Many tips by owners on using your Sherline lathe or solving problems. A Sherline mill or lathe owner will get some useful information by reading the Taig mill and lathe files as the machines are similar enough in size to share some problems and solutions and tooling. If you got to this file directly from my HOME PAGE, return there by using your browser's back button. BUT if you came to this file as the result of a web search engine, see more than 70 additional files on my home page Machining and Metalworking at Home http://www.janellestudio.com/metal/ SAFETY WARNING BEWARE: DO NOT ASSUME that any subject matter or procedure or process is safe or correct or appropriate just because it was mentioned in a news/user group or was included in these files or on this site or on any other web site or was published in a magazine or book or video. Working with metals and machinery and chemicals and electrical equipment is inherently dangerous. Wear safety devices and clothing as appropriate. Remove watches, rings, and jewellery -- and secure or remove loose clothing -- before operating any machine. Read, understand and follow the latest operating procedures and safety instructions provided by the manufacturer of your machine or tool or product. If you do not have those most recent official instructions, acquire a copy through the manufacturer before operating or using their product. Where the company no longer exists, use the appropriate news or user group to locate an official copy. Be careful -- original instructions may not meet current safety standards. Updated safety information and operating instructions may also be available through a local club, a local professional in the trade, a local business, or an appropriate government agency. In every case, use your common sense before beginning or taking the next step; and do not proceed if you have any questions or doubts about any procedure, or the safety of any procedure. Follow all laws and codes, and employ certified or licenced professionals as required by those laws or codes. Hazardous tasks beyond your competence or expertise should also be contracted to professionals. Let's be really careful out there. (c) Copyright 2003 - 2008 Machining and Metalworking at Home The form of the collected work in this text file (including editing, additions, and notes) is copyrighted and this file is not to be reproduced by any means, including electronic, without written permission except for strictly personal use. ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 20 Jun 2001 08:33:09 -0700 From: "Craig Libuse" Subject: Re: How to use cut-off tool with riser blocks? > I'm probably missing something simple, but I can't find a means to use the > cut-off tool with the riser blocks in place... Dear Bill, At this time Sherline does not offer a riser block for the standard cutoff tool holder, although it is an easy item to make. Use a block similar to the rear cutoff tool riser block but make it the same height as the headstock riser block. See www.sherline.com/3016pg.htm for a photo of the similar item. It's just a block of the proper height with a hole through it. You will need a longer socket head screw to accommodate the extra length. For those who have the quick-change toolpost system (P/N 2250), there is now a riser block for that setup which would allow you to use a cutoff tool. It is P/N 2251. A riser block was not included in the line because only small parts should be parted with it, and it was felt that the riser blocks would only be used when turning large parts. We are finding, however, that many people leave the riser blocks in place all the time, so perhaps a riser for the cutoff tool will be a future accessory addition. --Craig Libuse Sherline Products -------------------------------- From: "Hoeffer, Ty" Date: Fri Jul 7, 2000 4:47 pm Subject: RE: [sherline] resettable handwheels worthwhile? >>>>From: Dave Martindale Sent: Friday, July 07, 2000 I'm currently using a borrowed Unimat minilathe, but thinking of buying my own. The Sherline is one of the main contenders. For those of you with the "adjustable zero" handwheels, I have a couple of questions: How do they work - is the black round thing visible on the front of the handwheel the lock for the collar engraved with the numbers? How well do they work - is it practical to reset the collar to zero without disturbing the position of the handwheel itself? Overall, are they worth the extra $50 or so when getting a new lathe? Dave <<<< YES! The Resettable handwheels are ABSOLUTELY worth it. I constantly reset the handwheels. They are invaluable when machining so that you can loate the axis move a point & reset the wheel to ZERO & then move a specific amount from that point. Yes the black knob is the lock for the indexed wheel. I have never had a problem accidentally bumping the handwheel while resetting. If you buy the lathe without You will end up upgrading soon after. Otherwise you will have to write the setting down, figure out the amount to turn to & what number to stop at, as opposed to reseting to zero, turn the wheel until you hit the needed number. The .050" per turn means just two turns per .10". Ty ------- From: "Dean Williams" Date: Fri Jul 7, 2000 4:49 pm Subject: Re: resettable handwheels worthwhile? Hello Dave; Yes the small black knob is to lock the engraved collar. I have these collars on my 4400 and 5400 lathe and mill. They are no trouble to reset to zero while maintaining the handwheel position. Just use a gentle touch while doing so. I would not even consider a lathe or mill without them. They make it much easier to keep track of things. Cheers: Dean W ------- Date: Sun, 14 Oct 2001 21:48:01 EDT From: aermoterx~xxaol.com Subject: Tailstock problems Last spring someone was having problems with their tailstock not lining up with the headstock. I was having the same problems and tried my best to correct it. I now have discovered the cause and have corrected it. A friend of mine came over today to level up my big lathe for me and when he was done I took the level and checked my sherline. It seems that the bed was twisted some 40 thousands out due to an unlevel bench where it was mounted. Now with the lathe level, the twist is gone and the tailstock lines up like it should and the slight taper problem that I had is gone. Tim Christoff Basehor, Ks. ------- Date: Mon, 15 Oct 2001 10:01:58 -0700 From: "Craig Libuse" Subject: Re: Tailstock problems It seems that the bed was twisted > some 40 thousands out due to an unlevel bench where it was mounted. > Now with the lathe level, the twist is gone and the tailstock lines up > like it should and the slight taper problem that I had is gone. Dear Tim, thanks for the reminder. This is another reason we recommend mounting the lathe and mill to a piece of flat shelf material on rubber feet. It is not only portable and quiet, but it also eliminates twist introduced by mounting to a warped surface. Like a dry cleaner being blamed for missing buttons, we often get blamed for problems that are introduced after the machine leaves the factory. Sincerely Yours, Craig Libuse ------- Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2001 08:53:26 -0800 From: "Craig Libuse" Subject: Re: Re-packing Sherline lathe into its box Dear Mike, I just watched a 4400 being packaged. You didn't specify which machine you have, but the prodedures are similar: 1. Insert the large cardboard insert into the bottom of the box with the "wings" sticking up. The smaller insert with the cutout for the base goes on the "floor" of the box. 2. The crosslide is removed from the lathe and wrapped in bubble pack. It is placed against one side of the box and then the "wings" of the insert are folded in a triangle shape so they go down to where the base of the machine will rest. 3. The motor and speed control are removed from the headstock. The motor is packaged in the largest box with the cord sticking out and still attached to the speed control. Set aside, it is packed later. 