesson. Articles are extremely useful to beginners, but often contain clever tips and variations that may enlighten even experienced machinists. And if you have any comments on the articles, or useful tips, Rick will appreciate hearing them. ------- new article: An Easy way to Single Point Turn a Thread [atlas_craftsman] Posted by: "RG Sparber" rgsparberx~xxaol.com Date: Sun Aug 14, 2011 8:53 pm ((PDT)) This procedure was generously given to me by Frank Petrin of the Valley Metal Club of Phoenix, AZ. If you are interested, please see http://rick.sparber.org/ftt.pdf Your comments and questions are always welcome. All of us are smarter than any one of us. Rick ------- Re: Has anyone done internal keyways using Sherline lathe? [sherline] Posted by: "Tom & Judy Bank" trbank1x~xxverizon.net Date: Tue Sep 20, 2011 10:24 am ((PDT)) "Wayne Brandon" tiktokx~xxcox.net wrote: > Looks like a neat project here [filing machine for the lathe]: http://www.homeshopsupply.com/flmac.pdf Wayne: The URL you give is a PDF copy, originally from Louis and Samuel Levin's book, Practical Benchwork for Horologists, pages 114 - 122 (1938 edition). It's good to see that made available for guys like us. About 15 years ago, an older friend, long gone, who was a graduate of the old Lancaster PA watchmaking school loaned me a book on watchmaking techniques. I copied maybe 20 pages and immediately returned it. He gave me a sly grin and said, "You return books. OK, here's what you really want to look at." And pulled out his copy of the Levins' book. I copied the whole thing. There are a number of DIY projects for guys like us in it, plus a lifetime's worth of techniques. When I made the copies I didn't have the experience to make or use the gear described. Now I just have to get around to making some of the stuff. Regards, Tom Bank ------- Fw: Re: [sherline] Re: Has anyone done internal keyways using Sherli Posted by: "Flosi" flosigudx~xxsimnet.is Date: Wed Sep 21, 2011 9:54 am ((PDT)) Steve Wan wrote: > Hey Tom > By any chance will some of those useful copies from Levins' book be > appearing in PDF? Would be warmly welcomed by all of us ;) Here it is and more. http://www.scribd.com/search?query=Practical+Benchwork+for+Horologists ------- NOTE TO FILE: See a free book detailing how to repair Babbitt bearings. http://www.metalwebnews.org/ftp/bearing-book.pdf Additionally you can do an internet search for Babbitt bearings and find a number of helpful videos. ------- NOTE TO FILE: The Sherline group was having a discussion in October 2011 about how to get better results with the manually operated Sherline threading attachment made specifically for that lathe. {Parts of that conversation can be found here in the Sherline Lathe Quirks or Tips file.) Then the discussion changed to if and why an offset to 29.5 degrees of the top slide was needed. The following site has an excellent illustration of the different threading approaches for any make of lathe. http://www.mmsonline.com/articles/threading-on-a-lathe ------- NOTE TO FILE: October 2011: Review of Edgar T. Westbury's book "Milling in the Lathe". This book is available used through web vendors like Alibris or Amazon or Abebooks. Wait for a reasonably priced copy. We folks are not book collectors looking for pristine copies. A good readable copy is okay. In this site's file called Atlas Lathe Milling (really about milling operations on any make of lathe) you have read about folks using their lathe for milling operations. And there were often opinions that folks would be far better off buying a milling machine because of limitations of the lathe for these operations. Obviously those folks have not read or applied the learning and tips and tricks available in Mr. Westbury's book. A lathe can do a lot more, and a lot better, than I thought. I recently received a copy of this book as a gift, and have just gotten around to reading it. My bad. I should have bought this book back when I got my first metal lathe. It would have saved me a lot of time and money. Mr. Westbury's book would be invaluable if you only read its tips on making your own milling cutters, or simple but ingenious setups and jigs for holding work. This is a most practical and all encompassing look at milling practices with emphasis on using the lathe. But lots of the tips would apply to a milling machine too. No, I get no recompense from the book's vendors, but I really do highly recommend it to you for your library, and development of your personal metalworking skills. ------- Re: Machinery's Handbook [Metal_Shapers] Posted by: "Chet" drumbum420x~xxmail.com Date: Thu Oct 20, 2011 11:09 am ((PDT)) Doc wrote: > any edition of Machine Tool Operation by Burghardt .., back to the first circa 1923, has the shaper info ..Audels Tool Makers Handbook has a large section on shapers & on planers ... docn8as < i think ive found exactly what your looking for (and ive ordered one as well ;) http://www.lindsaybks.com/bks/prshap/index.html Production Shaping Machinery's Industrial Secrets articles from Machinery Magazine More articles from just after WWI. You strap a casting to the bed of the planer, and the bed will pull the casting under a stationary cutting tool. On a shaper, however, the casting is stationary and the ram moves the tool across the casting to remove metal in ways a lathe can't. You don't see shapers much any more, but that doesn't mean they're not useful. Here, you'll be taken into factories in England, Canada and the U.S. to see how shapers were put to work building other machine tools. It's about as close as you'll come to seeing shapers in action. You get four articles detailing the use of shapers in the production of parts for drilling machines, other shapers, engine lathes, and more. You'll see the jigs used to mount castings for cutting slots, keyways, dovetails, oil grooves and more in a variety of castings from tiny to gigantic. Another article explores the various types of shaper tables used by different manufacturers to counteract the downward thrust of the cut. And you'll see a shaper adapted to cut radii, do surface grinding, and even cut teeth in a repaired gear. Admittedly, some of the shapers shown and the work they're doing is larger than we'll encounter. But the principles of adjusting, clamping, and cutting are applicable. These articles were written for the factory machinist who was to be doing this work. Just by "listening in" on the conversation, you're sure to learn valuable lessons. And the number one lesson: don't ever underestimate the value of a shaper. (Truth is, I think after you read this, you'll be drooling to buy a used shaper or build Dave Gingery's model.) Great ideas. Valuable lessons. Inexpensive. Heavily illustrated. Get a copy. 5 1/2 x 8 1/2 booklet 48 pages No. 22253 ... $5.95 ------- Threading Information -- New Atlas Six-Inch Lathe [atlas618lathe] Posted by: "Jim Peterson" f4d711x~xxaol.com Date: Sat Dec 17, 2011 10:40 am ((PST)) I have uploaded the subject booklet in the Files Section, in a folder with the same title. It was a VERY large PDF, so I had to break it down into 8 sections. This booklet addresses the use of the Atlas M6-25M Metric Gear Bracket Extension for the banjo. It supplements the information on the M6-735 Instructions. Both the M6-25M drawing and the M6-735 Instructions have been recently uploaded into the files section. The M6-25M extension on the banjo provides a place for the Position D gears used for some metric threads and other applications. If you are interested only in the use of the Position D gear for metric threads, I also uploaded a file in the subject folder entitled "Metric Threads excerpts" which contains only the pages pertaining to the Position D for metric threads. Hope this information is useful to you. Jim Peterson ------- [Craftsman Catalogs] New Member Here [atlas_craftsman] Posted by: "dukesalley" yankeewoodwrightx~xxyahoo.com Date: Sun Feb 26, 2012 12:27 pm ((PST)) Hi all, my name is Joe and I love Atlas / Craftsman machines. The first machine I ever owned was a 1963 Craftsman "100" Table Saw which my Dad bought for me when I was a young teenager so I could learn cabinetmaking. Later in life I switched careers and became a machinist. As a hobby I started restoring old machines and that developed into a business that became a joy to work at. I took an extreme liking to the machines made by Atlas from the 1930's through the early 1960's. I have restored Lathes, Mills, Shapers, Drill Presses, etc. I am posting some photos of a few of my restored machines. Most of these machines were rusty relics long ago abandoned and facing the junk yard. It was a pleasure to rescue them and give them new life and the respect they deserved. I also have a collection of Craftsman catalogs, 1933 through 1965 (missing 1934) so if anyone needs a scan of a machine, please let me know. It may take a few days to get around to it (I move a little slower now that I'm 65) but I will get to it. I hope you like the photos, it was a labor of love. Best regards, Joe ------- Links for Shaper tutorials [Metal_Shapers] Posted by: "Edmund" holmes_ca_2000x~xxyahoo.com Date: Tue May 15, 2012 4:14 pm ((PDT)) These tutorials are written or produced by author Sam Brown, http://www.eurospares.com/graphics/Tools/shapers/PMKnowYourShaper.pdf http://www.scribd.com/doc/14899971/Atlas-7B-Shaper-Contour-Cutting