This is just one of some 80 files about machining and metalworking and useful workshop subjects that can be read at: http://www.janellestudio.com/metal/index.html ------------------------------------------------------------------ Here are some of the safety issues discussed in the various groups that I follow. Working with metals and machinery and chemicals and electrical equipment is inherently dangerous. Wear safety devices and clothing as appropriate. Remove watches, rings, and jewellery -- and secure or remove loose clothing -- before operating any machine. BEWARE: DO NOT ASSUME that any subject matter or procedure or process is safe or correct or appropriate just because it was mentioned in a news/user group or was included in these files or on this site or on any other web site or was published in a magazine or book or video. Read, understand and follow the latest operating procedures and safety instructions provided by the manufacturer of your machine or tool or product. If you do not have those most recent official instructions, acquire a copy through the manufacturer before operating or using their product. Where the company no longer exists, use the appropriate news or user group to locate an official copy. Be careful -- original instructions may not meet current safety standards. Updated safety information and operating instructions may also be available through a local club, a local professional in the trade, a local business, or an appropriate government agency. In every case, use your common sense before beginning or taking the next step; and do not proceed if you have any questions or doubts about any procedure, or the safety of any procedure. Follow all laws and codes, and employ certified or licenced professionals as required by those laws or codes. Hazardous tasks beyond your competence or expertise should also be contracted to professionals. Let's be really careful out there. If you got to this file directly from my HOME PAGE, return there by using your browser's back button. BUT if you came to this file as the result of a web search engine, see many additional files on my home page Machining and Metalworking at Home http://www.janellestudio.com/metal/index.html (c) Copyright 2003 - 2015 Machining and Metalworking at Home The form of the collected work in this text file (including editing, additions, and notes) is copyrighted and this file is not to be reproduced by any means, including electronic, without written permission except for strictly personal use. ==================================================================== Date: Wed, 7 Mar 2001 06:20:15 -0500 From: "Dan Statman" Subject: Re: Explosive Metal ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bruce" To: Sent: Tuesday, March 06, 2001 11:17 PM Subject: [sherline] Explosive Metal >> Ok, I learned that Aluminum dust is flammable and explosive, and that it can be related to medical problems such as memory lost. (Gee, I already have enough problems in this dept. :-) ) This was all new to me. Now are there any other metals that have unusually properties that I should be aware of. Bruce Snowden Not wanting to create a neighborhood incident. << Be very careful if you machine ANY grade of titanium. The small chips and dust are highly flammable and the friction from the cutting tool can be enough to ignite them. This is the only metal that burns in nitrogen (the major component of air), and there is no way to stop its progress except to smother it with sand (or equivalent). A fire extinguisher is used only to put out the other things which catch fire from the burning titanium. The fire hazard of titanium is greatest when using emery cloth to polish away machining marks. Hope this helps somebody, Daniel J. Statman, Statman Designs http://members.rennlist.com/statmandesigns ---------------------------- Date: Wed, 07 Mar 2001 22:34:43 +1100 From: Ken Price Subject: Re: Explosive Metal My father-in-law bought his as-new asian lathe from a guy who had set up in business making high-performance barrels for Harley-Devidson motorcycles. He was machining them from solid castings of magnesium the size of a large coffee can, boring them out for a cast-iron sleeve and turning cooling fins. He collected the waste (lots of it) and had it re-cast. When we collected the lathe, the room under his house was about 6" deep in magnesium turnings. If you remember magnesium burning in high school, it emits a bright white light and is almost unquenchable (in fact flash bulbs used Mg wire). If this guy had ever got a flame under that Mg the entire suburb would have burnt.... We grabbed the lathe as quick as we could, keeping an eye on the exit at all times. Needless to say his business acumen was on a par with his safety knowledge, which is why he was selling up. And the lathe was an absolute bargain. So, yes, other metals are dangerous, Mg being flammable (or, more specifically, hard to extinguish) KP ----------------------------------- Date: Wed, 07 Mar 2001 08:36:43 -0500 From: Jim Ash Subject: Re: Explosive Metal Some of this thread makes machining sound like fireworks manufacture. Sure there's risks, but c'mon. Most things in life worth doing have some associated risk. If you use normal safety procedures (eye/hearing protection), clean up after your work sessions, and you work with 'normal' materials, you'll be fine. If you purchase new (to you) or strange materials and this is a concern, ask for the MSDS (Material Safety Data Sheet) for the stuff. These contain a wealth of health safety information with regards to handling, use, flammability, toxicity, sometimes machinability, as well as the bad habits and gotchas a given material might have. Some are available online. If you come across some strange stuff that looks like it could be machined, find out what it is first. A friend found a junk block of Beryllium that he wanted to machine. This stuff (and its salts) are major toxic. I told him his choices were to gear up for toxic material management, or find some other material. He used Aluminum instead. Personally, I won't turn stuff until I know what it is. Jim Ash --------------------------- Date: Sat, 31 Mar 2001 07:13:55 -0600 From: "Dana Zimmerman" Subject: RE: PARTING TROUBLE The best thing you can do for parting is turn the tool upside down. Seriously. Most lathe operations have an inherent engineering problem, in that the cutting forces tend to flex the tool and tool post down and forward into the work piece. This is especially bad for parting, which is a grabby kind of cut and tool. This strategy also reduces the very real danger in parting. The wisest machinists with the "modern" lathes that have a cross slide that is long enough, put the parting tool behind the work piece and upside down. In this arrangement, when the tool grabs, the tool post flexes away from the work, and releases the pressure on the tool rather than making it worse. It will work with the tool in front of the work, but in this case you have to turn the lathe "backward" which could unscrew the darn chuck. My father apprenticed as a machinist in the 1920's and has told me that when he started out, every machine shop had a couple of guys with eye patches in the manner of Long John Silver. The cause was usually the parting tool. When a parting tool grabs, and the tool post flexes, the tool digs in and if the lathe has the power, the tool will break in such a way that it sends a triangle of high-speed steel, at high speed, exactly at the right angle to get the machinist leaning over the lathe in the eye. Wear your safety glasses! --------------------------- From: Tom Benedict Date: Tue Jul 10, 2001 10:52 am Subject: Re: [taigtools] Safety One other cautionary tale, and a note of thanks to the folks at Taig: Unless you tighten the 3-jaw chuck, spinning up the motor "unscrolls" the jaws, and they open to their widest position. (I'm assuming this is true for any tommy-bar 3-jaw chuck. Not sure if it's true for a keyed 3-jaw chuck, because I've never made that mistake with one and don't plan on trying it, just to find out.) The Taig 3-jaw chuck has two-piece, removable jaws. Somewhere along the line, Forrest must've decided that with a soft-jaw chuck, there wouldn't really be a need for reversible jaws. So the Taig 3-jaw STOPS unscrolling before the jaws are allowed to come out. What this means is that not tightening the 3-jaw chuck, and turning on the motor will open the jaws to their widest position, but that's it. With another chuck (such as the Sherline 3-jaw, which as hardened, ground, reversible jaws), that wouldn't be the case. The jaws could easily become projectiles. Not a slam on 3-jaws with removable jaws! I used them for years, and at some point would like to adapt a Sherline 3-jaw to my Taig. I just got lucky and made this mistake with a 3-jaw that didn't let go of its jaws. I got REALLY lucky. Tom On Mon, 9 Jul 2001 acharlestox~xxh... wrote: > A cautionary tale. > Changing from a collet back to the lathe's four-jaw chuck I noticed > that the five-step pulley on the motor had slipped out of alignment. > I hand-tightened the chuck, reset the pulley and put the belt on the > first, fastest speed, grooves, and briefly ran the motor up. > When I switched off I was horrified to see the chuck unscrewing from > the spindle. I got out of the way in time as the chuck landed on the > lathe bed then shot past me and hit the wall three feet behind. > The jaws were inside the chuck body circumference so physical damage > to the chuck and lathe bed were minimal. > > When the sparks died down and I sat down to think about it I realised > that the energy in a three to four pound chunk of steel spinning at > about 6000 rpm would have caused serious injury if it had hit me > rather than the brick wall. Had I been sitting in my usual position > on a high stool instead of standing, I might not have been able to > get out of the way and then the chuck would have hit my chest. > > I like to believe that I am careful and safety-conscious, but this > happened so easily! Experienced machinists are probably aware of > this potential hazard, but the messages posted on the site indicate > that there are lots of newcomers to lathe work who might do the same > sort of thing. > > Hopefully this note may prevent a similar event. ------------------------- From: n2562001x~xxy... Date: Tue Jul 10, 2001 12:53 pm Subject: Re: Safety Tom has a good point. However even worse is to put the lathe in reverse and have the chuck come off. Back when I was young and dumb I tried this on a 12" Atlas lathe with a 6" chuck. When I hit reverse I can still see the chuck coming off. It came off and spun in mid air for a split second, fell behind the lathe, came out the bottom between my legs and took out a couple of cement blocks in the wall across the basement. This is always a good excuse to change your shorts that week. Jerry Kieffer -------------- From: Tom Benedict Date: Tue Jul 10, 2001 3:48 pm Subject: Re: [taigtools] Re: Safety On Tue, 10 Jul 2001, Larry Richter wrote: > Now I suppose I should tell you about the power feed on the mill and > the carbide shrapnel. This reminds me of something! Back when I was still DOING doing astronomy (actually using a telescope rather than just working in a lab), I was talking to an industrial engineer about the way a telescope dome is laid out. To make a long story short, he was horrified. He lectured me sternly, impressing on me that when it comes to industrial robots, the A#1 rule of safety is, "Stay out of the machine's work cell." The idea is that a robot can make sudden motions that to you would seem unpredictable, so if you're in its work cell, you're almost guranteed to get hurt at some point in time. A telescope is a big honkin' industrial robot. Unless you're in the control room, you're out on the dome floor, right smack in the middle of the thing's work cell. And yeah people get hurt. Machining's pretty similar. I've used mills with power feed on all three axes, and now I've used a benchtop CNC mill (love my Taig!) In the normal course of work, my hands are way inside the machine's work cell. It's par for the course. I don't know if you could do machining any other way. I guess the upshot of all this is that