4. A small piece of cardboard is placed across the left end of the cutout in the bottom to keep the lathe base from shifting. Then the lathe is placed into the cutout shape in the bottom insert with the headstock end to the left. The faceplate is installed on the spindle nose. (The handwheels remain on the tailstock and leadscrew.) 5. A long piece of cardboard (actually one of the cutouts from the cardboard base) is laid on the saddle with its ends sticking up at both the headstock and tailstock end. 6. There are two middle sized boxes that are placed on end and crossways on the lathe bed starting at the headstock. The first contains the 3-jaw chuck. The second contains all the miscelleanous parts like the motor mount, belt, screws, hex keys, etc. 7. Next, the speed control is placed next to the second box with the cord sticking downward and the motor (in its box) is wedged sideways across the bed between the two sides of the cardboard insert. Finally the largest of the boxes containing the other chuck is placed next to the motor box on the lathe bed. (It should come even with the inside of the top of the box for support.) 8. A piece of cardboard is folded and placed next to this box, and then the tailstock is loosened and shoved up tightly against the last box and then retightened. A few turns on the tailstock handwheel lock all the boxes together so they can't move. 9. A piece of cardboard is folded over several times and wedged between the left end of the box and the end of the spindle shaft. 10. A smal empty box was provided. This is placed between the leadscrew handwheel and the other end of the box to lock the machine in place and protect the handwheel handle. The two plastic belt guard pieces are wrapped in bubble pack and inserted anywhere there is room. Bubblepak can be rolled up and pressed into any voids to prevent any shifting of the machine. The instructions go in last and the box is sealed. Hope this helps. Craig Libuse Sherline ------- Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2001 10:46:42 -0800 From: "Craig Libuse" Subject: Re: Re: Re-packing Sherline lathe into its box Mike: Over the years, the shippers have treated merchandise rougher and rougher. We have had to continually improve our packing methods to make sure the tools arrive undamaged. I didn't mention it, but when shipping by mail or UPS, we normally place the sealed lathe box inside a larger box with foam "peanuts" between the two. If a moving company is handling yours, the single box should be sufficient. Sincerely Yours, Craig Libuse ------- Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2001 11:53:39 -0800 From: "Craig Libuse" Subject: Re: Faceplate > Is it possible to use the faseplate by clamping things to it in order > to use it in the lathe? (or is the face plate to weak) Joachim: One of the main purposes of the faceplate is to hold parts. If the slots provided don't work for you, feel free to drill and tap it, turn it, customize it in any way you want to mount parts. Parts can also be attached with "superglue" and then heated with a torch to remove them. They are only $8 and are considered "disposable". If you clamp and out-of-balance part to it, watch your turning speed. You can add counterweights to get it close to balanced if necessary. See page 119 (2nd printing) of "Tabletop Machining" for a photo of Bob Bresslauer making custom model car wheels. He has 9 faceplates shown, each with a brass wheel blank bolted up to it. Craig Libuse Sherline Products ------- Date: Mon, 3 Dec 2001 10:55:37 -0500 From: "Dan Statman" Subject: Re: snapping t-nuts Original Message ----- From: To: > How much pressure should be put on the t-nut that holds a tool holder > to the cross slide. I have managed to bend one and snap one completely > off. However, no matter how much preasure I put on them, the tool > holders seem to want to rotate. Is there a recommended amount of torque > which would be applied to them? Is there a way to have them hardened? You are applying WAY to much torque to the nuts. You might want to start looking at other sources for the slipping of the toolholder rather than not enough torque on the t-nuts. These sources can be: chips under the tool holder (embedded in the block even), oil, dirt, other crap, etc. Daniel J. Statman, Statman Designs www.statmandesigns.com ------- Date: Mon, 3 Dec 2001 11:04:58 EST From: Cmcvclockx~xxaol.com Subject: Re: snapping t-nuts In a message dated 12/3/01, kevin.sedotax~xxps.net writes: > However, no matter how much pressure I put on them, the tool > holders seem to want to rotate Its possible that you have distorted the cross slide to the point where there is a high spot which would make it easy for the holder to rotate - check it out with a known straight edge to make sure. I snug mine fairly well, but don't try to get overly tight, never had a problem except when I tried taking too deep of a cut. Chris -------- Date: Mon, 03 Dec 2001 16:58:37 -0600 From: "Bad Brad" Subject: Re: snapping t-nuts Make sure the tool holder and table (cross slide) are clean, free of chips, oil and grease. A sharp, properly ground tool mounted in the tool holder correctly will take little feed pressure to cut most metals (even heavy cuts). Snug will al that is required to mount the tool holder. Forrest ------- Date: Mon, 3 Dec 2001 21:14:55 -0500 From: "Marshall Pharoah" Subject: Re: snapping t-nuts Kevin, I have experienced the toolposts turning also, although I haven't yet snapped a t-nut. Generally it happens because the bit is so far out it gives lots of leverage. Sometimes you need the bit out that far for clearance. What I did was screw down a bar in front of the toolpost. The bar straddled both slots and butted right up against the toolpost. That was enough to keep it from spinning. My new quickchange toolpost spins easily also, I'm looking at a similar solution for it soon. Marshall ------- Date: Wed, 5 Dec 2001 21:52:16 -0500 From: "Marshall Pharoah" Subject: New photo added to group album Thought you might like to see the new home I built for my Sherline lathe, It's in the Frog album as cabinet.jpg. The cabinet is made from scrub oak. The lathe is sitting on a 1/2 inch thich aluminum base mounted in a revere-ware cake pan as a chip tray. The drawers are empty at the moment, but I'll be lining them and adding dividers to