http://www.wentztech.com/metalworking/equipment/altas-shaper/ Edmund ------- Re: Links for Shaper tutorials Posted by: "dmmlemur" dmmx~xxlemur.com Date: Wed May 16, 2012 2:35 pm ((PDT)) Edmund wrote: > These tutorials are written or produced by author Sam Brown, Sam Brown was, in my opinion, the finest technical writer ever. It's worth searching through old Popular Mechanics to find his stuff. He also wrote many of the extraordinary books on optics that were published by the former Edmund Scientific company. The successor to that company, Edmund Optics (they sold off the "Edmund Scientific" brand in 2001), through their "Anchor Optics" commercial/experimental optics subsidiary, has many of these online, for free download, at: http://www.anchoroptics.com/documents/ (I know that this is optics, not shapers, but they're just such good books...) Back to shapers per se: As a part of bringing my Logan ES8 back into trim, I did a search through the web for shaper information. There's a fair bit of it available, but it's pretty scattered. So I put together a page of annotated links (mostly) to what I could find. See: http://www.circuitousroot.com/artifice/machine-shop/shaper/lit erature/index.html The "Suggested Unit Course in Shaper Work" by the Seneca Vocational High School (1944) is excellent. Regards, David M. MacMillan www.CircutiousRoot.com ------- Rust Removal [atlas_craftsman] Posted by: "paulguenterx~xxatt.net" paulguenterx~xxatt.net Date: Sat May 26, 2012 4:26 am ((PDT)) Here is a link to remove rust and it does not hurt the part. http://www.oldengine.org/members/orrin/rustdemo.htm GP ------- NOTE TO FILE: The above link is to an extremely detailed article on all aspects of electrolytic rust removal. Lots of details and facts that I had never read anywhere else. A very useful reference. You might want to save or print a copy in case the web copy ever disappears. ------- Shaper Books and Many More!! [Metal_Shapers] Posted by: "p4ul1234" winnaarspoortx~xxgmail.com Date: Sat Aug 25, 2012 9:48 pm ((PDT)) Morning Guys. Just a quick link for any one that would like to get info / books on shapers. Too many to mention but well worth the read! http://www.neme-s.org/Shaper%20Books/ Regards Paul ------- Re: Need help with article [atlas_craftsman] Posted by: "Raymond" jwreyx~xxusa.net Date: Mon Sep 10, 2012 7:44 pm ((PDT)) > I have been tasked with writing an article on buying a used lathe. Please allow me to offer some recommended reading on the topic at hand. Please read this: Some Helpful Tips on Evaluating a Lathe (aka Advice on Inspecting a Lathe) http://www.mermac.com/advicenew.html Done with that? Now please read this: In (modest) Praise Of Klunkers http://www.mermac.com/klunker2.html Enjoy! raymond ------- [How to tram a milling machine (adjust all axes perfectly square)] Re: Tramming the taig - A2Z ER16 end mill holder [taigtools] Posted by: "Martin Dobbins" trainnutzx~xxyahoo.com Date: Fri Sep 14, 2012 6:39 am ((PDT)) Some people learn more from pictures or movies (I know because I'm one). The videos below show a much larger milling machine than the Taig but the principles are the same: Part 1: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_2w8cYXt5_o Part 2: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B-cAnQqpXs0&feature=plcp Martin ------- Re: Instructional Videos was (Tramming the taig - A2Z ER16 end mill Posted by: "Martin Dobbins" trainnutzx~xxyahoo.com Date: Fri Sep 14, 2012 1:46 pm ((PDT)) > Thanks Martin, very good instructional video, did you notice there appeared to be runout of the part when he was drilling, or was that an illusion caused by the video, personally for myself I would have drilled then bored and then reamed, other than that it was a very good video, Edmund < Hi Edmund. If you look very carefully there appears to be runout in the outer body of the spindle above the part also, so either this is an illusion caused by the lighting and video process or the outer surface of the part has taken on the same runout as the spindle. I hope it is an illusion and not runout. Drilling,boring and reaming would produce the most accurate results, but may result in difficulty in buying or fabricating a boring bar small enough and with sufficient rigidity for small but deep hole sizes. Unfortunately there are too few instructional videos like this, so I am willing to forgive some blemishes to those with the courage to post them. For instance, this isn't perfect but I'd still be happy to buy the guy a beer for posting it: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=igfqYZPdQ78&feature=plcp Martin ------- Re: Tramming the taig - A2Z ER16 end mill holder Posted by: "Don" Donx~xxCampbell-Gemstones.com Date: Fri Sep 14, 2012 3:59 pm ((PDT)) I noticed the runout also. And I also agree that I would have bored to about 5 under then a finish ream. He quoted that he reduced the speed down to 200RPM. I would have used a spring loaded center on the dead end of the mill and hand turned the reamer into the adapter. It may just be me, but in 50+ years of reaming holes, I never managed to get one on size by powering it into the piece. Don ------- Re: Tramming the taig - A2Z ER16 end mill holder Posted by: "ED MAISEY" holmes_ca_2000x~xxyahoo.com Date: Fri Sep 14, 2012 4:21 pm ((PDT)) Don, when I said bore before reaming, when I'm reaming a hole I bore to 5 to 8 undersize as deep as I can reach then I just finish bore to size the start of the hole to guide the reamer to act as a lead in, of course if you're good you can finish bore to a good fit, a go and no go is worth while, but if you have a bunch and a reamer why not. Edmund ------- Re: Model Engineer Downloads [myfordlathes] Posted by: "S or J" jstudiox~xxtbaytel.net Date: Sat Nov 10, 2012 12:24 pm ((PST)) Hi Folks Pardon me if this rambles a bit. Once upon a time, after reading some of Guy Lautard's Bedside Readers, I thought it would be the holy grail to have access to all the old copies of Model Engineer, then Model Engineer's Workshop, not to mention Home Shop Machinist. I had bought some then current copies of ME, but found them irritating and expensive as projects were broken down over many issues and the magazine had too many articles about trains and clocks, of little to no interest to me. I started subscribing to HSM and MEW which were much more workshop oriented. Then an old machinist friend gave me all the early HSMs to complete my set as well as many earlier MEW. Then he gave me many years worth of ME, some back near WW2. Yikes, they were both a challenge to read and used a great deal of living space. I have always been a book packrat and already had way too many [but not nearly enough] bookshelves. So I gave most of the early MEs away locally to a stationary engine club. These publications, en masse, have such volume and weight that sending them any distance would be cost prohibitive -- we in Canada do not have the luxury of the U.S. flat rate boxes -- and pay through the nose for postage. So the local club members will soon get the couple of remaining cartons of ME. If one fell into the trap of becoming an electronic packrat and considered making scanned versions of all these publications, there is not enough space in one lifetime to tackle that project and actually live life to the full. I subscribed to a couple of Yahoo groups where JW Early frequented and read some of his scans of interest. At least he had cherry picked some useful how-to machining articles whose electronic versions did not consume real world space. In recent years, MEW added an online version of their print mag but it was apparently deliberately scanned at a low resolution to prevent quality printing. That was annoying, as folks were paying good money to read them. About a year ago I terminated my MEW subscription. Very few new articles were actually really new, in the sense that multiple authors had done similar work over the years. And if you have a busy life, there is barely enough time to read new stuff, let alone do many new projects, or go back and re-read all the old stuff. Actually perhaps the early HSMs are an exception; their articles IMHO were better and more useful than much of the newer content. Grey cell overload with publications is all too easy. And as amateur machinists doing this for fun, we should probably do less reading and more playing in the workshop ;-) Steve -- in Thunder Bay, Ontario, Canada Machining and Metalworking at Home http://www.janellestudio.com/metal/ -- who has witnessed our first significant snowstorm today, which bodes well for a long winter in a warm workshop... ------- Re: Model Engineer Downloads Posted by: "Paul Kennedy" clankennedy2004x~xxyahoo.co.uk Date: Sat Nov 10, 2012 2:08 pm ((PST)) I know what you are saying. I even agree. I still want to sate my collector's bug though. Then I can skim the series and cherry pick the projects of interest to me in the knowledge that I hopefully have a complete archive. This is going back to an original point. The older issues contained a lot of hints and tips that are being lost as the generations pass! And we should be doing more to protect this resource as it's becoming that fragmented that few places exist where we have access to the entire archive and then only at a cost! ------- Re: Model Engineer Downloads Posted by: "Kevin" tadpolex~xxbtinternet.com Date: Sat Nov 10, 