in doing astronomy or machining, you are essentially putting yourself in harm's way. Always keep track of where things are, what they're doing, how they're moving, and know how to cut the power if things get ugly. Tom P.S. Yeah, and don't ever grab a spinning chuck that's trying to get loose. LET IT GO! ;) (No, I haven't done this one, and no, I don't plan on it.) --------------------- From: "Robin S." Date: Sat Jul 14, 2001 2:05 am Subject: Re: Safety > Machining's pretty similar. I've used mills with power feed on all three > axes, and now I've used a benchtop CNC mill (love my Taig!) In the normal > course of work, my hands are way inside the machine's work cell. It's par > for the course. I don't know if you could do machining any other way. Tom, although this is true on knee, bed and mini-mills, all VMC's are enclosed. This is an esspecially good feature when your rapid moves are measured in the thousands of inches per minute. Of course, on larger bed and knee mills, you have a large table moving around, unenclosed. I suppose that's one reason why such mills have such cruddy rapid moves. With these mills, you have a much better chance of getting bonked by the table than getting your fingers cut off :) --------------------- From: Tom Benedict Date: Sat Jul 14, 2001 8:25 am Subject: Re: [taigtools] Re: Safety Ironically, what you said about getting fingers cut off reminded me... I used to work in a frame shop. There were LOTS of opportunities there to lose fingers and other body parts. We cut big-ass pieces of glass, we chopped frames made out of the same wood that's used in baseball bats, and we had a metal saw for cutting metal frames. Any one of these could result in arterial bleeding pretty easily. The chopper and metal saw could take bits off of you before you even knew it happened. But you know what people got hurt on? The paper cutter. Everyone's used one, and some people have them in their houses. So no one expects it to bite back. I'm always very careful with my lathe, my mill, the hack saw, and anything else that's obviously there to cut. But I still wind up with cuts because I do silly things like picking up sheet metal the wrong way (slice), grabbing an end mill anywhere but at the middle (cut), or... Ain't just the power tools you need to be careful with. Shop safety involves EVERYTHING. Tom --------------------- Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2001 11:57:14 -0400 From: Ken Jenkins Subject: Re: Flying chucks .... been there, done that I noticed that a couple people mentioned flying chucks recently. This happened to me twice in the couple years I've had my Taig It is probably the single most scary and dangerous thing that can happen. In both cases, thank God, I came away bruised but unscathed. First time I actually reached out my finger to stop it when I realized it was unscrewing ...... bad idea ...... I now use a specially cut wood block to tighten and untighted my chuck against (keeps me from loosening chuck at the headstock while doing these operations). Also, since I have a variable speed setup, I decrease my speed slowly instead of just stopping from high speed. If this happens to you, you will only have a split second to decide what to do. There is only one decision to make, move quickly away and the best direction is laterally in the direction of the headstock end. The reason being when the chuck comes off it will go most likely go out the front and to the right. Also, this is most likely to happen when running at high speeds because the decelerating inertial forces are higher. Be careful, be safe, double-check your setups! Ken Jenkins kjenkinsx~xxmac.com ------------------------ Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2001 22:42:48 -0000 From: "John Lawson" Subject: Emergency Room Prices Recently, I whacked my arm into a razor sharp toolbit protruding from my lathe turret. A deep and nasty puncture wound, it bled profusely. So, I found a clean towel to compress over the wound and was driven to the E Room. No stitches were required. The Doc applied a dab of antibiotic cream (Neosporin), gave me a tetanus shot and applied a bandaid to the wound, which had finally stopped bleeding. I was in the E Room about 45 minutes, most of which time was spent waiting for an available doctor. The E Room bill was $880.00! My doctor charges $110 for a visit, and I called him first, but I was answered by a nurse who told me to go to the E Room. The toolbit that I ran into cost $3.50. The safety cover I applied was free, from the scrap bin. Shoulda fitted that cover to begin with. Woulda kept the job in the black. Now, I've been there; done that. Sadder Budweiser. --------------------- Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 04:05:25 -0000 From: "martello_nick" Subject: Re: Craftsman 6" lathe Model 101.07301 --- In atlas_craftsmanx~xxy..., LouD31M066x~xxa... wrote: > Atlas-Clausing has a site, nice people to do business with....probably > have manual when you call have make model and serial number ready and > be able to give your charge card data... your local library probably > has some good reading....face and eye protection ,no ties, rings or > long sleeves....know where your hands and fingers are at all times and > keep them away from danger....keep a neat shop and plan what you are > going to do before you do it. Have fun learning or relearning a skill > to convert lumps of metal into useful and decorative projects. > Louis Let me add a coupla cents here about safety: Especially from one newbie to any other newbies out there. I have been doing this for only a month and a half as that's when I finally inheireted (SIC) my lathe. This is only a hobby for most of us and can be a very dangerous one. This message also goes for those of you buying the HF QC tool post holder. While this is a great improvement for the lathe, I would caution you all to be very careful with the cutoff tool holder in this kit. I was cutting off a 1/2" axle last nite and the blade caught/dug in under the shaft and gave way. Missed me by about 5 inches. Scared the S out of me. Good thing I was standing back away from it. After I made my way down off the ceiling I examined the holder and found the hex/allen set screw to be loose so the blade was not really set in place. I did remember tightening it but think maybe the thread tightness fooled me. Don't know. That little blade could do some serious damage to one's innards. While I'm on the soap box, I also figured since I wear glasses I would be safe from any eye danger. Tonight (boy tonight was another bad night) I received a hot chip onto my eyelid. Bounced right over my glasses. So, guess I will be wearing goggles more often. Take Care. Nick ----------------------- Date: Mon, 02 Sep 2002 12:18:20 +1200 From: "" Subject: Re: 7" SBL Shaper Dimensions [MOVING HEAVY MACHINERY] Perhaps a few words on lifting heavy weights would not go amiss? The safest way is to avoid lifting them at all, eg do not use a hoist or any sort of direct lift. Instead, build up a "pigsty" of timbers under the object. I've done this with the shaper part of my Alba 1A to get it up onto the base. You need lots of good solid timber battens, say four by two inches, and they need to be longer than the longest dimensions of the base. Also a trustworthy assistant or two, but not too many. You rock the machine enough to get a piece under one side, then rock it enough to get one under the other. Then you repeat the process at right angles. If it is too tall to rock far enough to put your main pieces in, use some half thickness pieces and work in stages to get the full thickness ones in. Pry bars can be used to help get it up enough to slip in the next piece of timber. Next you tap the lowest ones apart so that they are outside the base of the machine. Continue putting layers in at the top, and moving the next layer down wider apart, and use skew nails to secure each layer to the one below after it is tapped out to the wide position. That gives you a firm secure base that will not tend to tip easily. Once you are at a suitable height, the last pieces can be longer and used as ways to slide the device across, say onto its base or onto a trailer. The object is that at no time is the device being lifted by main strength, and there is always a firm base underneath it supporting it. You are not relying on hoists which can slip, or on beams of unknown strength to hold a hoist up. An improvement if you can manage it would be to get the machine onto a pallet, strap it firmly to that, then do all the lifting, levering etc on the pallet. To get it down from say a trailer, you don't need to reverse the process, so long as you have some long thick planks...mine are about 2 inches by ten inches, by about eight feet long. You can slide the load down the planks with good control. Planks like this with two inch diameter pipe rollers come in handy for moving it to where you want it too. Obviously some judgement is needed when attempting this sort of thing, you do need to be fit and well. Also although it worked fine for the Alba, which comes into two parts which must be about 400 pounds each, I don't think I would try it for say a 24 inch shaper! regards John -------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 12 Apr 2002 09:52:25 -0700 From: "Nicholas Carter and Felice Luftschein" Subject: Stupid Atlas Accident Here is how I broke two teeth off of the gear that mates with the rack on my Atlas yesterday. I was taking a 16" cut on some 3/4" CRS, at a low feed rate, so that it took about 10 minutes for each pass. I didn't really let my attention wander much, and kept track of where it was. On the second pass I was screwing around with something for a moment and heard a popping sound (bad!). Quickly looked at the lathe and saw that it was halfway through the cut, but the handwheel was no longer rotating. Why? Because an oil can I had on the bench had been jammed between the bench and the handwheel handle. Ordinarily it would have just been pushed out of the way, but in this case they synched up so that the handle came down on top of the oilcan, firmly jamming the carriage handwheel from rotating. The weakest link broke, in this case the well worn rack gear. I can't explain how stupid I felt, but as with all mistakes I take it as an opportunity to finally set up my Barker mill to cut all the replacement gears for all the well worn gears on this lathe. The lesson: Do not leave anything in the path of the carriage, no matter how innocent. We often overlook simple things such as oil cans, and their destructive potential. ---------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 11 Apr 2002 11:10:27 -0700 From: Dave Martindale Subject: spinning chucks Lee Valley sells a brightly-coloured knitted "cuff" for use on woodworking lathe chucks. I suspect you could adapt the same idea to a Sherline or Taig. The idea is that the cuff covers the body of the chuck as well as the protruding jaws, making the spinning jaw ends visible rather than nearly invisible. The Lee Valley one is made from something elastic, but probably something that was hand-knitted to the right size for your chuck would work without the elastic. Dave ------------------------------------- Date: Sat, 31 Aug 2002 13:10:05 -0400 From: Stan Stocker Subject: Re: Safety Issues Hi Rio; A heavy rubber band, made from an inner tube or such, stretched over the outside of the jaws is commonly recommended. A thin layer of safety orange or yellow paint is also sometimes recommended, as is commonly done on props. You could also put a safety color stripe on the plate your lathe is mounted to as a visual reminder of where the jaws are. Over time you tend to develop a sense of where not to put your fingers. I don't mean this in a smart alec way, it's just something you develop. Sort of like a woodwoker who uses a tablesaw everyday tends to know where the blade is even in a blind cut, and keeps fingers clear, even if close to the danger zone. Polishing stuff up close to the chuck is a really easy time to bark a few knuckles, I still occasionally manage to ding myself. Breaking the sharp edges of the jaw ends helps reduce the depth / severity of cuts, as does using wooden sticks with