hold tooling specific to the lathe. Marshall ------- Date: Fri, 21 Dec 2001 05:34:00 -0000 From: "kentfreeman" Subject: Re: Tooling plate on lathe cross slide In sherlinex~xxy..., "Brad Butler" wrote: >>> Just a curiosity how many of you out there that are using the milling column's on the lathe are using a tooling plate on top of the lathe cross slide? I am having a problem that when I bolt down a tooling plate the cross slide becomes twice as hard to move. I have never over tightened any mounting bolts and the lathe is quite new. If I loosen the mounting bolts up any more the tooling plate will not stay put. When I bought the milling column I made a 1/2" thick tooling plate out of stress relieved steel and surface ground and verified that it was indeed flat (I am a professional machinist and mechanical engineer). I have not tried the Sherline auxiliary tooling plate but I can't believe I would get any different result. Maybe I am just a perfectionist used to operating full sized mills. Is anyone else having this same problem. I have thought about shimming the plate but this is kind of a pain to do each time I switch to a milling setup. I would like to use a tooling plate to protect the aluminum cross slide. P.S going to bring my good indicators home this weekend and try to determine if and how much the cross slide is out. Thanks Brad Butler, AccelPak <<< I have the same problem. I also have a similar problem when I use a tool post. The cross slide gets stiff. ------- Date: Fri, 21 Dec 2001 13:10:33 -0600 From: "Bad Brad" Subject: Re: Re: Tooling plate on lathe cross slide Mount the tool plate and then adjust the gib for the cross slide. For the tool post you should remove all oil and grease from the bottom of the tool post and top of the cross slide. A little rubbing AL will work. Shorten the amount of tool hanging out of the post too. After some use the cross slide and tool post mounting surfaces will be ruffed up enough to increase the amount of friction between the two parts, less torque will then be required on the fixing bolt. Over tightening will distort the extruded AL cross slide enough to cause the problem you speak of. Forrest ------- Date: Fri, 28 Dec 2001 23:04:31 -0500 From: "Daniel J. Statman" Subject: Re: Largest O.D > What is the largest O.D that can be chucked up in the 4400 lathe?Is > it large enough to turn blanks for R/C car wheels? This would be in > the 2-2.125" diameter range.What is the repeatability of these > machines in a cnc application? Small machines are new to me i'm used > to stuff that you can actually stand in to clean out at the end of > the day.I just want to make sure that when I buy a pair of machines I > can do what I want to do on them and be happy,at least for a while.I > know that for model car parts these are the machines of choice.Any > info will be greatly appreciated. Thanks Big E. I do not have much experience with diameters larger than 1.25", but I will try to help you. Since the chuck is 3" in diameter and the jaws are reversible you should have no problem chucking up a 2.125" diameter piece. You can also buy sets of soft jaws and true them up to your machine whenever you feel the need for extra accuracy. The main problem with the large diameters is that there is very little holding force that the chuck jaws can provide so you need to use a steady-rest if the part is longer than about 2". But the Sherline steady-rest holds a maximum diameter of 1.75", so you will have to make your own if you want to work on longer pieces. If you keep the machine well adjusted and clean, the repeatability will be very good, but I cannot give you a quantifiable number since it depends on so many factors. you will learn the limitations of the machine very quickly and adapt to its small size. If it doesn't suit your needs then sell the lathe on eBay for about 80-90% of your purchase price. Daniel J. Statman, Statman Designs www.statmandesigns.com ------- Date: Wed, 2 Jan 2002 10:04:13 -0800 From: "Craig Libuse" Subject: Re: Largest O.D The 4400A comes with a 3.1" chuck that can hold parts up to 2.75" with the jaws reversed. I have noticed, however, that people who turn complicated car wheels often mount the billet to a faceplate rather than using the chuck. This can be screwed onto either the lathe spindle or the rotary table chuck adapter, so the part can be worked on in the lathe and mill without removing it from the faceplate until you are ready to part if off and work on the back side. Mounting to a faceplate would give a much more secure mounting than holding it in a chuck with the jaws reversed. There are some photos of Bob Breslauer making car wheels in this manner in Joe Martin's book, "Tabletop Machining" on page 119. Bob bought several faceplates so he could work on a whole set of wheels at one time, doing four wheels with each setup before breaking it down. Also, with the P/N 1291 riser block set in place, larger diameter parts can be turned, but it sounds like your 2-2.125" wheels are well within the capability of the 4400. Craig Libuse Sherline Products ------- From: "Marcus & Eva" Date: Sun Jan 20, 2002 8:40 pm Subject: Re: [sherline] Sources for small cutters From: "xtremelyblue" > I've been looking on the Internet for small reamers, taps, and end > mills and have found a few places. I was wondering where you all > purchase your cutters? Also do you recommend getting a die set or is > the Sherline threading attachment a better way to go? Thanks, Darren. Hi Darren: I get Garr brand cutters (carbide) from my local machine tool dealer (Thomas Skinner and Son). I buy Niagara HSS cutters and Butter- field reamers from the same source. Same for Yamawa and Guhring taps. Don't bother to get a die set if you want to do accurate work such as is required for modelmaking. Single point threading is far more accurate, and versatile. Dies are for crude work only. Anytime you need good concentricity or an odd pitch, you can't use a die. Cheers Marcus ------- Date: Wed, 27 Feb 2002 16:43:53 +0100 (MET) From: Eivind Lund Vikebų Subject: Chuck jaws, again... :-) I have a 3-jaw 2.5" Sherline chuck, and I'd like to improve its accuracy/runout. I've found some different sources of runout: 1) Chuck threads against threads on spindle. 2) Chuck jaws against the scroll. 