2012 2:54 pm ((PST)) Paul, you just don't seem to get it!! There is no massive hoard of scans of Model Engineer floating around on the Web waiting to be downloaded. There is the JWE stuff, fairly well known and fairly extensive ... you said earlier that you have this already. JWE was forced to remove his files from a number of Yahoo Groups by implied threat of legal action, but the files were already out in the wild by then. There is also a bunch of articles going under the title of Model Engineer Hints and Tips or something similar, mainly articles by "Duplex" and Westbury I think. There's a bunch of MEWs, and you have those too. As regards the mags, that's it. If you subscribed to ME you could download a few years worth from their site. Maybe you can sweet-talk a subscriber into doing it for you...... The archive.com site has lots of early engineering books and professional magazines for free legal download. You do seem to want it all handing to you on a plate, "send me pdfS" is wearing a bit thin. In any case, it is really unhelpful to keep on asking openly on the list for people to send you copies of stuff which you know is still in copyright. I'm not Mister Plod (the policeman, for non-UK readers), as it happens, but I might well have been for all you know. It is well known that the editor of ME keeps an eye on a number of lists, maybe even here, and I'll bet that the publishers legal mob roam around a bit too. Nobody really objects to occasional requests for copies of a few pages for genuine research or to complete a project, but to come out and ask for complete runs is silly (other words come to mind!). It's also a bit annoying to be honest. Steve hit the nail on the head earlier .... there just isn't time to be doing all that copying (and I reported some time ago just how mind-numbing it was to digitally photograph a few years of a mag) and then expect to read even the relevant bits, and get out to the workshop! Kevin, NW England, UK ------- Re: Model Engineer Downloads Posted by: "iwhitex~xxrogers.com" Date: Sat Nov 10, 2012 3:02 pm ((PST)) Thanks Kevin, a good response and I agree. ------- Re: Model Engineer Downloads Posted by: "Paul Kennedy" clankennedy2004x~xxyahoo.co.uk Date: Sat Nov 10, 2012 3:33 pm ((PST)) Im not getting into this with you Kevin. All I will say is I have a different outlook and im sticking to it and i don't appreciate your veiled insults. ------- Re: Model Engineer Downloads Posted by: "Cliff Coggin" clifford.cogginx~xxvirgin.net Date: Sun Nov 11, 2012 12:47 am ((PST)) [Paul:] It is commendable to preserve old skills and avoid their loss, but why do you, or anybody else, expect that knowledge to be free? Whether you collect magazine articles, oil paintings, or classic cars, you should pay for the priviledge. If you can't afford to, that's tough luck, but not everything in life is available just because we want it. Cliff Coggin Kent UK ------- Martin Cleeve is one of my fave MODEL ENGINEER writers [myfordlathes] Posted by: "ToolRoomTrusteex~xxaol.com" Date: Sat Nov 10, 2012 8:42 pm ((PST)) Going back to the 1950s an Englishmen using psuedonym of Martin Cleeve wrote many articles in Model Engineer on workshop topics. He apparently used an improved Myford ML4 to make items for sale. He described those improvements in ME articles. His articles on Tee-Slotted cross slides were a delight to me, one of these days I hope to put one on my 7x12 minilathe and maybe on my 9x20 although the two longitudinal tee-slots meet my needs so far. He cut the dovetail slide pieces using a hex bar held on faceplate with strips clamped in place and then faced from the tool post. He had an article on making a milling device to use on the lathe. Basically a spindle running in an oilite bushing and driven by a headstock chuck. Used with a horizontal mill style cutter, the work was clamped using the Myford tee slotted cross slide and depth of cut adjustment was made by shimming up the work piece. I went so far as to get the bushing... Model Engineer had a series of books with titles like WORKSHOP MASTERS. I don't know if they included Cleeve. Articles by Len Mason are good too, I made a filing rest to his design but it didn't work well due to my inadequacies as a machinist. Tubal Cain also had many useful articles. Much better to be out in the shop rather than sitting and reading but MODEL ENGINEER did mention the magzine was for those doing model engineering as well as those who hoped to do it....someday. I live in WA state, NW corner of USA in a rural community. We occasionally have power outages, one for 6 hours earlier this week. I could sit and read using one of those aluminum cased LED flashlights from Harbor Freight to read in the dark. Difficult to do workshop work in those conditions. Larry Murray ------- LBJ said "Don't get into a p#ssing contest with a skunk!" [myfordlathes] Posted by: "ToolRoomTrusteex~xxaol.com" Date: Sat Nov 10, 2012 9:04 pm ((PST)) For non USA readers, LBJ is acronym for Lyndon Baines Johnson who was vice president back in 1960s until JFK was assasinated in 1963. He had a plethora of pithy southern sayings. I suppose many people on this forum don't remember how it was back in the 1950s and 1960s when copy machines were expensive and the copies cost a bunch too. Or even earlier when copies of documents like birth certificates were made by photostat which was a very quick photographic process. Later on into the 70s copiers got less costly and copies even cheaper. I think it wasn't until the late 1980s that scanners became a common home computer accessory which enabled magazines etc to be put into a digital format and then read on a computer screen or printed out. With rise of inexpensive black and white laser printers, the cost per page is virtually USA pennies. I have a refurbished Samsung laser printer purchased eight years ago for under $90 delivered and then toner refill supplies, later the remanufactured cartidges became cheap (last three I got were $50 total, delivered). At age 68 I still am amazed at how inexpensive some things can be done compared to the days of my youth. We get accustomed to getting things free or free with advertising but TV (in USA) has always been that way). People will make movies and post them on youtube which you can watch for free or use a free program to download them to your pc. I regret the rambliness of this post, in my own ponderous way I am explaining why people can come to expect to find literature downloadable for free. AIR Benenuto Cellini pointed out that you can get what you ask for but you have to ask. Larry Murray ------- [myfordlathes] Re: The Amateur's Lathe - by Sparey - where can I get this? Posted by: "Ian Strickland" stricklandxmh9x~xxyahoo.co.uk Date: Thu Nov 15, 2012 4:27 am ((PST)) "noakesgarth" garthnx~xxpbt.co.za wrote: > Hi > I have tried several local bookstores (Cape Town), also Amazon etc. > No luck Hi. The Amateurs Lathe has been reprinted by Specialist Interest Model Books in 2002, Reprinted in 2003 and 2005. Their address is P.O.Box 327, Poole, Dorset, BH15 2RG, Go to this link: http://www.specialinterestmodelbooks.co.uk/product_list.asp?cat=eng ineering&move=12 Hope this helps. I have an original copy and also one of their reprints. Good value I'd say. God bless, Ian Strickland, SE England. ------- Re: The Amateur's Lathe - by Sparey - where can I get this? Posted by: "Ken Strauss" ken.straussx~xxgmail.com Date: Thu Nov 15, 2012 5:42 am ((PST)) AbeBooks has a new copy for cdn $11.01 including shipping to SA. ------- Re: The Amateur's Lathe - by Sparey - where can I get this? Posted by: "Maurice M. Greeson" mauricex~xxmckay3d.com Date: Thu Nov 15, 2012 7:49 am ((PST)) Here is a link to a page from used.addall.com, which is a search engine for new and used books. It lists many sellers. http://tinyurl.com/aznzymh I have used it a lot to find books I wanted. Maurice ------- Re: The Amateur's Lathe - by Sparey - where can I get this? Posted by: "Norman Lloyd" norman_lloydx~xxyahoo.com Date: Thu Nov 15, 2012 8:01 am ((PST)) I have always gone to the Book Depository, They have great prices and post is free. http://www.bookdepository.com/search?searchTerm=the+amateurs+lat he&search=Find+book They have a great selection of books. Take a look! ------- Free Books [myfordlathes] Posted by: "clankennedy2004" clankennedy2004x~xxyahoo.co.uk Date: Wed Nov 21, 2012 1:06 pm ((PST)) Hey Guys, Just found a new resourse I thought you may be interested in. For those concerned this also seems to be a legit service! Basically if you visit http://www.craftsmanspace.com/freebooks you will findlinks to free technical journals, books, pdfs, etc. I don't know where all the links go to but my first try took me to a California Digital Library which allows the download of out of copyright material in almost any format you wish ! Txt, PDF, EPub, Kindle etc. Enjoy Paul Kennedy ------- Free Stuff :D All legit to those who are bothered ! Posted by: "clankennedy2004" clankennedy2004x~xxyahoo.co.uk Date: Wed Nov 21, 2012 6:52 pm ((PST)) Guys I posted earlier about this but it didn't seem to have worked. Anyway since then I've been trawling through this resource and it TRULY is REMARKABLE. It seems that Google, Microsoft and the American Library System have digitised all Out-of-Copyrighted books in their system. It's now all available online. An IMMENSE HORDE