the sandpaper applied with spray on adhesive to keep your fingers clear of the jaws. Cheers, Stan riocruzx~xxmindspring.com wrote: > Hey Group-- First, thanks for all the suggestions for getting up an > running for a newby. I ordered the books and they have been really > helpful. Successfully made a custom machine center out of a carriage > bolt that works really well for centering stock in the 4 Jaw Chuck. > Been turning out wood handles and brass ferrules. Dandy machine! > A safety issue that keeps coming up is how to keep from getting my > hands or fingers broken from the fast turning chuck. I've already > had a few swipes. The chuck is near invisible when it's turning so I > need to maybe build some sort of protector to keep from getting > messed up. > Any suggestions? ---------------------------------------- Date: Sat, 31 Aug 2002 13:55:31 -0400 From: "Carol & Jerry Jankura" Subject: RE: Safety Issues The obvious suggestion is to be VERY careful. Another suggestion would be to purchase a piece of clear plastic pipe and build a movable guard that goes round the chuck and perhaps extends over the workspace. If you were to visit the Sherline board (www.sherline.com) and search for their guards, you'd get an idea of what I mean. -- Jerry ------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 06 Nov 2002 15:19:06 -0000 From: "jumbo75007" Subject: Safety I just had an incident with my drill press. I was drilling some hardware store variety 1/4" steel and just as the drill was breaking thru the bottom, the drill shattered, not just a snap, but a POW and drill bit shards went all over the place. The steel was clamped down. The drill (size #9) was a cheapo from a Harbor Freight 3-in-1 drill set (about 120 drills for about $40.) I had been looking at buying some American made drills, but I have decided to do it now. I also was glad that I had my glasses on! None of the drill hit my face, but one put a minor cut my hand. Lesson learned!!!!! Dan Fuller Carrollton, Texas --------------------------------- Date: Thu, 7 Nov 2002 16:10:38 -0600 From: "William Schmiedlin" Subject: RE: Safety Dan, I have heard that process is called "hatching." Did it once with a solid carbide drill bit, and ended up pulling splinters out of my hands, and shirt for an hour. Endmills and other very hard tooling can "hatch" also. The worst part of doing it with bigger tooling is the BANG it makes when it explodes...usually gives quite a scare. At least the hole could be saved in your part :) William ------------------------------- Date: Fri, 03 Jan 2003 18:15:15 -0600 From: Ronald R Brandenburg Subject: Re: LATHE LIGHT NEVER, NEVER, NEVER!!! wear gloves! I've seen too many accidents where an 'operator' was wearing gloves and thought they could deal with a long chip coming off a cut only to get caught up and pulled into the part or have the chip cut through glove AND his/her hand. If you don't believe me just ask 'Stubby'. Most small shops have/have had a 'Stubby' working there. And make sure to button the cuffs on long sleeves!! I prefer NOT to wear long sleeves. It only takes a split second to get a sleeve caught in a part or the chuck or a dog, or . . . ., well, you get the idea. I've never had anything happen to me but I've worked places where it has happened. Let me tell you; It ain't pretty and it's, almost always, permanent. I can't stress this enough; It just ain't worth the risk! Ron... ~ ~ ~ Always remember: The early bird may get the worm, but it's the second mouse that gets the cheese. --------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 3 Jan 2003 18:26:30 -0600 From: "Paul Siegert" Subject: RE: LATHE LIGHT My two cent comment - I know a machinist that is about 5'10" that weighs in around 225 and is packed with muscle. He was telling me several years ago about getting a loose sleeve caught in the lathe he was working at in a shop and all he had time to do was jam his hands out against the ways and push back. He said it was all over in a matter of seconds and it took all the strength he had to keep from being pulled into the chuck as his shirt was literally ripped off his back. He commented that if he hadn't had the upper body mass/strength that he did, his face would have been in the mix. Paul --------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 26 Mar 2003 12:10:39 -0600 From: "Paul Kramer" To: Subject: RE: charcoal filter mask Message-ID: <65F14B054ACED511A6A608005AD18CC53911C1x~xxgnigrp3> "Karl" at skyland realty wrote : A question in regards to masks. I have a deadly allergy to CA fumes, they cause me to sneeze & cough and have breathing difficulties. I have a mask with charcoal filters, but it does not work at that well. Do you have any recommendations of masks? Thanks & Cheers, Karl Karl : I can give advice on this as it is in my line of work. If you are referring to a full-face or half-face respirator then I can tell you that the correct choice of cartridges is important. The black cartridges are for organic vapors and should work ok for this application. A better choice, however, would be the yellow cartridges since they protect against both organic vapors and acid gases. The latter could be present in this application. The white or green cartridges would not be appropriate for this application. It is also important to use fresh cartridges after about 30-60 minutes of use on a given set, since breakthrough can occur in that time range of useage depending upon the concentration of contaminants in the breathing air entering the cartridges. Hope this helps. Thermals, ...Paul K. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 26 Mar 2003 18:23:16 -0000 From: "Graham Knight" To: Subject: Re: [FFML] RE: charcoal filter mask Message-ID: <006b01c2f3c4$d45e13b0$403d0050x~xxHAL> It's also recommended to store the mask in an airtight container when not in use, this will prolong the life of the cartridge considerably. A plastic bag will do, just squeeze out all the air and tie a knot in it, or use a resealable bag. Graham in Shepperton, England SAM35 & 1066 Raynes Park MAC Secretary studio7x~xxntlworld.com http://website.lineone.net/~raynes.pk.mac/ ----------------------------- Date: Thu, 3 Apr 2003 11:51:41 EST From: catboat15x~xxaol.com Subject: Re: Digest Number 1422 In a message dated 4/3/2003 4:53:49 AM Pacific Standard Time, atlas_craftsmanx~xxyahoogroups.com writes: > > know if I can find out the age of the lathe from the serial number?? You can contact Clausing and see if they can help. Buy the Atlas book first thing a lot of good information in there. Remember safety first and keep your eyes shielded and no long sleeves or loose items in your shirt pockets. I call my 12 inch Atlas "Pappy's lathe" since my Dad used to tell me, "If we only had a lathe, we could fix that ourselfs." He was stuck working as an accountant after being wounded in world war 1, but always wanted to engage in some kind of mechanical work. --------------------------------- Date: Thu, 10 Apr 2003 21:16:49 EDT From: LouD31M066x~xxaol.com Subject: Re: Digest Number 1430 The principal difference between a slave and an employee is you have to buy slaves while employees beg to come to work for you. What comes for free is valued at cost. Worked in a lot of places over years where the worker was a no cost or low cost replaceable component... service as a unit as the saying goes. When we work for ourselves in our own shops let us try for higher standards for our own health and safety. than Louis ---------------------------------- Date: Fri, 09 May 2003 12:04:05 +0000 From: "Leon Heller" Subject: Re: beryllium tests ? >From: "rainnea" >Reply-To: taigtoolsx~xxyahoogroups.com >To: taigtoolsx~xxyahoogroups.com >Subject: [taigtools] beryllium tests ? >Date: Fri, 09 May 2003 10:11:25 -0000 >The note on beryllium got me a bit worried about using scrapyard >copper and brass, does anyone know of a means of telling whether a >piece contains any beryllium ? Beryllium/copper is mainly used in copper sheet and wire, to make it springy. You aren't likely to find it in 'lumps' of copper. If it is soft, it shouldn't have any Be in it. Be is quite nasty. It can form non-malignant tumours if it gets into a cut, and the dust can cause severe lung disease. BeO2 is used a lot in high-power semiconductor heat sinks because it is very conductive and an insulator, and they always come with a health warning. Leon Leon Heller, G1HSM Tel: +44 1424 423947 Email:leon_hellerx~xxhotmail.com My web page: http://www.geocities.com/leon_heller ------------------------------- Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2003 04:32:59 -0500 From: Ken Jenkins Subject: Re: Metal chips, curls, swarf, dust, etc. [TAIGTOOLS GROUP] >> Are there the >> same issue when working with metal, I'm not talking anything exotic >> just your normal scrap metal, steel etc. In other words, does it >> cause a lot of airborne dust to machine or grind it. Cutting, no. Grinding, some .. but the smallest particles burn up ... they're called, "sparks" :-) > Steel should usually come off in short curls, about a > half to 3/4 inch long. Although, I have seen a curl of steel come off a > cut that was about ten feet long:) Stainless steel is especially prone to come off in long ribbons. It was a late night sitting at the lathe 25 years ago .. my attention had been drifting as I was turning down a stainless casting taking a long slow cut when I noticed the ribbon spiraling down to the floor and nearly wrapped around the tool post ... I reached out with my finger to flick it over the side where it could run to the floor ... 15 minutes later I was in the emergency room. In preparation for stitches, a nurse was rather unsympathetically scrubbing the grease off the finger which I had sliced all the way to the bone. Razor blades are made from stainless steel ribbons ... I had forgot for a moment ... be careful out there. Ken J. -------------------- Subject: Burns and stupidity oldtools digest From: Jim Thompson Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2003 14:09:07 -0800 I am sitting here typing with one hand and soaking the other one in a bowl of ice water. I have managed to put some nice burns on my left hand. A while back we were talking about getting rusted threads loose and yesterday I bought a 7/8" dia. acme thread rod about 3 feet long which had a nut rusted on right in the middle. No problem, says I. I will just heat that puppy up red hot and it will turn. And so it did! But in the process I violated a safety rule, and now I am paying for it. The pain is almost unbearable. I did not wear gloves while using my oxy-acetylene torch. The connection where the tip screws onto the barrel was just a slight bit loose, and I did not notice that. My hand was right on the connection when the flame ignited there. Of course I let go pretty quickly, but not quickly enough. Let this serve as a lesson for everybody: NEVER, NEVER use anything that produces a flame unless you are wearing gloves! I have been getting away with doing this for a very long time, but this time I got caught. I think this lesson will stick with me for quite a while. I have a little bit of cooked meat about an inch square between my thumb and forefinger. Is that what you call a third degree burn? The rest is just a bright red. Jim Thompson, the old millrat in Riverside, CA ---------------- Subject: Re: Burns and stupidity From: Bill Kasper Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2003 14:39:12 -0800 yes, the cooked meat is third degree. first is red, second is blistering, third is char. go to the emergency room, jim. don't take a chance on a secondary infection. see here: http://www.med.umich.edu/1libr/aha/aha_burn3_crs.htm bill felton, ca --------------- Subject: RE: Burns and stupidity From: "Meltsner, Kenneth" Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2003 15:47:11 -0500 Also secretarial work -- when I was at a national lab, one secretary ran over her foot with a chair caster (she was wearing sandals) and got the lab to pay for a pair of safety shoes. I used to wear them when I worked at Chevron's Richmond Refinery and never understood the complaints about the shoes -- if you pay extra for a nice pair (e.g Red Wings instead of the cruddy ones