3) Dimensions of the jaws. 4) Scroll fit on chuck body. 5) ...suggestions? First I disassembled the chuck, cleaned it thoroughly, cleaned the spindle threads and mounted the chuck on the spindle. To check the first point I chucked up a round piece of metal and used a DTI close to the chuck to measure runout. I marked the point on the chuck where the round piece was "highest". After several "Take-chuck-off Put-chuck-on Measure" operations I saw that the runout and the highest point were the same every time. Fine. If the scroll is inaccurate I think it would give max runout at different points around the chuck, depending on the diameter of the part. To check the runout I made a lot of measurements. I measured the runout on 18 different end mills and drills. I used many different dimensions to get the jaws placed at different positions in the scroll. Every piece was fastened, measured, loosened, rotated and fastened again three times. I then calculated the average of the different pieces, and the average of all the measurements. The total average was 6.5/100 mm, and the standard deviation for the different pieces was 1.1/100 mm. The highest point was always very close to the jaw marked "B". This indicates that the jaws are located at different distances from the center. I also tried tighten the chuck using the same holes for the Tommy bars several times on the same piece of metal, but it didn't seem to improve the accuracy. It seems like it would improve the runout if I could grind about 9.3/100 mm off jaw "A" and "C". Then the runout will not have an average offset of 6.5/100 mm from the center. My problem is that I'm not sure about the best way to grind a few 1/100 mm off the jaws. It was mentioned in an earlier posting that the jaws are case hardened, does anyone know how deep the hardening is? Ideas/suggestions/comments? Eivind L. Vikebų ------- Date: Wed, 27 Feb 2002 09:17:00 -0800 From: "Craig Libuse" Subject: Re: Chuck jaws, again... :-) >It was mentioned in an earlier posting that the jaws are >case hardened, does anyone know how deep the hardening is? Eivind, The case hardening on the chuck jaws is called out at .030" thick (.76 mm). Note also that when we grind them in our fixture, we angle the headstock slightly so that the rotary grinder takes a little more off the inside part of the jaw compared to the tip. In other words, when the jaws close, they should touch at the tip before they touch at the back. This is because the jaws have a tendancy to "tip" when tightened because they are pulled by the scroll at the bottom. If they are perfectly square, they tend to grip more at the bottom of the jaw than the top. If a chuck is out of tolerance it can always be returned to the factory for fine-tuning under warranty, but the runout spec on 3-jaw self- centering chucks is .003" (.076mm). If your runout is .065 mm you are within the allowable tolerance of the chuck. With careful work you may be able to fine-tune it to closer tolerances. Worst case, if you make it worse instead of better, you can always return it to the factory and we will install new jaws and recheck it for $35.00 plus shipping. Craig Libuse Sherline Products Inc. ------- Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 09:51:59 +0100 From: "Joachim Reif" Subject: Thread Next week I“ll get my threadcutting attachment. When reading about it more specificly I read that - with the metric lathe it was not possible to cut finer threads than 40 TP. I wonder why? Is it not possible due to the metric main rod or is it due to that a gear is not included in the standard set? Not that I am going to produce a lot of your "strange" threads but the treads that are represented on the lathe. I think the most common threads here are 32, 24, 20 TPI. Have had the lathe with tools and vertical milling column for about 3 months I can say that that the Sherline is great. I have since then made tools, morse cones, slitting saw arbor, milling table for the lathe, knurling tool, and started with my steamengine. I recommend after using some more advanced milling tools to buy the sherline X-Y table. I will do so as soon I can afford it. Joachim Reif Gothenburg Sweden ------- Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 09:24:58 -0800 From: "Craig Libuse" Subject: Re: Re: Thread >>When reading about it more specificly I read that - with the metric lathe it was not possible to cut finer threads than 40 TP. I wonder why? Is it not possible due to the metric main rod or is it due to that a gear is not included in the standard set? << Using the metric leadscrew to cut inch gears requires the substitution of the 127 tooth gear for the 100 tooth gear used in the inch setups in the "A" position. The "A" gear is a 100-tooth gear for all gear sizes from 5 TPI up to 40 TPI. Beyond that size, the "A" gear changes to a 50-tooth gear. Substituting the 127 tooth gear no longer provides the correct conversion factor between the two systems of measurement. Craig Libuse Sherline Products Inc. ------- Date: Fri, 19 Apr 2002 01:21:45 -0400 From: "Carol & Jerry Jankura" Subject: RE: More stuff to want Mark: You can put the threading attachment on the machine without removing the motor. Here's a pointer to a picture showing how it's done http://groups.yahoo.com/group/sherline/files/Machining%20tiny%20th readed%20part/Thread%20milling%20rig.jpg I've tried it and it works for me. I don't know why Sherline doesn't show this method, unless they're afraid that someone'll run the motor to make the thread. Jerry ------- Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2002 22:56:34 -0500 From: Thomas Gilmour Subject: Re: Locking the crossslide > Is anybody aware of a way to lock the crossslide on the Sherline > lathe? Do I need to modofy the lathe or is there some way to > accomplish this that I missed in the manual?> > Sorry if this seems to be a dumb question, I just haven't found > it in the manual. Thanks, Dan Kaschner There is no crosslide lock on the lathe. You can add one by mounting a small rectangular plate to the left side of the saddle, just in front of the bed, with a 10-32 SHCS. The plate extends up to contact the left side of the saddle when the screw is tightened. Add a rollpin below the screw to keep the plate from spinning out of position. Tom ------- Date: Sat, 16 Mar 2002 16:09:09 -0800 From: "Brad Butler" Subject: A lesson in deflection I was bored today so I decided to sit down and figure out exactly what impact deflection had on my Sherline long bed lathe. I started out by aligning the head to the cross slide using a hardened 3/8" dowel pin held in my 4 jaw chuck. After some fiddling I was able to get the head within .0001 over a 1 1/2" length in the horizontal axis. In the vertical axis the closest I was able to get it was within .001. Note, vertical adjustments require shimming the head and a little goes a very long way. Even a layer of oil on the bed prior to bolting the headstock down does make a difference. Anyway, then I made a series very light cuts (.001) in a 1/2" dia 6061 aluminum bar with a very sharp cutter. The result was a taper of 2 thousands over a 1 1/2" length. No matter how light the cut I was unable to improve on this without a follower rest. Next I rechucked the test pin and it measured exactly the same. Now I chucked a 1" dia brass bar and made several light cuts again. The difference was 1 1/4 thousands over 1 1/2" length. Again the test pin measurement remained unchanged. The only remaining factors were the vertical misalignment and cutter/work deflection. Now what does this tell me, that to get a very accurate cut on a bar I must align the head using test cutting only and not rely on a ground pin no matter how accurate it is. Now this may not seem to astounding to the more experienced machinists out there but while I have a great deal of time on full size mills I do not have much experience with the lathe yet. Before starting I figured that I would have possibly .0005 in difference from end to end. In order to get that kind of accuracy I had to simply do a little amount