OF KNOWLEDGE !!! http://www.craftsmanspace.com/ ------- Re: Free Books Posted by: "Kevin" tadpolex~xxbtinternet.com Date: Fri Nov 23, 2012 3:40 am ((PST)) There's also a huge quantity of stuff including old engineering books and journals at www.archive.org and at www.http://openlibrary.org/ and at www.chestofbooks.com/ But be warned, these sites and subsequent reading will suck the hours out of your day! Kevin, NW England, UK ------- Gunsmith Kinks Volumes 1 through 4 are available at Brownell's gunsmithing supplies outlet: http://www.brownells.com/ as well as online through used book sources. Gunsmithing? Well gunsmithing is very much concerned with mostly metal- working (and a smattering of woodworking) along with special tools and materials and skills. I am not a gunsmith but have used Brownell's over 40 years for all sorts of tools and products that can be used for many non-firearm purposes. And over the years I had noticed they published a book called Gunsmith Kinks, but it was a bit expensive and I figured it would not be all that useful outside the gunsmithing world. Wrong. Really wrong. I was at a yardsale this fall when I spied the first two volumes of this series at $10 each. I quickly grabbed them and skimmed the contents. Wow, all sorts of tips and tricks that were applicable to non-firearm projects. And just as quickly I bought them. In the next few days I read them from cover to cover. Fascinating stories about metalworking and woodworking problems and innovative solutions that contributing gunsmiths had provided to the author, F.R. "Bob" Brownell. And a great many funny stories and jokes to lighten the technical tone. I won't, and can't, list all the subjects the books include: hundreds of tips about metal forming and shaping and machining and drilling and honing and polishing and finishing that can be applied to other projects that I/you might be working on in our lives. Ditto wood tips. And just a very few of those good tips make having each book volume worthwhile. Now I've got to track down the other volumes, hopefully at a good price at a used book outlet, but at full price if necessary. ------- NOTE TO FILE: Yes I know the title of this file is metal publications but the following messages turned up in the Oldtools email group [link is on my home page] suggesting suitable woodworking books for children. Had to share the suggestions with you folks. And all of you do some woodworking too, right? And you will definitely enjoy reading some of these books even if there are no children about to share them. ------- Date: Sun, 2 Dec 2012 07:38:05 -0700 From: "Ken Vaughn" Subject: Re: [OldTools] Best illustrated old tools book for children? > This is one of my favourites, just ordered a copy for my son, this old dust cover was much nicer - The Christmas miracle of Jonathan Toomey, "A woodcarver's broken and bitter heart warms to the spirit of the season" http://books.google.ie/books?id=YsEWAQAAMAAJ&source=gbs_similarbooks Beautiful illustrations of his old workshop with old wooden planes etc... Anyone else have any recommendations? < Toolchest, a primer of woodcraft by Jan Adkins (Walker and Company, NY) Suitable for children, less advanced but with great pencil drawings reminds me of my all time favorite Hand Tools, their way and workings by Aldren A. Watson (W.W. Norton and Company, NY and London) More advanced -- with 450 incredible drawings (mine is hardback, but I have seen this in paperback) Ken Vaughn ------- Date: Sat, 1 Dec 2012 22:31:45 -0600 From: Mark Lovett Wells Subject: Re: [OldTools] Best illustrated old tools book for children? I agree that Eric Sloane is hard to beat for illustrations. More suggestions: * "Diary of an Early American Boy" - This is worth listing twice. Try to get the hardback version. It has an awesome fold out in the middle. The text might be a little long-winded depending on the age of the kid. I read the book myself and then explained the pictures. That worked very well. * "Eric Sloane's Weather Book" - This is about weather, not old books, but my son and I enjoyed reading it together. I really like Eric Sloane, even though he can be a little grumpy sometimes. * "Grandpa's Workshop" by Maurice Pommier - This is the new book by Lost Art Press. I don't quite know what to say. The illustrations are awesome and very engaging. The text is odd. No, it is very odd. The first time I read it, it felt like a stream of consciousness acid trip. When I sat down to read it to my son, I slowed down and it made a little more sense. It's really several stories in one book. It alludes to alcoholism, killing of a brother, going to war and getting your hands blown off, and dying during a woodworking job. To make sure it is French, the adults drink wine at every meal. Also, there is a small illustration of a completely nude (but mostly obscured) sourceress riding a horse. The heaviest stuff is at the very end, so it's pretty easy to just stop and not finish the book and avoid most of that. * Little House books by Laura Ingalls Wilder - These are not specifically galoot-themed, but they took place when many of the tools we talk about were in high fashion. There is a brief discussion of shingle-making in Farmer Boy and it seems like Pa has to build a new house in just about every book. I highly recommend these. * "The Woodwright's Guide" by Roy Underhill - Awesome illustrations. Thumb through it and have the kid pick out what is interesting. You can explain why the guy at the bottom of the saw pit wears a hat, etc. * *Busy, Busy Town" by Richard Scarry - Has a sequence in it that shows how a tree is converted into boards. * "Woodworking with Kids" by Richard Starr - This is for adults to tell them how to teach kids hand tool woodworking. It's geared toward older (middle through high school) kids. * "Woodshop for Kids" by Jack McKee - This is also for adults. It's a little tedious to read as a galoot, but it has some good ideas for simpler projects for younger kids. * "Carpentry for Children" by Walker and Macaulay - Bust out your bell bottoms. This is the book I used when I was a kid to learn woodworking. It is written for kids and explains how to use a brace, drive nails, etc. * "Daddy, Can We Play in the Workshop?" - This is my book. It has pictures of my son and me playing in the workshop. The morale is "Power tools are too loud and dangerous." This is the kind of book you would read to a 3-5 year-old before bed. Mark ------- Re: Hand scraping [Metal_Shapers] Posted by: "johann_ohnesorg" bigdukeonex~xxgmx.de Date: Fri Dec 14, 2012 2:53 pm ((PST)) Visit youtube, search for scraping, watch every video uploaded by Nick Mueller. This is the primer you need for scraping. Cheers, Johann ------- Re: Hand scraping Posted by: "Joe" jhovelx~xxgmx.net Date: Sat Dec 15, 2012 6:49 am ((PST)) Hi Richard, I was one of the instigators of the first scraping class in Melbourne. If you have a look at the Australian Metalwork Forum http://www.woodworkforums.com/f65/ and search for scraping, you will find heaps of discussions, photos and explanations, including the blue, yellow and red dies, making scraping tools and sharpening and diamond honing etc., as well as links to references and other resources. The fascination is that you can do precision work down to microns accuracy with just hand tools and skill with a high degree of repeatability. Something that otherwise takes very expensive machinery to do. Cheers, Joe ------- Re: New to the discussion group - new Atlas 7B ow ner Posted by: "chrisw" in2steamx~xxwi.rr.com Date: Sun Dec 16, 2012 6:33 am ((PST)) Nelson Collar wrote: > Set me straight if I under the wrong process. When you scrape you are > trying to get the surface as flat as possible making the diagonal > marks then coming back and diagonal mark to the other side. > Simulating an X configuration, when done the scrapes fill with oil > making an invisible bearing. I did it on my Gingery shaper and it > worked very nicely. Merry Christmas and Happy New Years Nelson, I would say close, and since I doubt you made your gingery with Cast Iron the process would work although I cannot say I have tried with AL. I have only done cast iron, and some higher grade hot rolled. Just to give an example, start to finish. And this is after 13 hour shift so I am taking a few shortcuts here and my typing is not 100%. Let's say you have a box way like an Atlas has it has a been freshly machined on your favorite machine tool. Without consideration of other ways or interactions, you are trying to achieve flatness on this particular way. You have drawfiled (a step that is not needed but often speeds up the process) the surface to acceptable flatness. This with a good file and a keen eye will get you near .001 of the surrounding surface. You could stone it off also, basically making sure there are no burrs or swarf that could through you off. You then blue up your master, in this case we will say that it is a surface plate. With fresh machine marks and no other scraping I like to start a little thicker with the blue. I brayer out the blue in an area about 30% larger then the part to be spotted. You are looking for a nice even coat, hard to describe with text. You then set your part in the blued area on the master as close to vertical as possible, with a small amount of pressure you then move the part gently back forth