sold by the truck that swings by the plant), steel toe shoes are quite comfortable. And you're only issued one pair of feet per lifetime. Ken --------------- Subject: Re: Burns and stupidity From: Dean Chesterman Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2003 16:07:44 -0700 Shop Safety depends on attitude, if you want to work safe you can! I shopped around for safety shoes and ended up with a pair of black running shoes that are comfortable for all day wear and suitable for electrical work, steel toes, steel shank, high resistance soles. Many a lineman stomped on my running shoes then asked where I got them. I wear glasses and it was just as easy and half the cost to get prescription safety lenses over normal glass lenses. Then I have a face shield on all of the "lectron burners. When the face shield is hanging on the Dr*ll Pr*ss spindle and the push stick has to be moved to turn on the ch*p s*w, one has no excuse. It takes some effort to get the right type and comfortable safety equipment, and of course hand tools are a much safer alternative. Dean Chesterman Yes, I have a couple of the little plastic shields that bolt to a r**ter fence! And a face shield that resides on the table. --------------- Subject: Re: Activator for CA glue From: Jim Thompson Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 06:17:34 -0800 I recently used some CA on a piece that I was going to turn in the lathe. I used the activator on it and a while later when I thought it had all cured I turned the lathe on. I got an awful dose of fumes from the CA which spun out like a spider web and covered me and everything else in the shop. Fortunately it cured as it flew through the air and was no more bothersome than a spider web to clean up. But the smell was almost overwhelming. Jim Thompson, the old millrat in Riverside, CA ------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 10:23:37 -0500 From: Ken Jenkins Subject: Re: Shop Accidents / safety tips Here some tips from my experience ... I don't know is you could learn much from me recounting the numerous accidents I have had working with machines over the years (except that a high IQ is not a pre-requisite). So I'll just summarize a few tips as my contribution. 1. Poor set-up and part holding are a main cause of accidents. Check your set up carefully. If you're in doubt ... STOP ... rethink it. There are almost always several ways to secure a part. 2. Haste makes waste ... or scrap and perhaps injuries in this case. There's always the "quick way" and the "right way" to do something ... or as someone once said, "You can have it right .... or you can have it now ... but you can't have it right now. 3. Vibration is trying to tell you something (see #1) 4. Strange sounds heard when machining are trying to tell you something (see #1). I can't tell you how many times I have had my butt saved by listening to a machine. I can usually hear something's wrong before I see it and just that small gap of time is sometimes enough. A job running well produces a "sound signature", you get used to hearing it and when it's not there .... get suspicious. 5. Some times it helps to think about a job from the machine's point of view. I know that sounds goofy but it can keep you from making an unreasonable request of your tools. 6. There is hardly ever a legitimate reason NOT to turn off a machine before making an adjustment (see #2) to set up or tooling. 7. Make the use of eye protection religious dogma in your shop by everyone and anyone there. Polycarbonate safety glasses are dirt cheap, keep two or three pairs in the shop. 8. Keep your cutting tools sharp, dull tools more typically cause problems than sharp ones. 9. If you're trying to force something, typically it won't like it and will turn around and bite or slap you. Excessive force is not a substitute for a "good plan" it is an indication that you should stop and rethink what you're doing. The "brute force" approach is nearly always the wrong one --- a hammer is not a "fine adjustment tool". Cheers, Ken ----------------- Date: Fri, 30 Jan 2004 11:18:50 -0600 From: xlch58x~xxswbell.net Subject: Re: Re: shaper restoration question In Metal_Shapersx~xxyahoogroups.com Dan wrote: > A wire wheel works great. It will cut off corners some, so be careful of > that. And POSITIVELY, ABSOLUTELY. DON'T use it without eye protection > or face shield. Those little wires are coming off the wheel all the time > you are using it. More dangerous than a grinding wheel. I also have to > wear a breathing , dust filter or next morning I will have a headache > from the dust. A large wire wheel can put an eye out quickly, a large grinding wheel can kill you. Charles ------------------------ Date: Sat, 31 Jan 2004 01:31:03 -0000 From: "David C. Hearn" Subject: Re: shaper restoration question Dan, I agree with you 100%. I did maintenance work in a steel mill. THE most important thing is to use proper safety gear. A home shop has the same hazards as a workplace, sometimes worse. On the job, there was usually someone else there to cover your rear end. We looked out for each other. We had a taboo about electrical work alone. At home, you usually are alone, so you dont have someone there to CYA. Eye protection is the single most important piece of safety gear. It is good to wear them at all times in the shop. There are so many unexpected things that can cost you an eye, not just the obvious ones. A dust mask, heavy steel toed boots and a Carhartt coat along with safety glasses goes a long way in making the home shop work safe. Never wear nylon jackets!!!! If they catch on fire, they stick to you and the burned skin comes off with the plastic. Proper use of safety gear is the difference between a pro and a fool. And besides, blue jeans, a Carhartt jacket, and leather boots is a classic look for a working man. They make some cool looking safety glasses now too. God Bless and be safe. Dave H. ------- Date: Fri, 3 Sep 2004 12:23:11 -0500 From: "Gordon Couger" Subject: Re: Danger Any Maximum, fine aluminum and even steel cutting can burn if hot enough so good house keeping is in order. For grinding aluminum belt sanders are the only way to go. You don't have the problem with clogging the wheel and causing problems and the belt is much better at self cleaning. Having lost a very dear friend to a new grinding wheel with no guard I always show them a lot of respect. He was one of the last blacksmiths and very good one. He had a home made grinder that used the rear end of 1 ton truck and a 5 or 10 hp motor and two 5 X 12 inch stones. He had put on a new one that day and it had been running a few hours to make sure it was sound. He touched it with a plow sweep and it exploded and took off about a third of his head. At least that is how it appeared to those that reconstructed the events. His wife walked in and found him in a pool of blood. I had another friend that carried a 3 inch scar in his chin to his grave from a cut of blade he use to cutout knife blades, aging with no guard that exploded on him. So don't take the stories of exploding grinding wheels lightly. Even the tiniest of them can take out a eye or a few teeth. Gordon ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Kowalchuk" To: Sent: Sunday, August 29, 2004 10:19 PM Subject: [sherline] Danger : At 09:57 PM 8/29/04 -0400, Jerry G wrote: : >Grinding aluminum on a bench or floor grinder is a major safety violation in any shop. : >The aluminum will clog the interstices of the wheel : Not to mention that ferrous metal dust combined with aluminum dust can form : a compound called thermite which can ignite causing serious flash burns! : Here's a link to what can happen. : http://www.hanford.gov/lessons/sitell/ll01/2001-36.htm : There is a report of one incident in a back issue of the VIME newletter : (Vancouver Model Engineers) which may or may not still be online. : John Kowalchuk maker of mutes/horns/canoes/paddles/bikes : Oshawa, Ontario http://home.ca.inter.net/~horn1 : Canadians don't surf the net, we paddle it. ------- Date: Wed, 29 Sep 2004 12:38:38 -0000 From: "joegourlay" Subject: Safety Reminder [atlas_craftsman group] Safety issues seem to more on the minds of the three fingered bunch on the wood working boards. But I wanted to post this here as a cautionary tale about not getting careless. In preparation for leveling the lathe this weekend, I want to take off everything heavy I'm comfortable removing. So, Chuck, Tailstock, and motor. In the process of taking off the motor, I had to take out and disconnect the switch. I undid the first terminal screw and placed it on the bench. But, you guessed it, I had neglected to unplug the lathe and the terminal was live. On the upside, I just got "bit" a little bit. On the downside, I threw that screw across the garage and it took me two hours of cleaning find it. On the scary side, this is the only thing in my shop I haven't converted to 240Vac! Safety, safety, safety..... ------- Date: Mon, 6 Dec 2004 15:41:08 -0500 To: From: "Ed Toner" Subject: Hazards in construction of Free Flight [aircraft] models. I'm a cigar smoker, and unless I have one by early afternoon, I'm like a Bear with a sore awse. I smoke BIG stogies, and they last for hours. I'm having one now, and typing is difficult. I hate to stop building for that long, so I struggle through the process of enjoying a cigar, and doing simple things like sanding, doping, etc.. ["doping" is applying a type of flammable lacquer sealer to fabric or paper.] I was doping the rudder of my Cosmos R2 ROG, and I used some thinner to remove a decal that I didn't want. I've gotten quite absent-minded in my dotage, and I put my wet dope brush in the dirty ashtray, and my lit cigar in the open thinner bottle - WHOOSH!!!! It never got to the surface of the thinner - the fumes set off the lit cigar. Nothing burnt, just a little singe. The good news is that I salvaged the brush, and the cigar is OK too. Ah, the joys of The Golden Years. Ed Toner http://tinyurl.com/2o47k Over what hill? I don't see no hill. Hand me my glasses, son. ------- Date: Sat, 3 Dec 2005 13:24:24 -0800 From: "Bill Rittner" Subject: [OldTools] Shop Safety Warning! Last night the industrial building that I rent space in for my small business had a serious fire. I am very fortunate in that my business was not damaged and my (5) shop cats were not injured (nor was anyone else). Of the (5) businesses in the building only (2) are still up and running. Hopefully (2) more will be up by Monday. The business where the fire originated will be down for some time. This fire was caused by oily rags in a metal container self igniting. So please handle your linseed oil and other oil finish rags carefully. Get them out of your shop when finished with them and handle by approved methods. I posted pics of this fire here. http://members.cox.net/wcrittner/fire.htm If you think this can't happen to you...please think again. Please work safely. Bill Rittner R & B ENTERPRISES Manchester, CT ------- Re: Long hair, loose clothing, gloves/ Changed to lo [sherline] Posted by: "Jerry G" chieftoolmakerx~xxearthlink.net shipmodelmaker1931 Date: Sat Sep 8, 2007 3:22 pm ((PDT)) OK, Here is the promised story. The year was about 1962 or so..... I was working for a firm named Yardney Electric Corp. in Manhattan. There was a machine shop in the basement. We had 13 machinists there. They produced very high tech, high powered batteries for the government. ( Yeah! The U. S. government for you wise guys.) We had built a machine to produce the material for the plates used in the batteries. I will go into great detail since this is a Forum concerned with machining. The plates were made out of a material consisting of "X-Met" ( Expanded Metal*), and compressed silver powder. * = Silver sheet that was slit at intervals and then stretched/rolled to form a grid of X shaped openings, hence the name..... The machine was about forty feet long. There was a long mesh conveyor belt that transported the material, once amalgamated with the XMet and the powder through a sintering oven* * = Sintering is a process where the powder is heated ( below the melting point) and the particles fuse with each other. Powder metallurgy..... At the feed end was