of hand work afterwards with some 1200 grit sand paper. Just thought I would post my findings. P.S. Think a full size mill is ridgid, just pushing on the head of a Bridgeport while checking the tram of the head will make a difference on your dial indicator! Brad B. ------- Date: Fri, 19 Apr 2002 14:15:49 -0700 From: "Craig Libuse" Subject: Re: More stuff to want Matt, any Sherline lathe can be purchased without the headstock/motor /speed control assembly for $160 less than the full lathe price. This is not listed on the price lists, but is available as a special order direct from the factory or through dealers. (Replacement price for a new headstock/motor/speed control is $260.00 if you buy it later.) The headstock/motor unit is identical on all Sherline lathes and mills and can be swapped back and forth. Keep in mind that though it takes only seconds to swap the headstock, depending on the level of accuracy needed in your job it can take a while to indicate it in for proper alignment. If budget is a primary consideration perhaps this additional work each time can be justified by the $160.00 savings; however, if you find you are switching back and forth a lot and the extra time becomes a hassle, you will pay a $100 penalty to add the second headstock/motor unit later on. Craig Libuse Sherline Products ------- Date: Mon, 22 Apr 2002 10:29:24 -0700 From: "Craig Libuse" Subject: Re: Threading with motor attached >>>I have one question for Craig regarding the practice of threading with the motor attached. Will the feedback from the motor turning during threading damage the DC drive? Some drives are easily damaged by reverse feedback. Is the one that Sherline supplies able to deal with the feedback? I have not tried threading with the motor attached for this very reason as I am not too keen on the idea of having to replace the DC drive. Brad Butler. <<< This can be a problem; however, we have not had any reports of damaged lectronics from the people who are using their threading attachment with the motor in place. The low speeds involved in hand cranking probably will not produce enough current to do damage. It's not much worse than using the spindle handwheel to index the spindle by hand. If it is a concern for you, I would suggest you simply loosen the two motor adjustment screws and take tension off the belt so it slips. This will also make it easier to turn the threading handwheel. When you plug your machine back in and reconfigure for regular turning again, just remember to push the motor out into position to tension the belt and retighten the screws. Craig Libuse Sherline Products ------- Date: Sat, 18 May 2002 15:15:16 -0700 (PDT) From: samedi Subject: Removing stubborn handwheel Hi gang, I've been lurking a few weeks picking up some good tips. Now I've got a problem I haven't been able to solve. I'm trying to recondition a pair of used 4000 lathes I bought recently, and one of them is giving me a real headache because I can't get the X-axis handwheel to come off. It's a zero-settable wheel and after backing the setscrew out as far as it will go (not all the way out but far enough that it shouldn't be holding anything) I can't even pry the handle off with a screwdriver. The other lathe has come apart without any trouble, but had non-zeroable handwheels. Is there something obvious I'm missing, or are there any tips for getting the wheel off without breaking anything? Thanks, Brian ------- Date: Sat, 18 May 2002 21:40:10 -0400 From: RichD Subject: Re: Removing stubborn handwheel Brian, what has happened is the setscrew was tightened onto an area not in the groove provided and raised a burr. This locks the aluminum wheel onto the shaft. When you turn the wheel on the shaft two grooves are formed that further make the situation worse. All that can be done is to use a gear puller if they are the non- adjustable type. If they are adjustable, the shaft is in a blind hole. Unscrew the leadscrew from the slide and anchor the screw between smooth vise jaws protected with soft aluminum sheet strips. Now you can pull and twist the knob off. Hopefully there will be little damage. RichD ------- Date: Thu, 13 Jun 2002 11:31:35 -0700 From: "Craig Libuse" Subject: Re: short vs. long bed lathe >Craig, why doesn't Sherline offer a package with short bed but larger >chucks and resettable handwheels? Is it just that anyone >who can afford these options also wants the longer bed? Dave, Sherline will sell you the lathe packages any way you want. The short bed lathe with the resettable handwheels is popular with watchmakers and is designated P/N 4500. You can order the 4500 lathe with the A, B or C packages. We normally supply the smaller chucks with the short bed lathe as a cost saving measure, but you can specify the larger chucks and just pay the difference in cost for the chucks ($30 more for the 3.1" 3-jaw and $10 more for the 3/8" drill chuck. We don't recommend the 3/8 drill chuck with the short bed lathe because it is longer than the 1/4" chuck and the extra length eats up a lot of the available space between centers. While OK for short drills, the advantage of the 3/8" chuck is the ability to hold drills up to 3/8". Most 3/8" drills are pretty long, so by the time you put on a longer 3/8" chuck and a long 3/8" drill plus a 3-jaw chuck on the other end, you don't have much of your 8" center-to-center distance left for a part. This is the main reason we came out with the longer bed lathe. When using a big 3/8" chuck and longer drills or reamers, you never run out of working room with 17" between centers, but if you want the short lathe with the bigger chucks, Sherline will certainly sell a package that way. Just talk to Kim and tell her what you want. However, if you are planning to work on projects where a 3/8" drill chuck is called for, I think many list members will agree, sooner or later you will be wishing you had opted for the longer lathe. The 4000A lists for $550.00 and the 4400A lists for $675.00 The 4500A is $595.00 When you add and extra $40.00 for the larger chucks, you are up to $635.00. The 4400 also comes with a rocker tool post which costs $15.00 more than the standard tool post that comes with the 4500, so the extra length is really only costing you $25.00 more. If you don't mind reaching an extra 9" for the leadscrew handwheel, I still think the 4400 is worth considering. Craig Libuse Sherline Products ------- Date: Thu, 13 Jun 2002 13:57:53 -0500 (CDT) From: Lan Brooks Subject: Re: short vs. long bed lathe About 14 years ago I bought the shortbed lathe under a Jensen Tools label and it worked fine, except for one part of a project that had one piece that was 5" long. I never could get this part with a consistent finish due to having to move the tool holder around to get both ends. (I could do better now I think since I was just learning at the time.) When I finally "trashed" this lathe, after 10 years of abusing it, I bought the then new long bed lathe. I have not regretted the decision although it does take up a bit of workbench space. I think if you are planning non working on anything over about 4" long in the lathe, you should consider the long bed lathe just