then up and down once each direction. Then you lift up the part and turn so the blued side is up; every place that the bluing transferred is a high spot. Then you take your hand scraper properly sharpened and with the proper technique for the scraper (as there are different kinds) you remove the metal just below the high spots. Now this is where some vary, the scraper technique I was taught was very methodical. You pick a direction, typically it's 45 degrees to a reference surface for the first pass. You scrape the high spots in the same direction, never turning the scraper. I make a pass about 3/4 of inch cut hitting all the spots which fall in that particular row. I move up (into the swarf) after each row and reverse direction; ideally you try not to cut the same direction twice in the same spot. And I do not remove the swarf until I have finished and I am ready to re-blue on the master again. The swarf should resemble plow rows; I have found laser lines helpful doing this -- if I get called away I know where I was at and have a good reference point. I was taught to got back over 90 degress from the last pass, that is to say you should have 4 quadrants if done correctly. Also you add a small amount of step over on the next row, just like a mill you leave a small edge there when the scraper stops cutting. You then clean off the swarf, stone gently, and reblue again. Turn 90 and step over from your last pass and start over. After doing that for a few passes you start to spot out more. Hence you need to keep your blue thinner and thinner each brayer roll. The idea in the end is to have a certain amount of spots in a 1 inch area. 20-ish typically are good although it depends upon your goal. In theory you could get nearly 100% contact but I think you would go mad trying. This leaves you with a surface which to the master is flat. I should note that this is also used on round bearings as well so flat is used in this example, mating would be a better term. The more contact you get, the higher your stick slip becomes (similar to putting some thing very flat on glass with water). That is where the frosting process comes in, that is where your oil is retained. You actually destroy the flatness with little dimples or wells that the oil can sit in. As an aside, I have watched the nick muler videos and I don't think he has the greatest technique, scraping wise. He moves all over the place and he does a surface very quickly to me in comparison. If you scrape all the blue off in one pass you will have a hard time keeping constant depth of cut compared to a controlled stroke. He also blows the swarf off all the time. It may work perfectly fine for him, but I know in my experiences you would end fighting yourself when you start to spot out more. He does have the bluing down pat though. His frosting is not how I learned, but I have never been good at it and I might try his way to see if it works better. Best Regards, Chris ------- Re: New to the discussion group - new Atlas 7B ow ner Posted by: "Roger Olson" rnole11x~xxgmail.com Date: Sat Dec 15, 2012 5:33 pm ((PST)) Village Press has run a series of articles on scraping in one their magazines. [Home Shop Machinist in a 2011 and 2012 serialized article.] ------- [Subject is more about learning to use a metal lathe.] Re: Basic tools [myfordlathes] Posted by: "werealldoomed" sardinesarniex~xxyahoo.com Date: Mon Jan 28, 2013 11:03 am ((PST)) "dennisjohn671" wrote: > I have recently acquired a ML7 lathe with a few sundry tools. I have never used a lathe before, but am enjoying trying to understand it. Does,anyone have any suggestions as to what should comprise a basic set of tools for a beginner? Naturally, over time, this basic set would be added to. < Hi. You can learn a lot from youtube videos. There might not be too much actual Myford stuff, but with any manually operated centre lathe,the 'technology and technique' is broadly the same. Try watching a few of the 'myford boy' videos. Try myfordboy.blogspot.com or just use youtubes search facility for myfordboy. This guy is very talented, and his videos are a real pleasure to watch. Also have a look at mrpete222 on youtube. I believe he was a machine shop teacher before retirement. These people are experts, and you can learn a lot from them. Do bear in mind that these are not instructional videos for the complete beginner, though. They do, however, show what can be achieved on home machines,and some of the techniques involved. If you are trying to teach yourself turning, do be aware that although Myfords are a model makers size machine, they can still do you a real nasty if you get caught up at the rotating business end! Common sense dictates that you should keep fingers away from rotating parts or cutting tools, protect your eyes from flying chips, and keep loose clothing well away from rotating parts. The internet is a mine of information. If you wanted to know how to set a tool on centreline, for example, Google it...there will be people out there with videos showing how to do it. You just have to sort the wheat from the chaff.... Regards ------- Re: Basic tools Posted by: "iwhitex~xxrogers.com" iwhitex~xxrogers.com Date: Mon Jan 28, 2013 12:55 pm ((PST)) It would be difficult to do better than watching the very large series of YouTube videos by a guy in the USA using the pseudonym Tubalcain. Do a search for him. ------- Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2013 11:34:29 -0600 From: John Holladay Subject: [OldTools] For any of you that have interest in metal working. I suspect that you guys that are machinists or work with metal would enjoy this video. http://www.coolestone.com/media/5367/Holding-It-All-Together---Inspiring/ Doc John Holladay ------- Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2013 16:00:08 -0600 From: Subject: Re: [OldTools] For any of you that have interest in metal working. GG, Love Texas Country Reporter....wished we got it here in Ok. (Hell, I wished we had a DQ!) Probably nigh on 30 years ago, while on a quail hunting trip out in west central Texas, we came across an old gas station/mechanics shop that had a bunch of old line shaft machinery powered by straight 8 buick motor. About 3 yrs later the station had been torn down and replaced by a shiney new Texaco; where you pumped your own gas and the only thing they were capable of fixing was a flat....that's progress, I guess. roy griggs -------- Lindsay books [atlas_craftsman] Posted by: "nynjjoe" nynjjoex~xxaol.com Date: Sun Feb 24, 2013 4:21 pm ((PST)) Lindsay has retired and is no longer selling books. What is left of his inventory has been acquired by: Youroldtimebookstore.com ------- [myfordlathes] Re: 163 issues of Model Engineer's Workshop magazine for downloading Posted by: "Matt King" localadx~xxgmail.com Date: Thu Mar 7, 2013 12:32 am ((PST)) > Do you all know of this > http://archive.org/details/model-engineers-workshop > resource. It enables you to download all of the issues > from 1 to 163 with no restrictions or limits. Hi, Index can be found at http://www.homews-mew-index.co.uk/index.html ------- Re: New Guy Here [SherlineCNC] Posted by: bogie286x~xxyahoo.com Date: Sun Nov 3, 2013 9:54 am ((PST)) Hi Craig, I just joined and have the exact same question. Can anyone recommend a "CNC for Dummies" book somewhere? Thanks! Bill ------- Re: New Guy Here Posted by: "Andy Wander" andywanderx~xxyahoo.com Date: Sun Nov 3, 2013 10:33 am ((PST)) The best thing of that kind that I have seen is the "Using Mach3 Mill" manual, available on the artsoft website. ------- Re: New Guy Here Posted by: "Thomas D. Dean" tomdeanx~xxspeakeasy.org Date: Sun Nov 3, 2013 10:48 am ((PST)) CNC Reference by Peter Smid. A little pricey, but, complete. http://www.amazon.com/CNC-Programming-Handbook-Third-Edition/dp/0831133473 Tom Dean ------- NOTE TO FILE: The following book has also been recommended by Doc and I have the two volume print version. Well worth while reading and keeping as a permanent reference for all sorts of metalworking machines. ------- Burghardt book (was: Tailstock Alignment) [atlas_craftsman] Posted by: "Bruce ." freemab222x~xxgmail.com bakmthiscl Date: Sun Mar 30, 2014 7:07 am ((PDT)) Never having taken a shop course including the metal lathe, I found myself grasping for friend Garlinghouse's meaning when he spoke of the "quill" in a recent posting. Being too lazy to dig out a lathe book to look it up, I used Wikipedia instead, which put my doubts to rest: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tailstock But what caught my eye was the reference at the bottom to Burghardt's book, and a link that takes you there on Google Books. The whole book seems to be on-line. This is a book I have recommended to others (probably over this forum), and it is wonderful to be able to have it at one's fingertips. Bruce NJ ------- Re: Burghardt book (was: Tailstock Alignment) Posted by: "Doc" n8as1x~xxaol.com docn8as Date: Tue Apr 1, 2014 2:01 pm ((PDT)) FWIW Burghardt was head of high scool industrial ed in new jersey,,,,, & i reckon that is why, whenever i am confused, i go back to one of the 2 volumes & so far i have always understood, even if i dont remember ///both volumes are bedside.....much better suited to home shop use & older machines than current texts i have seen, which are geared to current industrial practice ...viz VERY little