a built in rolling mill. The rolling mill had two stainless steel rollers 6.0000" main diameter by 12" long and the rest of the roller had two ends that were 3.0000" diameter which were lightly push fit into ball bearings. The ball bearings were bedded into cast iron (Meehanite) pillow blocks. There were oil seals (Garlock) protecting the bearings that were pressed into counterbores in the pillow blocks. The rollers were driven by gears and a gearbox we had made. The lower pillow block was fixed, and the upper pillow block was adjustable for height. The adjustment was accomplished by using an inclined wedge driven by a thread. That way, the rolling mill operator could adjust the gap between the rollers so as to arrive at the desired thickness of the stock battery plates being produced. We had installed DDI's to measure the movement. So, to sum up the operation of the machine. A trough was located ahead of the rollers. This was the area where the powder and the Xmet came together. There were two "doctor blades*" in the trough. Bolted to the sides of the trough. The doctor blades reciprocated sideways as the material moved under the blade, transported by a paper belt. The material was "doctored" to the thickness which would result in the right dimension for the battery plates. This was controlled by the operator, using a double threaded screw and knob arrangement which provided fine adjustment. A trial run was necessary to process a small amount of the plate material until it came out of the sintering oven, cooled and was "miked up".... Right before the rollers was the trough. The Xmet was on a roll above the trough. The material advanced from being doctored to compression by the rollers.....The paper transport was removed after the rollers because the "web" was self supporting at that point. Through the oven, and then on to the end of the machine. At the end, we had mounted a Di-Acro Bench Shear. This is normally operated by a handle which rotates an eccentric to bring the upper blade down and up. We retrofitted it so that an air cylinder actuated it. Since we had to cut the material on the fly, the shear was mounted on a plate that was pivioted from a floor plate and a parallelogram arrangement with bearing blocks. There was a moveable micro switch mounted to "read" the material. As the switch was closed by the edge of the material, the air cyclinder was energized and a cut took place, without buckling the material. Well, one day, I was informed that the blade on the shear was showng signs of wear and needed to be replaced. So, I went up to the third floor where production was. Shut down the machine ( I thought ) and started to dismantle the blade from the shear. First I disconnected the connections to the eccentric. It was held with Allen Socket Head Cap screws, and so were the blades. As I tried to loosen the screws, the carriage moved, the micro switch was tripped and WHAM!, the air cylinder activated, the arm flew around and the top of the shear came down..... What saved my right thumb was the Allen wrench that wedged between the blades! But, I did not escape unscathed... My thumb suffered a terrible laceration and there was blood everywhere! On top of which, I was trapped ( or my thumb was) between the blades. I started to yell for help, but this was on a busy, noisy production floor. I was able to motion with my left hand and caught the attention of one of the lady operators of production. When she saw the blood, she ran away from me screaming! As did about 25 or so other women...... the commotion attracted a setup man, who ran over and cut the power. I was rushed to a nearby industrial doctor who was retained by the company. His treatment consisted of stopping the bleeding and applying a "butterfly bandage" to my thumb. While he was doing this, he took out a bottle of Scotch and said, " Here, sip some of this". But, he was NOT talking to me. The guy who had taken me to the doctor was turning green at the sight of all the blood..... I still have a scar about 2" down on my right thumb. A reminder to cut the power to any machine when it is not in use. I still have ten fingers... Not bad... I was born with twelve fingers... Two fingers in fifty years...... :) Jerry G (Glickstein) ------- Re: Miniature Taps / Sherline Threading Attachment [sherline] Posted by: "Chananiel Wizman" madmachinist54x~xxyahoo.com Date: Wed Jan 30, 2008 3:18 pm ((PST)) I also have one concern for the Leadloy fans and hope this won't hijack the thread. In the world of reloading it's not the bullet casters that stand the worst cases of lead contamination. The people that tumble their own brass are equally so, or even more susceptible because of the fine dust that is made from the lead residue being turned to dust and inhaled by the reloader. See a correlation between machining leadloys and lead inhalation anyone? Thats a fact mentioned by Richard Lee and has the potential of being harmful to his profits. Hope that doesn't take us off track. Chananiel ------- Re: Basic Milling Question [sherline] Posted by: "mileagemayvary" gizmomakerx~xxbigpond.com Date: Wed Oct 29, 2008 12:26 am ((PDT)) "DW Holtman" wrote: > Second question. When turning off the head, does it make any difference if I turn the speed control CCW before turning off the switch? Or can I stop and start it with the speed control knob already set to the approximate speed? I could not find any information about this in the literature that came with the machine. Thank you in advance for any help. Best, DW Holtman < I do not agree at all in turning the speed off on the dial and then turning off at the motor switch. This just leads to a very dangerous situation. If I turn ON a switch I expect things to start running, car, lawn mower, toaster, computer etc. If you turn on the Sherline motor switch and it does not run then you are in danger of being distracted by thinking it is not plugged into the wall, checking that it is plugged in, checking the wall switch, extension lead etc, possibly getting a bit confused and sticking a tommy bar in the chuck or worse... ALL THE TIME WITH THE MACHINE SITTING THERE LIVE. I do believe in unplugging from the wall whenever I have to do a major mill adjustment or setup. It is just so easy to brush the mill power switch. Having scared myself a few times in the past. Rob ------- Re: Cleaning and Ecology [atlas_craftsman] Posted by: "catboat15x~xxaol.com" olewilly2000 Date: Mon Dec 29, 2008 9:36 pm ((PST)) >From an old geezer who by current thinking should have been buried long ago. (please put my Atlas as my head stone) . I remember when we used benzene to clean and de-oil gear trains in watt hour meters. Had a fire one time and switched to carbon tetrachloride. Also worked in power plants and asbestos was wrapped around every hot pipe and piece of equipment. (The air was white with asbestos dust when the insulators went to work.) I painted my first house with barn paint as it was cheap. Red lead of course, and as a builder of electronic kits used nothing but solder that was half lead. Except when I brazed my model boilers when I used brazing wire with cadmium. Of course most of this was after my time in the army where we had four cigarettes in every K ration box, plus issued packs when PX supplies came in. After leaving combat the Red Cross and other organizations gave us "smokes" too. Of course it is said no one realized how deadly cigarettes were. Then why did we call them "coffin nails"? Sometimes it is enough to make a guy wonder. Oh, forgot to mention when working in transformer test we were up to our elbows in transformer oil that contained PCBs or what ever it is that now causes evacuations when it is spilled. Had a full foot of snow in the yard last week, that "global warming" is really getting bad here in the desert. I will admit though that well into my eighties I don't worry nearly as much about getting shot by a jealous husband as I did in my younger years. ------- NOTE TO FILE: Chances are we all got exposed to some nasty stuff at some time in our lives -- either by accident or because we did not know any better at the time. We must now make every effort to work and play safely and healthily. Take really good care of yourself. ------- Date: Thu, 22 Jan 2009 19:41:58 -0600 [Oldtools email group] From: "walter cheever" Subject: [OldTools] Re: breathing dust Adrian says... >> I have been developing a dry throat lately, either from the dry weather or the various dusts I produce or both. Figure I can do something about the dust. Yesterday I was using a tailed monster to cut some 1"x2" steel blocks for a press I'm building, too much for my hacksaw. Problem is, when I finished there was fine dust everywhere, on me, my table, overhead lights, everywhere, even embedded in my jacket. Other times I'm sanding a blade and breathe in the fine dust from that. Also there's smoke from the forge and occasional welding. And of course sawdust. I'd like to come up with a solution that is easy to use, cheap, non-electric and that doesn't interfere with me too much. I have a beard that prevents most dust masks from helping. << Adrian: This probably doesn't answer your criteria, but if you can't find an improvisation that works, try the Trend Air shield mask. It ain't cheap, but IT WORKS. I have one and I use it a lot. And, it wouldn't inconvenience your beard, because it doesn't seal to your face. It has a little bitty fan that pulls air through a pre-filter and a HEPA filter, and puts slightly positive air pressure around your breathing orfices, with clean air. The "seal" is a piece of ruberised fabric that just tucks up against your face. the itty bitty fan is run by the equivalent of 3 rechargable AA batteries in a power pack. No hoses, or cords, all one piece. It also has a disposable surface on the face mask, so when it gets dinged, burned or glued, you just peel it off and put on another. I know it filters out small particles. I had a friend over who was (mis-)using one of my tools, and flat burned it up. I was using the mask and didn't even get enough smoke particles in the mask to know what he was doing. When I took off the mask it was "WTF is on fire???". Remember, standard issue is only ONE pair on lungs, and replacements are hard to come by. Standard disclaimer....I just like their product. Walt C Who had 5 glorious hours in contact with wood and tools today. ------- Re: Oily crud and slivers [atlas_craftsman] Posted by: "catboat15x~xxaol.com" Date: Fri Jun 5, 2009 7:36 am ((PDT)) My rule, and for the grandkids who like to watch and learn is No gloves around the lathe or mill, short or rolled up sleeves, put rings and watches in your pocket. If needed use a wire hook (coat hanger wire) to pull chips away from the cutter. Never leave a key in a chuck. Think of what you are doing before doing it. Any tool that can cut metal has no problem in cutting meat. ------- Re: AMMCo restoration continues [Metal_Shapers] Posted by: "revgo1898" revgo1898x~xxyahoo.com Date: Fri Oct 23, 2009 10:52 am ((PDT)) In Metal_Shapersx~xxyahoogroups.com, "debrular2004" wrote: > I have Simple Green with great success. It is easier to use and just as effective. Cheaper too. John < Check this story re: welding after using brake cleaner. http://www.brewracingframes.com/id75.htm ------- NOTE TO FILE: The story tells of severe health damage that narrowly missed being fatal after using brake cleaner and then welding a part that was still wet. The gas given off caused severe injury. Personally I am going to be a lot more careful with any solvents. ------- Re: new member [Metal_Shapers] Posted by: "al_messer" al_messerx~xxyahoo.com Date: Mon Apr 12, 2010 7:22 pm ((PDT)) "crazyfeather" wrote: > Hi found all of you on the HSM web page I am the owner of a I think ? a24" varnamo just getting started on reading the post on these critters I have used mine but vary timidly having no experience with a shaper Thanks Dave < Welcome aboard and good look with your "education" via Shaper. Always remember to stand away from the front of the ram when you turn on the power!!!! Al ------- Re: full face safety shield [sherline] Posted by: "billyb_03" whornungx~xxoh.rr.com Date: Tue Jul 13, 2010 5:00 pm ((PDT)) "billyb_03" wrote: > Anybody