to ensure that your setups and tooling do not get crowded. The extra length is really not very noticeable, although I bought a mill when I bought the long bed lathe so I don't have experience there, and if this is the first lathe you have it won't feel awkward since you won't know any different. Lan ------- Date: Tue, 20 Aug 2002 09:07:02 -0700 From: "Craig Libuse" Subject: Re: Leaving the group To the group, Joe and I have decided not to have me continue to monitor the group on a daily basis. This being a "users group", we felt our presence might be considered "spying" and might hamper the free flow of ideas and comments. Also, building and maintaining the Foundation's Craftsmanship Museum in addition to my regular job limits the time I have available to read and answer all the postings. This will in no way limit anyone from asking a question of me directly if it relates to something I can answer. Just e-mail me at craigx~xxsherline.com or call (800) 541-0735 during business hours. I consider this group to be a very valuable resource for Sherline machinists and will continue to refer new customers to join the group. Thanks or all your help. Sincerely Yours Craig Libuse Sherline Products Inc. ------- Date: Tue, 20 Aug 2002 21:14:01 -0000 From: "clibuse" Subject: Re: Leaving the group - a missed opportunity for Sherline Eric and all the group, Thanks for your support. I have rejoined the group but will not be receiving the daily e-mails. I will read the current posts as time allows. If anyone has a question that needs my attention, please let me know to check on the thread and can respond directly to the whole group. By the way, I agree with your suggestion that we should promote this group more prominently than with just a link from our resources page. This group does a great service to the company by answering technical questions that would otherwise have to be handled by me or someone else here on out 800 number. All that aside, I have come to feel as though I know a number of the members and have great respect for their opinions and solutions. I will do my best to check in when I can. Thanks again. Craig Libuse Sherline Products ------- Date: Sun, 25 Aug 2002 10:41:24 -0400 From: "Dan Statman" Subject: Re: attaching self-centering 3-jaw chuck Subject: [sherline] attaching self-centering 3-jaw chuck > How do I fit the 3-jaw self-centering chuck onto the lathe spindle? > I fitted the drill chuck onto the spindle quite some time ago and > can't exactly remember how I did it. I think it was attached using a > drawbolt from the back? Is this correct? Anyway, I have unscrewed the > drawbolt from the back, but I can't seem to be able to remove the > threaded-something onto which I screwed the drill chuck, from the > spindle. Reattached the drawbolt and tapped gently with a rubber > mallet, then tried to pull the threaded something out, but no luck. > It appear to me that if I manage to pull the threaded something out, > there is a bigger "threaded something" behind this smaller "threaded > something" which I can't remove, to attache the self-centering 3-jaw > chuck? Is this correct? Thanks jen The drill chuck is a press-fit into the tapered inside opening of the spindle, it is not threaded to the spindle. Put the draw bolt back into the other side of the spindle and screw it in until it is snug. Then back it out 2-3 turns and whack it with a hammer. This will pop the drill chuck out of the tapered spindle, just unscrew the drawbolt all of the way after it breaks loose with the hammer and it should all come apart. The 3-jaw chuck screws onto the threads which are on the outside of the spindle. There are two small holes behind the threads on the spindle where the Tommy bars fit, and three holes on the front chuck face for the other Tommy bar. Use two Tommy bars to get leverage to screw the chuck down tight. You can also check out Sherline''s website for future instructions on all of their tools. Daniel J. Statman, Statman Designs www.statmandesigns.com ------- Date: Sun, 25 Aug 2002 07:53:59 -0700 From: "Mark Iennaco" Subject: Re: attaching self-centering 3-jaw chuck The "Threaded Somthing" that you screw the Jacobs (drill) chuck into is called a: #1 MORSE ARBOR ADAPTER (11880) There is a picture of it here: http://www.sherline.com/images/1188picm.jpg Normal method to remove Morse Taper mounted accessories is to use the drawbar to push them out. To do this you want the drawbar screwed into the Taper (i.e. put it back in) and loosen it one turn back from tight. You then tap on it "Gently" (I use a plastic faced hammer) until the Morse Taper pops free. Then you unscrew the drawbar and remove both parts. "Gently" is an inaccurate term. You want to be as gentle as possible, but if the drawbar has been overtightened, or the Morse Taper has been in a long time (yours has been in a very long time) it often needs to be hit very hard to break it free. It is exactly in this situatuation that you should NOT hit it directly with a regular hammer. If you don't have a soft face hammer, then put a piece of wood or plastic between the hammer and the end of the drawbar. ------- Date: Wed, 28 Aug 2002 12:27:01 -0000 From: "tatkinsonavon" Subject: Morse taper release Many of us make a steel rod an inch or so longer than the distance from the tang of the chuck inside the spindle to the dead end of the spindle. This by preference should have a brass business end and knurling at the hand end. Just the weight of this rod dropped in the mill spindle a few times, or shoved sharply into the lathe spindle, is enough to solve my problem with stuck chucks every time. It's the sharp application of a light force which does the trick. Tracy ------- Date: Sat, 31 Aug 2002 04:39:12 -0000 From: "builder4wd" Subject: Boring Holes on location... lathe with milling attachment Qs I'm trying to make 2 identical flat aluminum parts that will basically sit parallel and mesh together 2 gears. I need to bore 2 holes in each part to hold bearings. The location of the holes are critical because too close or too far will ruin the gear mesh. I am having trouble making these holes accurately. I don't have much experience. This is what I did: 1. Use dead center to locate scribed center of hole. 2. Center drill 3. Enlarge with 6mm drill bit 4. Bore hole to size 5. repeat for other hole Is there a more accurate/better way to do this? I'm using a 4410 model lathe with milling attachment. I'm finding it difficult to work with the size of the part. It is approximately 4" long, 2" high, 1/4" thick.It is actually 5mm thick, made out of 1/4" aluminum plate. I had to fly cut it to thickness, securing it with the sherline vise and parallel bars. The thickness turns out +/- 0.2 mm at the corners of the part. Is there some way to make it more uniform without adjusting the machine? It's frustrating, I'd appreciate any help. ------- Date: Sat, 31 Aug 2002 11:38:38 -0700 From: Alan Marconett KM6VV Subject: Re: Boring Holes on location... lathe with milling attachment Qs HI builder? Just one suggestion, use the handwheels to do you measuring (take out backlash, measure in same direction). Move to first location, DON'T center punch, just