on a good finish cut ...why?, doesn't matter, it goes to the grinder for finish. that said, there IS value in later texts, but 50 hrs later, i refer to burghardt FIRST .....and Smiths advanced machine work has near every operation one wud undertake in student lesson form ....MIT shop instructor, unfortunately, the reprint is 3x a burghardt book. well over 1200 original pages...a 1926 machine operation bible ....it was probably expensive then, since the raggedy book my daddy left me does not bear his name, but that of a classmate. best wishes doc ------- Date: Wed, 18 Jun 2014 12:48:36 -0700 From: Brent Beach Subject: Re: [OldTools] Whatsit: Universal Screw Wrench On 2014-06-18 05:09, Michael Blair wrote: > The drawings by Mordecai for the Ordnance Department show Coes patent > wrenches, but photographs from the Civil War show some government > workers holding Merrick patent screw wrenches. A search based on Mike's information: Turned up this book, which you can download as a PDF, http://books.google.ca/books/download/The_Great_Industries_of_the_Un ited_State.epub?id=eo09AAAAYAAJ&output=epub Written by Horace Greeley, presumably of "Go West, Young Man" fame, published 1872. Over 1300 pages! It is a very large file - 113MB! It contains a lot of material that could be of interest to old tools folks. The table of contents Contents The Progress Of Industry In The United States Sewing Machines Printing And The Printing Press Watches And Machine Watch-Making Purifying And Heating Water For Steam Boilers, Steam Navigation Ship-Building Cabinet And Parlor Organs, Axes And Plows Manufacture Of Salt Coinage, Or Manufacture Of Money, The Ice Trade Water Wheels, Lithography Stereotyping And Electrotyping, Book-Making, Knitting Machines, Writing Paper, Glue Veneering Education: Economical And Efficient Cutlery Cigars And Manufactured Tobacco Confectionery: Honest And Dishonest Sugar Refining Fire Department Supplies Brushes And Their Manufacture, Cordage Curtain Fixtures Horse Shoe Nails Petroleum Gas Fixtures And Lamps Piano-Fortes Mowers And Bbapbbs, Iron And Its Preparation, Saws And Their Manufacture, Ornamental Iron Work And Bronze Castings, Billiards And Billiard Tables Bells, History And Manufacture Wire-Drawing Starch Artificial Limbs Jewelry And Its Manufacture Stoves And Ranges, Files And Their Manufacture Quill And Metallic Pens, Printing Inks Paper Hangings Fire Pumps Thread Machinery Coal Copper Wood Engraving Steel And Copper-Plate Engraving, Scales White Lead And Paints Beds Steam And The Steam Engine, Calico Printing Narrow Gauge Railroads Sewing Silk And Machine Twist Hinges, Fire-Arms Latest Improvements In Utilization Of Steam Architectural Iron Work Bank Note Engraving, Clothing Armored Vessels And Artillery Linen Collar And Cuff Manufacture, Railroad Cars Hair Cloth Furs And The Fur Trade, Fire-Works Card Clothing Calliopes Shot Gloves Oil Cloth The Alden Processes, Soap, Its History And Manufacture, Iron Working Machinery Agricultural Hand Implements, Lasts Gunpowder The Express Business Fancy Loom Making, American Lead Pencils Contents Rules Brooms, Gold Mining Mercury, Or Quicksilver Mirrors, Silk Dress Goods Hats And Their Manufacture Illuminating Gas, Narrow Textile Fabrics Carriage-Building, Fish Hooks And Fishing Tackle, Lumber And Lumbering Pottery And Porcelain, Carpets Steam Fire Engines Britannia Ware Screws, Life Insurance, The Tariff, A Protection To Manufactures, Photography, A New Method Of Transportation Glass, Fermented Liquors, Screw-Wrenches Woollen Manufactures Modern Invention In Domestic Industry, Steel The Gatling Gun Cheese And Its Manufacture Chilled Rolls Cotton Manufactures Caoutchouc, Or India Rubber The Pitch-Pine And Its Products Varnish, Flour, Silver Mining Safes And Safety Locks, Railroads, Rolled Sheet Brass, Hoisting Machinery, Lead And Zinc, Small Nails And Tacks, Banks And Banking, Furniture, Chemical Manufactures The Post Office Pool-Cotton Thread Clocks Paper Furnishing Goods Fire Insurance Linen Fire Hose The Treasury Church Organs Combs Buttons Hotels, Hydraulic Water Power, Fish Culture, Gas And Water Pipe Newspapers Matches, American Magnetic Telegraph, Ladies' Boots And Shoes Wood Type, Carriage Axles And Springs Stencil Plates Hooks And Eyes Pins Quarries Brent Beach Victoria, BC, Canada ------- Re: Newbie to Group [atlas_craftsman] Posted by: wa5cabx~xxcs.com wa5cab Date: Sat Jul 19, 2014 10:08 am ((PDT)) Robert, The best two versions of the MOLO (Manual of Lathe Operation...) to have with a 101.07403 are the 1955 Craftsman edition (black front cover says Craftsman) or the Copyright 1937 edition (black Atlas cover) that has pages bound into Part (Chapter) 7 with the first page saying among other things "Sears Master Craftsman 12 Inch". My third choice would be the 1988 edition currently still sold by Clausing as the wire binding makes it easier to use. But it has no photos of the early machines. All of the general information plus the Change Gear threading tables are applicable. As Scott mentioned, the 12X30 (and 12X18) models are less common than the 12X24 and 12X36, because Atlas quit making the 36" and 42" beds circa 1948. So yours will have been made before that. If you can find the serial number, I can probably give you an estimate of the year it was made. But the only really accurate way to date it is, as Scott also said, to look at the dates on the two spindle bearings. It will have been made within a few months to a year after the later date. Besides the parts manual, there are a number of other mostly one or two page files in the group's Files section on Yahoo. The MOLO isn't there because of possible copyright issues. There is also, or will be shortly, a file detailing the differences between the 33 MOLO editions and a table showing which version most closely applies to which lathe model. Robert Downs - Houston wa5cab dot com (Web Store) MVPA 9480 ------- NOTE TO FILE: One very extensive early publication on metalworking is Metalworking: A Book of Tools, Materials, and Processes for the Handyman by Paul N. Hasluck in 1904. This book used to be available for free download from Google Books for those in the U.S. but most folks elsewhere were out of luck. This is a large book of more than 700 pages. Here is a link for a free 45MB download that does work for anyone, anywhere, from wkFineTools.com http://www.wkfinetools.com/mLibrary/mLibrary_index-1.asp Also note that this fine website provides many more books available for download. ------- Re: Help for a newb [TAIGTOOLS] Posted by: "David Beierl" dbeierlx~xxattglobal.net dgbeierl Date: Mon Dec 15, 2014 1:47 pm ((PST)) At 11:43 PM 12/14/2014, marksichermanx~xxgmail.com [TAIGTOOLS] wrote: >Thanks for your input and sorry for the delay. My kids are home >from college for the holidays so it's been family time and I've been >trying to get as much time in with them as I can before they head back >again. I was surprised by that figure - 5x the diameter for max >extension. I know ZERO about machine work. I clearly need to read a book! Mark, you're not saying who you're talking to (or referencing the post). From context I'm pretty sure you're talking to me in this one. You're very welcome. Yeah, I hate that figure. I ought to be able to do roughing twenty diameters out, it's my right as a wishful thinker. Cleaning the dirt off the engine before I open it up is way too hard, so therefor I'm not bound by that. I wish I were kidding, I was forty before I got over that attitude, mostly. Pretty funny because rationally I'd have laughed at such a silly thing, but you're talking to a guy whose rear brakes had a problem so he replaced the pads in the front ones because he'd never worked on drum brakes and was scared of them. Stuffed those pads in outside the parts store and drove away. Even I heard the universe laughing that time. Anyway...it's not hard and fast. But if you think in those terms you'll be expecting the kinds of problems that come. It helps some to look at the amount of meat in industrial machines and start thinking of ours in terms of spaghetti rather than the Rock of Gibraltar - which I guess is like Swiss cheese anyway. Atlas MOLO (manual Of lathe Operation). Clausing Industrial is the present name of the folks who built Atlas lathes and still support them better than we have any right to expect. Book was $25 last I knew, late-70s edition. Or ebay facsimiles of various editions. L.H.Sparey, _The Amateur's Lathe_, I got a paperback from Cabela years ago and a hardback direct from UK via Amazon Books more recently. Highly recommended, Sparey was a British model engineer (who was the model for the main character in Nevil Shute's _Trustee In the Toolroom_, wonderful book if you like that sort of thing). He worked in postwar England, a time and culture that tended very strongly toward rolling your own rather than looking in catalog(ue)s. The hardback lies flat nicely, the paperback has darker print. Minor difference either way. South Bend _How To Run A Lathe_ - the book everyone knows about. Useful, but aimed at getting an apprentice up and running industrially. Prominent exhortation early on IIRC that not taking deep enough roughing cuts is stealing bread from your employer's children. Sheldon Lathe _Their Version Of a Lathe Book_ (sorry, it's around here somewhere) Slender compared with Atlas and South Bend