know of a good source for clear plastic safety shield for > entire face. This type usually has a band for putting on head. > Hoping to find local store that might carry these. AO Safety 90028 Professional Faceshield by AO Safety I bought the above and happy with it. ------- Re: full face safety shield Posted by: "chieftoolmaker" chieftoolmakerx~xxearthlink.net Date: Tue Jul 20, 2010 10:04 am ((PDT)) >> Remember that a face shield needs to be worn with >> safety glasses, it isn't a replacement for them. > This is very true. But it is very handy for keeping stray hot chips > from ending up in your mouth. Or (as once happened to me) up my nose....... :( Jerry G ------- NOTE TO FILE: The danger mentioned in the next message applies to every brand of lathe that has a screw-on chuck. These same chucks can present a danger if a lathe is ever run in reverse. ------- Don't let your Taig Lathe bite you [taigtools] Posted by: "Don Rogers" Donx~xxCampbell-Gemstones.com Date: Mon Nov 29, 2010 3:00 pm ((PST)) The first time this happened, about 14 years back, it scared me, but no damage. This time, I forgot my old lesson and I got bit. I fired up the Taig with a four jaw chuck mounted and the work in and centered. What I didn't do was tighten the chuck tightly on the spindle. I also didn't check the speed. I hit the switch and I was off to the races. Too fast dummy. I turned it off and the motor stopped, but the chuck didn't. It dropped onto the ways and one of the screws put a good size half moon divot in the center of the bed. The chuck came off spindle and bed before I could move and I caught it square in the chest. Off my chest and back onto the way and motor, this time eating up the back edge of the way. I was able to clean the high spots off the way with a fine file. The bruise will go away in a week or so. I was lucky. The damage to the lathe was minimal and the damage to me wasn't bad, but 4" higher and I would have had a mouth full of chuck without the benefits of a heavy flannel shirt to cushion the hit. Tighten the chuck and check the speed before starting the little guy. Its bite is worse than its bark. Don ------- NOTE TO FILE: When receiving a generic toolholder, the nut holding it to the lathe usually is oversized and needs trimming to fit. That operation is easy with a mill, and folks often reduce its dimensions first with a metal bandsaw or even a manual hacksaw. Another alternative is discussed in the file here "Cut or Saw Metal" in a conversation called "QCTP from CDCO attack" starting Fri Feb 11, 2011. Some safety issues are also discussed in the next message there called "Angle grinders". ------- Date: Tue, 26 Apr 2011 08:52:45 -0700 From: Joe Subject: [OldTools] hammer - bronze or brass? I've got a hammer, don't remember where it came from but I think it might have been an Army engineer's box. In any case, it's been sitting on the back step for a few months now. I want to know if it's brass or bronze. It's barrel shaped in the 3.5 pound range. Plenty of dings and dents and even some slight mushrooming of the faces. Despite being outside for a while it hasn't turned green (although it's not super shiny either) which is why I'm leaning towards bronze. But I thought bronze was too brittle for a hammer, especially a small sledge made to hit something big. I'd like to find out for sure what it is as I'm planning on chucking it up in the lathe and turning it smooth again. I figure that would take about 1/8th off the thickness but it might also bring it down to a size that's actually usable for me. Joe M. ------- Date: Tue, 26 Apr 2011 11:05:43 -0500 (CDT) From: w.taggartx~xxverizon.net Subject: Re: [OldTools] hammer - bronze or brass? It could very well be beryllium/copper. Does it look something like this: http://www.ngkmetals.com/index.cfm/m/50/fuseaction/store6pro ducts.productDetail/productID/296/merchantId/0/depart mentId/0/categoryId/15/Mallet or http://tinyurl.com/3hfcz8y Berylco has been making a whole line of beryllium/copper tools for years, for use in explosive environments. They're used in refineries and chemical plants, etc., because they are non-sparking, but the alloy is much tougher and harder than brass or bronze, so they're not easily dented or deformed. They even have a regular claw hammer (I learned this a couple years ago, because I had one and ultimately sold it). I would hesitate to machine, grind, sand, cut, whatever until you know what it is. Beryllium is a toxic metal, and these tools come with MSDSs and instructions as to what you should and should not do with them. Bill T. ------- Date: Tue, 26 Apr 2011 12:00:59 -0400 From: "Rodgers, Charles [USA]" Subject: RE: [OldTools] hammer - bronze or brass? I'd be careful, Joe. If it's a berillium-copper alloy used to make non-sparking (and non-corroding) hammers, turning it in a lathe isn't a good idea. Berillium is highly toxic. I don't have any personal experience dealing with the stuff, but I expect someone will give advice on how to (safely) smooth the faces. Charlie Rodgers Clinton, Maryland ------- Date: Tue, 26 Apr 2011 11:25:21 -0500 From: WesG Subject: Re: [OldTools] hammer - bronze or brass? GGs: If its not beryllium; Hammers were usually cast from - wait for it: "Hammer Metal" which is the term used in the industry for an alloy that's basically a slightly tougher bronze, if memory serves. I don't have the mix in my memory banks. Does your handle have any marks on it? The foundry I played in made a LoT of those hammers with hickory handles and maroon colored grips on the lower part. Some have "ABC" in foil on the side. Instead of using your lathe, you could just file it. Faster, safer and easier. Cheers, Wes ------- Date: Tue, 26 Apr 2011 13:33:55 -0400 From: Dave Leader Subject: [OldTools] hammer - bronze or brass? Hello Joe and GG's, When I ran a Mechanics Shop for Navy back in the early 80s, we had hammers that sounded a lot like that, no picture - doesn't exist. When we needed to drift a pin, or do something else that might otherwise cause a spark, in a hazardous atmosphere, that's what we'd use. If you clean an area or make a scratch, on the hammer, is the metal redder or yellower? Not an exact test, I agree, but a starting point. Ours, as I remember, were brass. Dave Leader ------- Date: Tue, 26 Apr 2011 13:22:02 -0700 From: Joe Subject: [OldTools] Re: hammer - bronze or brass? First let me apologize for the OTHER email I just sent out with nothing on it. I was trying to dial the VA pharmacy while checking email. I just got a bottle of 10mg pills that said "take one capsule at noon and increase every two weeks as tolerated - MAX of 4MG at noon." I thought I knew government math, but I just can't wrap my head around that one. So I clicked a few too many times and off it went. Anyhow - I think this is just a big chunk of brass. It looks shiny when scratched, although that isn't very easy. I don't think it's beryllium - can't explain why but I'm just not getting that warm fuzzy feeling when I look at it and say beryllium. I did take a pic. Wes sent me a pic of a lead hammer and said the shape was pretty standard and he was right as far as my hammer is concerned. * http://tinyurl.com/3rtx5rf thanks for all the replies Joe M. ------- Date: Tue, 26 Apr 2011 18:32:43 -0400 From: "Gary K" Subject: Fw: [OldTools] Re: hammer - bronze or brass? > I'm on with Bill. Might even have a hint of the color of Berillyium > (sp?) that I have seen. Don't go filing on it while holding your nose > next to it. If wikipedia is to be believed on this one, 2 *micrograms* of beryllium per cubic meter is a danger threshhold. I have a work area (shop is too grandiose a word) that is about 5m by 9m by about 2m high, or 90 cubic meters. If my math is correct, then a tenth of a milligram in that space is too much. I'd avoid working the stuff. Anywhere. At all. Gary K Albion NY, USA ------- Date: Tue, 26 Apr 2011 21:11:24 -0700 (PDT) From: clifford Chevalier Subject: Re: [OldTools] Re: hammer - bronze or brass? Joe, In my experience working in explosive environments for the Air Force, we used bronze tools when necesary to prevent any sparking. We even had bronze claw hammers about that same color. If your hammer is from a military engeneers kit, my money is on bronze. Alan ------- Date: Wed, 27 Apr 2011 18:51:02 -0700 From: "Adam R. Maxwell" Subject: Re: [OldTools] Re: hammer - bronze or brass? On Apr 27, 2011, at 13:27 , Thomas Conroy wrote: > So do we have a test for beryllium? Good question... > And what is the nature of the active poisoning? Do we have to breathe fine dust, or eat dust, or does it give off fumes if heated, or will a big (like coarse filings) chunk be poisonous, or is it poisonous by skin contact with the solid metal? Surely not the last, or they wouldn't have been able to sell tools for general use. I recalled some mention of beryllium in our safety training at work, and my impression was to avoid it because of lung disease/cancer. After looking up the details, here's the gist of what we're told for beryllium/beryllium copper tools: - Inspect for oxidation, a fine whitish powder. This is an inhalation risk, and discarding the item is the best course of action. - Handle with gloves/forceps/tongs to avoid skin contact when possible. Wash hands after handling, even if you used gloves. - Tools must be stored separately and labeled, and must not rub against hard objects, which can generate metal dust. - Avoid injury from sharp pieces and dust dispersal. This is in no way comprehensive or authoritative, and I disclaim all responsibility for beryllium exposure! My employer also requires training to use a stepladder, and I'm sure the dumb stuff I did in grad school would give them fits (like melting and machining a lead holder for one of our gamma sources, and welding in confined spaces). However, I'm putting beryllium tools on the list of things to avoid in the shop, right up with methanol. Adam (usually not paranoid, in Port Angeles, WA) ------- Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2011 10:23:11 -0400 From: Ken Shepard Subject: Re: [OldTools] Re: hammer - bronze or brass? Beryllium itself is highly toxic, especially the inhaled dust. Beryllium copper as used in non-sparking tools has a beryllium content of less than 3% and there is little danger in using these tools. There is some hazard when machining or otherwise working the material, however. BTW, beryllium and some alloys with a high percentage of the metal are transparent to ionizing radiation, so it is used for "windows" and other applications in equipment used for radiation research. My involvement with beryllium came through some environmental cleanup work at Oak Ridge National Lab. The dust is really nasty stuff. Ken Shepard ------- Date: Fri, 01 Jul 2011 16:30:59 -0700 From: Joe Subject: [OldTools] Before we use any equipment let's talk about shop safety... I think I'm going to break down and buy a shop apron. Probably something made of heavy leather. I'm not really an apron kinda guy. I know there are a lot of you on this list who like them because we've talked about them in the past. Some of you are into all the pockets so you can walk around with half your tool chest within reach, others think that by wearing a shop apron you can channel the ghost of some long forgotten pilgrim woodworker to guide your saw. Me, I just think they are cumbersome, they get in the way, and - especially in Arizona - serve no purpose but to trap even more body heat. But still, I think I'm going to buy one. You see, I got a little bit of quality shop time today, some of which included turning down a metal ferrule for a 1" mortise chisel from a piece of pipe. It's a quite hot out so I was dressed appropriately. Now some of you "professional" machinists on the list will say that you just can't turn metal wearing nothing but shorts and safety glasses. Let me be the first to say you are wrong. You can do it. Of course it's a lot like naked bacon frying - you'll regret it as soon as the hot stuff starts flying, and you probably won't do it twice. So I'm going to buy a shop apron. But seeing as it's July in southern AZ and the temp is somewhere north of 100, I'll probably be out there wearing nothing but a shop apron - open in the back - and safety glasses. So if you do decide to swing on by, and you hear the snick-snick-snick of a metal lathe at work, you might want to knock before entering. Joe M. ------- Date: Fri, 01 Jul 2011 16:49:42 -0700 From: James Thompson Subject: Re: [OldTools] Before we use any equipment let's talk about shop safety... I have quite a number of aprons. When I was working for a living I always wore a leather apron because I was always leaning onto a steel plate with ragged edges. It was just natural for me to wear one, and besides, there was an expectation by everyone else that such an apron was the appropriate uniform for a layout man. It was like a uniform. Fast forward a bunch of years, and we now see the old layout man being chastised by his wife for not wearing an apron. It's not like I don't own several of them, including the old leather one, it's just that I always think that what I am going to do will only take a minute, and it isn't worth the effort to find one and put it on. And so I wind up with glue or stain, or something unmentionable on my shirts and trousers, and this leads to the accusing stare from SWMBO, and the accompanying, "When are you going to learn to wear an apron?" I know I have ruined a lot of perfectly good clothes, but I just seem to be stuck on stupid. It may be a signal of the onset of senility. I dunno....... Do yourself a favor and start wearing an apron in the shop. I'm trying, I really am..... :>) ------- Date: Fri, 1 Jul 2011 22:11:07 -0400 (EDT) From: Ed Bell Subject: RE: [OldTools] Before we use any equipment let's talk about shop safety... On Fri, Jul 1, 2011 at 7:30 PM, Joe wrote: > I think I'm going to break down and buy a shop apron. That's the post of the month, I think. Be careful out there... Ed ------- Re: Ship's Ahoy! [sherline] Posted by: "ED MAISEY" holmes_ca_2000x~xxyahoo.com Date: Sun Jul 3, 2011 10:48 am ((PDT)) Sunday, July 3, 2011 JERRY G wrote: > Hi Ed, Not to worry! Whenever I work on my machines, I do not wear a tie or loose clothing, nor a ring or watch, plus always wear safety goggles and , depending on the job, a full face mask.... Vacuum up the chips, sawdust, etc as they are produced....Being a member of my MEworkshop Group , you know how safety conscious I am, having witnessed so many industrial accidents......Regards to Gisele, and U2.... Jerry G (Glickstein) < Jerry, now that you mention it, about safety, every now and then when I'm in the shop on my own and running a machine, it suddenly goes through my mind what would I do if I got caught up in a machine, I'm all on my own, the shop is away from the house. A little short story, for all members, at work I was keying some round rods in a horizontal mill applying coolant by brush on the slotting cutter, I got careless and the brush got dragged into the cutter (back end), it happened so suddenly I hardly had time to let go of the brush handle before, I very nearly lost a whole lot of flesh and bone, when that happened I had been machining for many years and knew that I should have never have put the brush where the cutter blades were entering the material, in fact I should never have used the brush at all, so take care it will happen when you least suspect it, always stop the machine before placing your hands anywhere near the cutter, think safety. Edmund ------- Re: Ship's Ahoy! Posted by: "JERRY G" chieftoolmakerx~xxearthlink.net Date: Sun Jul 3, 2011 1:17 pm ((PDT)) Hi Ed, I could tell some real horror stories, but I will not.... All of them have two things in common....Carelessness, and suddenness..... Jerry G (Glickstein) ------- Re: Using a file SAFELY on a running lathe? [atlas_craftsman] Posted by: "Dean" deanwx~xxbmi.net deanofid Date: Mon Feb 6, 2012 6:20 pm ((PST)) "RG Sparber" wrote: > Does anyone have a fixture or procedure for safely using a file on a running lathe to break a corner? I've heard of holding the file under the spinning work piece and assume this would be with the handle facing away from the operator so the file is cutting in the right direction. It might be safer than holding it on top with the handle facing the operator. But neither thrill me. Rick < Rick, in the shops I worked in, we used the file on the top of the rotating work piece. (The file always had a handle! Using one without one got a guy a day off with no pay.) Most of us learned to use a file left handed for filing near the chuck, but it was not a mandatory practice. As early as the mid 1980's we had the OSHA crowd pestering us to go the left handed route. I do not see how using a file under the work would make things better. It's quite un-natural and less apt to get you a good finish, as well as being just plain awkward. Right or left handed with the file on top of the work is the way the old heads taught me. Like with ANYTHING you do on a lathe, keep your head on straight and you'll do well. Dean ------- Re: Using a file SAFELY on a running lathe? Posted by: "Dan Buchanan" db45acpx~xxyahoo.com db45acp Date: Mon Feb 6, 2012 6:53 pm ((PST)) I was taught to generally slow it down for safety, use a larger file and keep the file moving; don't just hold it in one place. Here's a fair reference to file work from file manufacturer Nicholson: http://www.evenfallstudios.com/woodworks_library/nicholson_gui de_to_filing_2006.pdf Dan ------- Re: Using a file SAFELY on a running lathe? Posted by: "Dean" deanwx~xxbmi.net deanofid Date: Mon Feb 6, 2012 7:54 pm ((PST)) "RG Sparber" wrote: > Thanks Dean. I guess it is not as uncommon a practice as I thought. > Rick No, it's not uncommon, Rick. Actually, it's a standard lathe practice, and something that was given some time in learning good techniques and safe practice. Much like anything else in machine work, such as not leaving the key in the chuck, there are good work habits to be developed in filing on the lathe. I don't know if current training programs include it, but if you look in trade manuals from SB, Sheldon, Monarch, etc. they all include sections on filing work in the lathe. Looking at the files offered by Nicholson, they still list "lathe" files. I worked at two places that had retired Navy machinists among the machinists. They were both very good at it (filing on the lathe), and I was lucky to know those men. Both gone, now. ------- Re: Using a file SAFELY on a running lathe? Posted by: "William Abernathy" williamx~xxinch.com Yahuselah Date: Mon Feb 6, 2012 9:07 pm ((PST)) I do it all the time. Usual safety precautions are double-especially important. No sleeves, rings, watchbands etc. You will be working close to a spinning chuck. There MUST be a handle on the file. No fooling! If something does go wrong, the handle will save you from being impaled on the tang. A slow speed is fine; neither high speed nor back gearing is necessary. You can't rest the file on the piece and "let the lathe do the work." Resting the file in one spot clogs the teeth. You have to move the file using proper filing technique. Proper filing technique was the first thing I learned in high school machine shop. If you don't have it down, time to learn it. Files cut on the push, and you should lift the file on the draw. I file "over the top" like God intended. I have never tried pulling under the bottom. Sounds silly to me, but the regular way seems to work fine. William ------- NOTE TO FILE: This last conversation continued; see Yahoo's atlas_craftsman group. ------- NOTE TO FILE: Following is a link to a website detailing one person's terrible health experience with brake cleaner. After reading this, I'm not going to use brake cleaner or any other product containing tetrachloroethylene, also called tetrachloroethene, ever again. There are safer products, but in truth there are very few totally safe products. Always read the product label before use, and if in any doubt about the instructions or safety warnings, look up the ingredients on the internet; you can also ask any manufacturer for the product's MSDS -- Material Safety Data Sheet -- which they must provide. http://www.brewracingframes.com/id75.htm ------- NOTE TO FILE: An interesting conversation took place in the SherlineCNC group at Yahoo titled "Helicoils -- from tooling plate thread" starting Sat May 12, 2012 and it can be found here in the Threading (Lathe and Otherwise) text file in the Metal Lathe Files section. The conversation does indeed provide some interesting and useful information about tooling plates and helicoils, and briefly goes into the matter of products that can be used for tooling (or backing) plates to hold work. Some materials like MDF or ABS plastic when cut or machined have safety implications that are briefly discussed. You would be well advised to do more research and take adequate safety precautions when using these and other substances. ------- NOTE TO FILE: The following messages are extracted from a conversation in the SherlineCNC group at Yahoo regarding the type of steel used in Sherline vise jaws [most of that conversation is recorded in the file here called Machine General]. One member advised: "Most of the steel used in Sherline machines is 12L14. It's wonderful stuff. One of the most easily machined steels due to a high lead content." The discussion then turned to health concerns when machining leaded steels. ------- [SherlineCNC] Re: What type of steel is used on replaceable sherline vise jaws? Posted by: "rankinecyclce1" baboonhead11x~xxyahoo.com Date: Thu May 24, 2012 2:41 pm ((PDT)) Oh the leaded stuff. I was thinking maybe it was this. Are there health hazards to the handling and machining of leaded steels, although the lead is in the metallic crystal structure, it is still possible to be hazardous perhaps? Wash hands before eating? I've always been wary of dentists using a mercury alloy in dental fillings back in the day and nowadays they dont use it anymore. Or use leaded water pipes which they are still trying to get rid of. I still have some 304 stock lying around that I don't dare to touch yet. ------- Re: What type of steel is used on replaceable sherline vise jaws? Posted by: "a3sigma" dcclark111x~xxcomcast.net Date: Thu May 24, 2012 3:40 pm ((PDT)) There are concerns with leaded steel alloys -- as there are with many products and materials used in the shop. Basic safety precautions include not eating or drinking in the shop, thorough hand washing, and avoiding inhaling anything but air. Material Data Safety Sheets are available on-line. DC ------- Re: What type of steel is used on replaceable sherline vise jaws? Posted by: "Jeffrey T. Birt" birt_jx~xxsoigeneris.com Date: Thu May 24, 2012 4:43 pm ((PDT)) There are health concerns for any metal that is converted into dust or fumes in the shop. While 12L14 does contain lead, up to 2.5% or so, it also contains manganese which can also be an irritant when inhaled. Basically you just need to use common sense like you would for any other material. If I'm doing a lot of grinding I find a face mask keeps the gunk out of my nose and the face shield keeps it off my face J , breathing in welding fumes all day is not good for you etc. I get into spurts where I like to do a lot of wood working and went many years without a dust collector. After I bought one I was amazed at how much cleaner the air was (not to mention not having a nose full of sawdust snot.) Again, I should have let my common sense kick in years ago and saved up my pennies to buy a DC. Jeff Birt Soigeneris.com ------- NOTE TO FILE: The following safety topic was extracted from a conversation in the Yahoo Group shopbuilttools dealing with choosing a sander for the workshop. To see the rest of that discussion on choice of sanding tools, look in the text file here called Machine General starting January 2013. ------- Re: Multipurpose sander/grinder for small shop Posted by: "gdnichols" gdnicholsx~xxaol.com Date: Sat Jan 12, 2013 7:03 am ((PST)) I have had a Grizzly G1014Z Combination Sander 6" x 48" Belt 9" Disc http://www.grizzly.com/products/Combination-Sander-6-x-48-Belt-9-Di sc-Z-Series/G1014Z for 11 years and it has served well. Like most sanders, dust collection is poor and the on/off switch is in a bad place -- but other than that, it has worked well. I also have a little 1 x 30 Delta which I have absolutely worn out