but I wouldn't turn down a copy. Sheldon lathes went into a lot of US Army mobile machine shops in WWII. Burghard _Machine Tool Operation_ in two volumes, a modern classic. If you only get one, Vol I covers lathes. There's a lot out there, but those could keep you busy for a day or six. There was a revolution in machine shop practice in the early 20th century with the advent of high speed steel tools, and Frederick Taylor, the man (infamous in some circles) who invented time study and for whom the Taylor Split on your stopwatch was named, earlier in his career did a definitive study of tool geometry and production rates that laid down the standard forms and angles. Almost anything written between then and say 1970 is probably applicable to us; and the 1995 edition of some work may say a good deal less to us than the 1955 edition. Oxtoolco, myfordboy, mrpete222 aka tubalcain (infer nothing from the order) have voluminous youtube output and anyone highly respected by them or their viewers is a good bet. Keith Fenner likewise, too lazy to find his exact user name. He's a pro running a job shop on Cape Cod and sharp as a tack. "Get 'er done!" tubalcain spent his life as a shop instructor and is continuing in his retirement to cast his bread upon the waters. Myfordboy is a British amateur don't know his background. He's very interested in casting. The Oxtool guy runs a shop. He's not Keith Fenner but then nobody is Keith Fenner. Fenner listens to him, 'nuff said. aduinoversusevil can be a jerk but he has things to say. ClarkAndDawe are vicious political satirists from OZ. Doubleboost...well. He's amazing, but he's a Geordie through and through. If UK detective shows give you a hard time you're in for a real treat with this man. It may take a bit before you notice he's speaking English at all. But check him out, he has devoted viewers who understand a quarter of what he says. No asparagus cast on anyone not mentioned. The Youtube folks mentioned have a wide range of video production ability and/or interest. Some go for economy of expression, some ramble. Regardless, they're all putting a lot of work into teaching what they know and they all have a lot to say. Yours, David Beierl (Atlas 6x18 lathe, Taig mill) ------- corrigenda Re: [TAIGTOOLS] Help for a newb Posted by: "David Beierl" dbeierlx~xxattglobal.net dgbeierl Date: Mon Dec 15, 2014 3:43 pm ((PST)) *arduinoversusevil, not aduinoversusevil. *_Trustee --> From <-- the Toolroom_. I can't believe I did that, that would be a different book entirely. It's an expert model engineer who survives on a pittance from a model engineering magazine. His brother- in-law leaves child in his care while the couple sail around the world and die on a reef in Tuamoto or summat. The child's patrimony is concealed in a box of smuggled diamonds** concreted into the yacht's keel. Hero sets out with no resources except the shirt on his back and a running engine model to get them back and discovers he has loyal friends in high places all over the world, magazine discovers they've been underpaying him. Cue music. My eyes are wet right now. **The point of the trip was to get cash out of England unsuspected so the brother-in-law could emigrate. Postwar England was a tough place to live, I think they finished with food rationing around 1952. Yours, David Beierl ------- Re: Machinist mag's [atlas_craftsman] Posted by: n5kzwx~xxarrl.net n5kzw Date: Fri Jan 2, 2015 10:29 am ((PST)) Have y'all checked the database of HSM/MW at homeshopmachinist.net? They have a good article search engine. Regards, Ed ------- Re: Machinist mag's Posted by: "David Hair" thehairsx~xxoptilink.us dhlh1984 Date: Fri Jan 2, 2015 12:22 pm ((PST)) Ed, I've looked at their database and it is nice. What I'm really wanting is something on my own computer where I can sort it the way I want. I would sure like to download all that data where all I had to do was move the issue info and set my own sort keys. David Hair Dalton, GA ------- Atlas Machine Database By Robert Downs Re: New Machine Database information [atlas_craftsman Group at Yahoo] Posted by: wa5cabx~xxcs.com wa5cab Date: Sun Feb 1, 2015 11:07 pm ((PST)) Group. After more hours than I am going to admit, I finally got the machine and serial number database running I think well enough that it can maybe be used. I recreated and started the thing over from scratch several times in the past month. Unfortunately, there is no provision to import the format so each time I had to do from scratch. Everyone is invited to take a look. It is the one with a title of Atlas_Craftsman Machine Database and today's date. I deleted the other small ones but NEO will not let me delete the old one with around 200 entries. Or edit it. If you try to look at or add to the new one, you are going to run into some of the NEO nonsense. The search function (which is more correctly a filter function as it does not show or hi-lite what it finds) seems to work OK. The sort function does not work properly on the entire 442 current records other that on the ROW numbers. However, if you filter what's displayed down to under about 50 records and then click to switch between Ascending and Descending several times, it will finally (usually) settle down and mostly work. Another bug that I discovered is that if you enter a string to search (filter) on, like MK2, the button that you would assume you should click does nothing. Enter your search string and then press the Enter key on your keyboard and it will work. Note that some two or three character strings don't work. MF is one. MFA or B or C do work. To clear the search filter, click in the box and then press ENTER. There are a total of 12 fields (columns) (13 counting Row). In the default "Relaxed" view, 5 are visible at any one time, plus row, which is pinned to the left side. When I started there were 20 and it took forever to get to the right end. I either deleted or combined six of them with others. It works much better with only 12. To get all the way to the righthand column, click 7 times at no faster than two clicks per second, and wait for it to catch up. To see all 12 columns at once, click Actions and under Vew click Slim. However, about the only thing that's good for is to see all 12 headers at once. As you move to the right, the rows tend to move up the screen. It finally dawned on me the reason is that some of the fields to the right have more text in them and take up more vertical space. So make a mental note of the Row number you are looking at before you start moving to the right. Before you just jump in and start adding your machine, try to see whether it is already in the database. If you ever entered yours in the old database, it is probably still there. I only deleted maybe 20 records that had so little actual information filled in that all you could tell was that it was a lathe and probably an Atlas or Craftsman one. If you find yours, click the pencil at the left end of the row and enter the missing information instead of adding a new record. All of the MK2's that I was sent information on have been entered. I think. Robert Downs - Houston wa5cab dot com (Web Store) MVPA 9480 ------- Re: Looking for old files [atlas_craftsman] Posted by: wa5cabx~xxcs.com wa5cab Date: Mon Feb 16, 2015 2:50 pm ((PST)) In a message dated 02/16/2015: > Robert, Didn't the files section used to have sears power tool catalog files. I'm looking for late forties catalogs that cover the AA 109.20630 6" lathe. If anyone has 1 1948 sears power tool catalog they would consider getting rid of I would be interested. I would also be interested in photocopies of the 109.20630 lathe and tooling pages. > Thanks all David Hair Dalton, GA David, I don't think any of the Craftsman Power Tool catalogs were ever up on Yahoo before today. When I started doing the care and feeding of Files, the storage limit was 100 MB. I moved whatever catalogs were there, plus a few other things over to _Projects, (one of the overflow Groups that were set up) so that all or most of the manuals would fit on here. Then after the NEO upheaval bumped the storage up significantly, I moved everything back. If they had ever been here, they still would. I've been meaning to upload the Craftsman Power Tools catalogs for about a year more. They all (except for the few lathe pages out of the Big Book) came from a site named RoseAntiqueTools.com. I didn't worry about putting them on Yahoo because anyone who asked could be directed to Rose. I think but am not certain that the owner's name was Rose. His widow had a message on the site saying that she was going to maintain it, but it is now gone. The reason that I never put them up on Yahoo before was that their file size ranged from 5 to 30 MB. So it would have taken about four or five Groups to store all of them. I discovered today that the single file size upload limit is 10 MB. So I had to double compress about a third of them to get them under that. Those are the files whose name ends in "/metal/Comp.pdf". The Rose collection ran continuous up to 1972/73 less 1934 and 1971. I acquired originals of those plus the remainder out to 1982 but haven't yet scanned them. What I uploaded today, less 1934, brackets the entire production of the early 6", 9" and early 12" that Sears sold. Aside from 1934, Sears apparently did not publish a Power Tools or Power and