in 20 years and a newish "No Name" 1 x 30 with a 5" disk which I use to sand small wheels round. I have a Ryobi oscillating drum sander but almost never use it. I have several smaller sanders of which the most interesting is a tiny Porter Cable belt sander Porter-Cable 371K 2 1/2 by 14-inch Compact Belt Sander Kit. It is much easier to control than a larger belt sander I have. If I could only have one electric sander, it would probably be a 6" x 48" belt/Disk such as the Grizzly I mentioned above. If I could have two sanders the second one would be a random orbit sander with good dust collection. I make a lot of toys and other small items and the Great Planes extruded aluminum sanding blocks are indispensable to me: http://www.greatplanes.com/accys/gpmr6169.html They come in different sizes but I like the 2-1/4" x 5-1/2" size. I keep four handy in 80, 120, 150 and 220 grit. A year ago, I got pneumonia after a couple of weeks of sanding in the shop. I've heard breathing sanding dust can cause pneumonia so, as usual, I wore a fairly good paper facemask. Apparently it didn't work so I'm thinking of getting a cartridge dust mask to use while sanding (not for paint). Does anyone have any suggestions? ------- Re: Multipurpose sander/grinder for small shop Posted by: "David G. LeVine" dlevinex~xxspeakeasy.net Date: Sat Jan 12, 2013 9:32 pm ((PST)) Yes, get a positive pressure mask (like Triton or Trend), but they ALL are big and clunky. Another option is to find a high volume, low pressure blower and force the air through a sub-micron filter and flood the face area with clean air. This allows lighter masks, but may not meet NIOSH standards. They may still be safe for both sanding and painting if the air never can allow reverse particle penetration. Whatever you do, assume that silicosis (from the alumina on the paper) will kill you and plan accordingly. Dave 8{) ------- Re: Multipurpose sander/grinder for small shop Posted by: "Jim W" ruler2112x~xxyahoo.com Date: Sat Jan 12, 2013 11:27 pm ((PST)) I have the respirator (bought locally for ~$16) at the following URL. The 3M masks that everybody (Home Depot, Menards, Lowes, etc) sells aren't large enough for me, but this one is comfortable and does an excellent job of filtering particulates. I added 3-4 layers of paper toweling, cut to fit the plastic part, before the filter itself. This saves the primary filter and it's quick & easy to toss the front layer of paper towel and add one to the back. Jim http://www.tcpglobal.com/detailsupplydepot/itemdetail.aspx?item no=SAS+8661-93 ------- Re: General workshop practices (gloves, cleaning, storage) [myfordlathes] Posted by: "Gord Taylor" gtaylor31x~xxcogeco.ca safetgord Date: Tue Feb 12, 2013 4:29 pm ((PST)) The chip trays of all lathes and Mills should always be kept free of swarf especially when turning hard stuff with ceramic tool bits. The swarf and chips comme off red hot and can ignite any aluminum/magnesium chips left in the tray from previous turning operations. When these fires start you may not be able to put them out unless you have a special extinguisher handy. You might lose the lathe or even your shop. Safetgord ------- Re: Parts Cleaning [SherlineCNC] Posted by: "Tom Wade" tomx~xxwade.name arcmaster3 Date: Mon Jun 10, 2013 6:50 am ((PDT)) Here's a warning about using brake cleaner to wash parts.... http://tomwade.me/motorcycles/phosgene.php Tom Wade ------- Organisation: Getting a grip on my stuff. [myfordlathes] Posted by: "rpledm" rplangloisx~xxgmail.com Date: Sun Jun 16, 2013 5:14 pm ((PDT)) The Myford cabinet is a wonderful place to chuck stuff but absolutely awful when it comes to finding anything. In an attempt to reduce the time wasted looking I decided about 10 years ago to install a set of drawers in the cabinet. Last month I finally got around to half of the job and this is the result: See photos in Yahoo: Groups: Myford: Rob's Album. The wood sub-cabinet is a tight fit but will come out. Although the space at the sides is unavailable, the three levels more than make up for the loss. ------- Re: Organisation: Getting a grip on my stuff. Posted by: "garthn444" garthnx~xxpbt.co.za Date: Mon Jun 17, 2013 2:17 am ((PDT)) That's excellent - another to-do on my list now. I am already finding the cabinet as it is, is pretty useless except for some large items. ------- Re: Organisation: Getting a grip on my stuff. Posted by: "Ken Strauss" ken.straussx~xxgmail.com Date: Mon Jun 17, 2013 7:10 am ((PDT)) What is the clamp thing on top of the QCGB in your first photo? ------- Re: Organisation: Getting a grip on my stuff. Posted by: "rpledm" rplangloisx~xxgmail.com Date: Mon Jun 17, 2013 9:24 am ((PDT)) That's a T3 connector. :) T3 = Thingy To Thingy. It's a magnetic/clamping base for an LED light fixture. LEDs don't explode when errant chips come off at high speed. At one point in the past an incandescent bulb caught a chip, exploded, and I caught a glass shard on my eye lid. Combining its sharpness with its temperature it left a nasty little scar about 2mm from my eye. In the lab at school I have a very clearly printed warning on the board that safety glasses are to be worn at all times and each machine in my personal workshop has safety glasses sitting right on it. But for one brief moment I wanted to take a close look at the work and .... So, now I always wear safety glasses. All the time. ------- Date: Wed, 15 Jan 2014 17:45:23 -0500 From: Bob Miller Subject: Re: [OldTools] Dust Masks. On Sun, Jan 12, 2014 at 3:43 AM, Mal Thomas wrote: > So, there are loads of different types of mask out there...what type is > popular with wood workers ? One that is comfortable for loger periods > and of course does the job. I use a 3m mask with replaceable cartridges. Specifically a 7503. I find it really comfortable for even hours of use plus the silicone seals better over my beard than the fabric ones. I use 3M 2097 P100 cartridges for it which may be overkill but I like overkill. I use it both for woodworking and for entering some of the manufacturing areas at my work that have not been used in decades. They are supposedly safe but being in any of those buildings makes your lungs burn. Wear mask == no burning feeling. You can also buy fancier cartridges for dealing with fumes from a lot of finishes though I have not done so because shellac flakes + everclear is not exactly bad for you. I have also been known to wear mine while mowing the lawn in heavy allergy season. All that being said I I believe I am one of the younger list members and may be more worried about long term health problems than most. Also the mask makes it easy to pretend to be an astronaut so that's a perk. Bob ------- Date: Wed, 15 Jan 2014 22:28:46 -0500 From: "Cliff Rohrabacher Esq." Subject: Re: [OldTools] Dust Masks. On 1/12/2014 3:43 AM, Mal Thomas wrote: > Ok, just read a chapter in a book re the risks of dust, sap and other wood borne particulates. Some scary stuff indeed. Now I always (generally*) wear a mask when sanding or doing other work that creates wood dust. This is what I use with a P2 disposable filter https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/37914238/wood/face%20mask.jpg *now when I said 'generally' I mean there are the odd occasions where I get lazy and don't put the mask on because its a pain to adjust each time and it tends to make my face sweat a bit. But after reading this book, I think I will be 'encouraged' to wear the mask more often ;-) So, there are loads of different types of mask out there...what type is popular with wood workers ? One that is comfortable for loger periods and of course does the job. TIA Cheers Mal Oz. < If you are a neander wood dust is pretty much not a problem. Sanding and machining liberate enormous mounts of silica in the micron and sub-micron particle size. In my business there is a saying: "Silica the next asbestos." The best defense is a good dust control system that gets sub micron particles. Few do. ------- Re: micro milling [SherlineCNC] Posted by: "David Clark" dcclark111x~xxcomcast.net a3sigma Date: Mon Sep 14, 2015 11:41 am ((PDT)) In SherlineCNCx~xxyahoogroups.com, wrote : >> Are you using any cutting fluid? Try flooding with pure isopropyl >> alcohol. >> David Clark in Southern Maryland, USA On Sep 14, 2015, gp_illustratorx~xxyahoo.com [SherlineCNC] wrote: > Is 91% isopropyl alcohol good enough? I like pure isopropyl because it evaporates completely leaving no residue. I've never had a problem with it washing away needed lubrication. Wetting with alcohol really does seem to have a lubricating effect as well as cooling, especially cutting aluminum with HSS. Just try it. Even helps hand tapping. You can get small quantities at a pharmacist. I buy it by the gallon at a nearby Granger. Be very carful ordering it, though. You may be hit with a very high hazardous material shipping charge. David Clark in Southern Maryland, USA ------- Re: micro milling Posted by: "Mike Bauers" mwbauers55x~xxwi.rr.com mwbauers Date: Mon Sep 14, 2015 11:56 am ((PDT)) David, The stuff is poisonous. I don't know when you’ll use it in a long enough session to hurt yourself from misting it. But there is a point where you are threatened with permanent blindness and organ damage from ingesting-absorbing enough of it over time. Spend more and get the cheapest drinkable alcohol you can find. Perhaps a very cheap generic clear Vodka or a cheap pure grain medical alcohol? While you might get just a bit drunk from the mist following a long work session, you at least won’t have the side effects of a poisonous wood- based alcohol attacking you. Best to ya, Mike Bauers Milwaukee, Wi ------- Re: micro milling Posted by: "David Clark" dcclark111x~xxcomcast.net a3sigma Date: Mon Sep 14, 2015 12:20 pm ((PDT)) Mike, I never misted the isopropyl, just squirted it from a wash bottle. Could hardly even smell the vapors. I used it and saw it used thusly every working day for over 25 years in one of NASA’s largest machine shops. There we were subject to the strictest health, safety, and environmental regulations with constant inspections. Never was an issue. On some flight projects with very tight contamination protocols we were required to use ethanol, but that was rare. DC ------- Re: micro milling Posted by: "Mike Bauers" mwbauers55x~xxwi.rr.com mwbauers Date: Mon Sep 14, 2015 12:33 pm ((PDT)) Well, -if- you were misting it, and that wasn’t clear from the posts, the original flooding use if used while actively machining would be making some degree of surrounding vapors or cloud. A safer alcohol would be advised with increased use. Best to ya, Mike Bauers Milwaukee, Wi ------- Re: micro milling Posted by: jowhowhox~xxyahoo.com jowhowho Date: Mon Sep 14, 2015 8:32 pm ((PDT)) Don't drink or huff isopropyl alcohol. You'll be fine using it occasionally in the home shop. Use common sense with ventilation and large area/duration skin exposure. Same goes for methanol. Fire is of much more concern than poisoning. In a workplace, where exposure frequency and duration might get out of hand, follow safety guidelines -- very good ventilation, and very little skin exposure. Now let me tell you about fructose and excessive carbohydrates; they'll kill you! And whatever you do, don't get in a car! ------- Re: micro milling Posted by: clivef63x~xxgmail.com clivefouche Date: Mon Sep 14, 2015 10:54 pm ((PDT)) With many years experience as an aircraft machinist I can say that methylated spirits is the best cutting fluid for aluminium. ------- NOTE TO FILE: I am personally going to use the least toxic products possible. Some folks here are perhaps correct about being able to use other alcohols under strictest safety procedures (good ventilation, minimized skin contact, and wearing suitable protective masks, etc.) but it seems far wiser to use the least toxic substance for home use, and still employ all the applicable government and safety agencies' recommended safety procedures too. ------- ------------------------------------------------------------------ This is just one of some 80 files about machining and metalworking and useful workshop subjects that can be read at: http://www.janellestudio.com/metal/index.html ------------------------------------------------------------------