Hand Tools during any years not present. I came across a list someone researched and prepared and aside from 1934, it matched what Rose had. As far as Vintage Machinery is concerned, I had just assumed that someone there would have grabbed everything from Rose before it was shut down. I might look into that again. Also, I discovered a trick that may be of some use to someone. After I uploaded all of the ones that were under 10 MB, I tried several different ways to reduce them further with Acrobat, none of which achieved any significant reduction. What worked, and didn't take very long, was to open them with IrfanView and just save (or save-as) them. That reduced files varying between 10.3 and 30 MB to between 7 and 9 MB. So I didn't have to convert all of them to grayscale, which would have been much more work. Robert Downs - Houston wa5cab dot com (Web Store) MVPA 9480 ------- Date: Mon, 4 May 2015 13:41:51 -0700 From: Kirk Eppler Subject: [OldTools] Forgotten Books Hey all. While tracking down information on another topic, I found a link to forgottenbooks.org Scanned and online version of books from long ago. Here is a link to the carpentry section. Almost 500k books online they claim. http://www.forgottenbooks.com/Technology_and_Engineering/Carpentry Read them online, download PDFs, many options with and without signing up. Kirk Eppler in HMB, who spent some garage cleaning time last night. Not nearly enough to make an impact. But progress. ------- Date: Tue, 05 May 2015 10:50:14 -0600 From: Don Schwartz Subject: Re: [OldTools] Forgotten Books A lot of old books were digitized by Google. For instance http://books.google.ca/books/about/The_Mechanic_s_Companion_Or_The_El ements.html?id=_XYOAAAAYAAJ and can be found in Google books. Many can be located using the search feature at http://onlinebooks.library.upenn.edu/ e.g. http://onlinebooks.library.upenn.edu/webbin/book/lookup name?key=Nicholson%2C%20Peter%2C%201765-1844 although the books may be stored elsewhere, such as this http://catalog.hathitrust.org/Record/011616734 There is also this http://www.unz.org/Pub/NicholsonPeter-1832 which has a particularly quick interface for page-flipping. And this: https://openlibrary.org/search/subjects?q=woodworking&search= There are others as well, but I can't seem to remember where... Don ------- Mr. Pete aka tubalcain on Youtube [atlas_craftsman] Posted by: ddazerx~xxsbcglobal.net daviddazer Date: Fri Jun 19, 2015 4:39 pm ((PDT)) How many of you enjoy his tutorials? I think he is just the best! Dave ------- Re: Mr. Pete aka tubalcain on Youtube Posted by: john8366x~xxatt.net john8366x~xxatt.net Date: Fri Jun 19, 2015 7:09 pm ((PDT)) Mr Pete is great, I wish I could have had him for shop class. His explanations are detailed and very informative. John ------- Re: Mr. Pete aka tubalcain on Youtube Posted by: "Scott Henion" shenionx~xxshdesigns.org shdesigns2003 Date: Fri Jun 19, 2015 10:20 pm ((PDT)) He is good but I find I fast forward through a lot of his stuff. Great for beginners but he tends to get repetitive. I watch Keth Fenner, Adam Booth, Oxtoolco, Keith Rucker, Randy Richard, Stan at BarZIndustrial, and James Kilroy most. I learn a lot more from them. I have over 40 channels subscribed on youtube. Most are machining or welding related. No cable or sat here ;) Rather watch something interesting with no commercials when I want. Scott G. Henion, Stone Mountain, GA Craftsman 12x36 lathe: http://shdesigns.org/Craftsman12x36 Welding pages and homemade welder: http://shdesigns.org/Welding ------- Re: Mr. Pete aka tubalcain on Youtube Posted by: "Kevin Morgan" kmorgan6x~xxoptonline.net kevinj631 Date: Sat Jun 20, 2015 2:17 am ((PDT)) Yes, his videos are great for those of us who are hobbyists with no formal metalworking training. I've watched over 200 of his videos alone! He has some new ones about to be uploaded on the Atlas/Craftsman 12" specifically. Kevin J Morgan ------- Re: Mr. Pete aka tubalcain on Youtube Posted by: "Dave Pinella" dpinellax~xxcinci.rr.com aerologic_psw Date: Sat Jun 20, 2015 2:34 am ((PDT)) "The Lazy Machinest" guy out of Canada is pretty good too. Mark Eclour or something like that. Ex instructor... All the other names mentioned I like too. Dave P, near Cincinnati ------- Re: MakeCNC DVD... is it worth it? [SherlineCNC] Posted by: "Stan Stocker" skstockerx~xxcomcast.net stanstocker Date: Sun Aug 23, 2015 4:27 am ((PDT)) Greetings, I guess if you never saw a mill before, never had a sherline mill, never plugged in any appliance, and didn't know what a stepper is, it MIGHT have minimal value. I bought it when wanting to convert my little Sherline mill to CNC, didn't learn a single thing. Watched it once, thought it a waste of money and half an hour of my life I'll never get back. The G-Code examples they say are on the web sight are not anywhere to be found, emails went unanswered. Buy a couple of nice endmills with your money, or a good book. If you are wanting to get a good overview of the entire process, the book "CNC Milling In The Workshop" by Marcus Bowman is probably the best all in one book I know of. Plan on reading some chapters several times. Well written, but he actually teaches the what and why in addition to the how. It's only 130 pages, lots of photos and drawings. You'll know a lot more once you absorb a chapter than you would from a do this, don't ask why, it's complicated sort of light weight approach. Examples in Mach3 and Linuxcnc flavors. Lots of example G code, also lightly covers cam (cut-2d) and general machining issues. It is NOT Sherline specific, but that's not such a deal. The web is full of sample config files and setup instructions for these machines, and as your controller is probably different from mine, your backlash is different, your sense of speeds is different, different steppers, all that stuff our configurations will be different. One size fits one person :-) Usual disclaimer, no commercial interest, don't know the author, just think it's pretty darn good. Take care, Stan ------- Rotary Engraving Manual [atlas_craftsman] Posted by: "Pete Mclaughlin" pete_mclaughlin_93555x~xxyahoo.com Date: Mon Aug 24, 2015 9:20 am ((PDT)) I just bought a Green Instrument Company rotary engraving pantograph. After cleaning it up I looked around for a book on now to engrave signs as the owner's manual is no more than a set up and buy some accessories book. I found an excellent book on the subject from an United Kingdom site. "The Manual for Machine Engravers" by Charles Harwood-Matthews first published in 1993 but is now out of print and fetching $153 bucks used on Amazon.com Some diligent searching of the web located a pdf version of the book on a UK school site: http://people.albion.edu/rhoughto/PDF/Engraving/Engravers%20Man ual%20Finished.pdf I have read about half the book so far and can say the author knew the business and provides practical ideas about how to pick a rotary engraver and how to use it down to how to sharpen the bits, whether to pick high speed steel or carbide for a particular material and what materials you can engrave on and how they handle. (Stainless steel is tough to work with engravers, brass is a delight, etc.) If you are considering a rotary engraver or have one you should read this book. By the way I am looking for accessories for the Green Instrument Company Model 106 engraver. Especially a work holding self centering vice made by Green Instrument company for this machine. Also I turned a new spindle for this engraver that has a Dremel collet and nut which allows me to use all the Dremel 1/8th inch shaft tooling in this rotary engraver. This is a very useful modification. Sincerely Pete McLaughlin ------- New file uploaded to myfordlathes [myfordlathes] Posted by: myfordlathesx~xxyahoogroups.com Date: Sat Sep 26, 2015 1:12 pm ((PDT)) Hello, This email message is a notification to let you know that a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the myfordlathes group. File: /Garners_book_of_the_Myford.pdf Uploaded by: kstrauss7 Description: I have OCR'd and deskewed the pages in the version earlier uploaded by John. You can access this file at the URL: https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/myfordlathes/files/Garners_bo ok_of_the_Myford.pdf Regards, kstrauss7 ------- [atlas_craftsman Yahoo group -- free copies in the Files there] Re: Where to get a copy of the Lathe Manual book for the Atlas Lathes... Posted by: wa5cabx~xxcs.com wa5cab Date: Sun Nov 15, 2015 9:37 pm ((PST)) There are six different "1937" versions and a total of fourteen different versions of the Atlas MOLO. The first six I have numbered 1937V0 through 1937V5 (not 1 to 6 because I didn't discover that version zero existed until more than a year after I had set up the version numbering system). All versions printed between 1937 and 1954 just say "Copyright 1937" on the copyright page. Atlas did not begin assigning Edition numbers and showing the print history until 1955 with versions 1955V6 and 1955V7. Robert Downs - Houston wa5cab dot com (Web Store) MVPA 9480 ------- ------------------------------------------------------------------ This is just one of some 80 files about machining and metalworking and useful workshop subjects that can be read at: http://www.janellestudio.com/metal/index.html ------------------------------------------------------------------