use the center drill, enlarge, and bore. Keep the axis locked for these operations. THEN unlock, proceed to 2nd hole, and repeat. The punch could be throwing you off. HTH Alan KM6VV ------- Date: Fri, 06 Sep 2002 01:23:19 -0000 From: "builder4wd" Subject: Re: Boring Holes on location... lathe with milling attachment Qs Can anyone help me with this? I think my biggest problem when using the milling attachment is the lathe saddle can't be locked in place. The saddle is pretty tight away from the headstock, near the handwheel, but it gets pretty loose near the headstock. The backlash allows the saddle to move back and forth when I'm boring, ruining my hole and adjustments. Is my lathe too worn? It's pretty new and I haven't used it that much, but it's relatively loose near the headstock. I'm also worried about the 0.2mm (.0078") backlash I get. I tried readjusting the saddle nut, but I couldn't reduce the backlash. I would really appreciate any comments or advice. Thanks. ------- Date: Fri, 06 Sep 2002 08:26:35 -0500 From: "Bad Brad" Subject: Re: Boring Holes on location... lathe with milling attachment Qs Your back-lash is fine. The answer for your saddle movement is to make a lock for the saddle and for the cross-slide. There are some mods that have been done to correct these problems unfortunately I don't have the URLs to give you. Try Sherline's tip page. Anyone else on the Sherline news list that has that info please chime in. If you think your lathe bed has a taper to it you may want to contact Sherline to see If could be re-ground. Be sure to use lubricant on the bed often, failure to do so can give you the same problem in a very short amount of time. Forrest ------- Date: Fri, 6 Sep 2002 12:23:38 -0400 From: "Dan Statman" Subject: Re: How deep a cut on the lathe with Aluminum? John, there are MANY opinions and charts and various other ways to get advice regarding these issues. What I have found is that given the size of the Sherline machine many of the published charts may not be correct for this application. Here is what I do: Start with 0.005" cuts at relatively slow speeds, and start increasing the spindle speed and see how the finish looks. When you are happy with this speed for the light cut, then start increasing the cut by 0.0025" at a time and decreasing the spindle speed slightly. Keep doing this until you are either uncomfortable going any deeper with the cut or the motor stalls. These are your two limits the high speed light cut and the low speed heavy cut. Pick something in the middle and you will get reasonable tool life and decent material removal. Personally, I cut only grade-5 titanium on my Sherline and I rarely exceed 0.0075" per cut. I use carbide insert tooling coated with titanium nitride and these bits last me for many cuts each. I use my lathe everyday for about 3 hours average and I change tool bits about once every 2 weeks. If I take heavier cuts then I change tool bits every 2-3 days. My advice to you is to experiment with your cutting on practice pieces. There is no better teacher than yourself as long as you understand how changing the parameters affects the outcome, and this is what you will learn from your trial and error. For the same cut depth and spindle speed you can vary the tool angle relative to the workpiece and see what is best for you. Daniel J. Statman, Statman Designs www.statmandesigns.com ------- Date: Fri, 6 Sep 2002 09:59:05 -0700 From: "Dave Hylands" Subject: RE: How deep a cut on the lathe with Aluminum? Hi John, further to Dan's advice, I thought I'd chip in what I typically use for Aluminum. With 6061 Aluminum, I typically take 0.010" cuts or 0.020" cuts for roughing, and smaller cuts for a nice finish. So far, I've just been using the pointed tool bit, and I think a rounded one will give a better finish (but I haven't gotten around to grinding a rounded tool bit yet). Also, if you're getting nice long stringy swarf, then you know you've got your speed/feed right. When you get the speed/feed right, then you can start to take bigger cuts. If your cutting bit is sharp, and you use cutting fluid, you can probably take bigger cuts, up to 0.050 (in Aluminum). But I would get comfortable with the smaller cuts first until you get a feel for things. I've stalled my motor a few times, and typically this means that you're trying to take off too much, or you're feeding too fast. Once, I had the work piece become dislodged. Saftey goggles are a MUST. You might also want to keep one hand near the power switch while you're experimenting, so you can turn the motor off in a hurry. Dave Hylands ------- Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2002 20:07:13 -0800 From: "Marcus & Eva" Subject: Re: Re: Eccentric in the Four Jaw Chuck Hi Bruce: It's a lot easier and faster to just clock it in, right in the lathe. Get it roughly centered, then shift two jaws just as you commented in your first post. The offset will be half the total clock deviation from high to low. This method will not get your eccentric aligned with any other features you may have on your shaft. If you need accurate radial alignment, you need to do the shaft in the mill. Best way is with a boring head and a bit set to cut outside diameters. The mill gives you the freedom to set up the radial alignment properly before you set the offset. If you've got goofy unmillable features that need to be turned, you can rough out a stub shaft on the mill, then transfer to the lathe and clock in your rough shaft. This works well for things like tapers, and snap ring grooves, and other features that are easy to turn but hard to mill. Hope this helps. Cheers Marcus ------- Date: Sat, 23 Nov 2002 23:53:04 -0800 From: "Marcus & Eva" Subject: Re: Re: Eccentric in the Four Jaw Chuck Hi Bruce: You need to have a boring head for the Sherline. You make a boring tool whose cutting edge points toward the central axis around which the boring head rotates, rather than outward as a conventional tool would be oriented. I have a milling machine that will run in reverse, so I can just spin a regular boring tool 180 degrees in its mounting bore, and then run the boring head in reverse, but on a stock Sherline you can't run in reverse, so you have to custom make a properly oriented tool. The main thing is that the cutting edge point inward so it can peel a shaving off the outside of a bar. Like I said, it's probably far easier to just clock the shaft eccentrically in the lathe using the 4 jaw. Another way is to set up a rotary table with the bar offset correctly on the turntable and then have at 'er with an endmill. Cheers Marcus ------- Date: Wed, 18 Dec 2002 23:50:09 -0800 From: "Scott A. Stephens" Subject: Threading I tried threading for the first time on the lathe and a funny thing happened. At some point the carbide tip chipped and well the part is now going to have to be remain :( Which is no biggie. My question is, is this a common problem when doing it by hand??? I usually either thread by tap and die, or on a lathe with power. I have never done it by hand before. Any insight would be great ------- Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 16:28:35 -0000 From: "geneking2001 " Subject: Re: Threading Scott, carbide usually breaks at the end of the thread because of the step left from stopping. I cut a relief with the cut off tool just a little deeper than the thread depth. this gives a groove for the tip of the carbide to cut into and not form the 'bump' at the end of the thread. gene ------- Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 17:09:25 -0500 From: "Ron Ginger" Subject: RE: Threading I suspect you made a very slight turn backward, so the cutting force was lifting the tool up instead of pushing down. This will almost always chip off the carbide. carbide has essentially no strength in tension, only in compression. NEVER let the tool run backwards even for the slightest distance. ron ginger ------- Date: Wed, 15 Jan 2003 23:39:37 -0000 From: "jimknighton1948 " Subject: Re: How can I make a 1" dia hole, 5" deep? [ON LATHE] Tom, while I haven't done a hole quite that deep, I've done some that come close. I've done holes up to about 3.25" diameter and 2" deep with a 3" boring head on my mill/drill, and 1.250" diameter and 4" deep on my 4400 lathe. Please note that my lathe has permanently installed riser blocks. The 1.25" x 4" hole was cut from a round blank of 7075 aluminum mounted to a faceplate. I also did a similarly sized hole in a blank drilled and tapped for 3/4" x 16 tpi threads that could be mounted directly on the lathe's spindle. Both approaches worked satisfactorily. The holes were accurately cut in both instances. I originally tried boring the deep holes to size with 3/8" tools that mount in the the standard Sherline toolposts, but they are way too flexible and whippy for holes that deep. I quickly discovered that I needed a much beefier boring bar or look for some other way to get the job done. My solution was to fabricate a custom toolholder and use a relatively heavy (by Sherline standards) 3/4" shank boring bar I had on hand. I have a set of 12 variously sized 3/4" shank boring bars for use with the afore mentioned boring head, the largest capable of boring to a depth of just over four inches, and this was satisfactory for the project at hand. The toolholder consists of a block of 6061 aluminum approx 5" x 3.5" x 2.75" (I don't have it in front of me for exact measurements) machined so that it bolts to the cross slide table with four t-nuts. It has an accurately bored 3/4" hole into which the boring bars fit. The boring bars are securely held in place with three 1/4" SHCS aligned axially with the centerline of the 3/4" hole. You might find it interesting that the 3/4" tool mounting hole was bored exactly on the centerline by first counting the blank on the cross slide table, drilling a 3/8" pilot hole using the spindle mounted jacobs chuck, and then enlarging the pilot hole using the Sherline boring head also mounted on the lathe's spindle. The blanks were prepared by drilling a pilot hole large enough to accomodate the boring bar through the center of the blank to the required depth. The blanks were then mounted on the spindle and the boring bar mounted in its holder on the cross slide. Once the setup was complete, boring was accomplished in the normal manner. For what it's worth, this setup looks grossly out of proportion to eyes accumstomed to "Sherline sized" projects. It works quite well, however. I had no problems with chatter, deflection, etc. and the surface finish on the finished bores was very, very good. On close examination of the finished bores I measured approx .001" taper over the 4" length of the bore. This was quite adequate for my project. I haven't been able to align my lathe's head any closer than this, so I concluded that there was negligable deflection resulting from the actual boring operation. I hope this helps. JBK ------- Date: Wed, 15 Jan 2003 17:05:32 -0800 From: "Scott A. Stephens" Subject: Re: Re: How can I make a 1" dia hole, 5" deep? I also wanted to drill a deep hole. Here is what I did and were I got the idea. It may or may not apply to what you want to do. I got the idea off Jose's Video on the Taig lathe. Make a bar with a hole in it to accept a cutter with a set screw on the side to hold the cutter. This bar should be long enough to run through centers. Drill the hole either on a bench press or lathe under side. Position just has to be close since you will open it up with the Bar and cutter. Once the hole is drilled attached the part to the lathe cross slide. Align as perfect as you want it to be. Run bar with cutter thru hole and fix to the head stock with a dog. Run the cross slide slowly forward or backward depending on how you set it up and slowly open the hole to desired dimension. Adjust tool till you have the hole as large as you need it. I spent a lot of time thinking about this. The part I needed the hole in was too large to mount on the chuck, and even if I did...the chuck could never safely support that much mass spinning. But by spinning the tool between centers.....Well I hope this helps. Thanks for the idea of the beefier boring bar holder. I will think about that a bit. ------- Date: Thu, 16 Jan 2003 06:16:24 -0000 From: "toysallround " Subject: Re: How can I make a 1" dia hole, 5" deep? Thank you for the info. I see applications for both methods. Scott, what size bar were you using to hold the cutter in order to get minimum deflection? Jim, I looked at Penn Tools and found a 3/4" shank boring tool which will bore up to 4-1/2 deep". Is this the type tool you are mounting in your holder? Tom ------- Date: Thu, 16 Jan 2003 08:22:28 -0000 From: "jimknighton1948 " Subject: Re: How can I make a 1" dia hole, 5" deep? Tom, I don't buy from Penn Tools, and I had a hard time navigating their site. I wasn't able to find the item you referenced. I bought my set from MSC (www.mscdirect.com). The set I purchased is listed on page 742 of their catalog (available online). From your description, however, it sounds like the Penn Tool item is a close match if not identical. It is a 3/4" diameter shank carbide tipped solid boring bar that cuts to 4.5" deep. For what it's worth, if I needed a "through" bore that large in diameter and as deep as you described instead of a "flat bottom pocket" I would probably use the technique Scott describes. I'm not entirely sure, but I think that technique is called "line boring." I've encountered descriptions of the technique so named in my casual reading but I'm not sure about the quality of the information. If the desired hole depth exceeds the capacity of the available boring bars you might want to consider a two piece design in which the bore is cut in one blank as Scott describes and then the flat bottom is actually a matching cap securely bolted in place afterwards - sort of like a cylinder head atop an engine block. Also, Joe Martin notes in his book that the preferred technique for a truely flat bottomed hole is to mount the workpiece on a rotary table and use a milling machine to cut the pocket with an end mill. I didn't feel comfortable trying that on my project and in any event I didn't have a suitable end mill. It would be some end mill that would cut a pocket that deep! I have the DRO option mounted on my lathe and set the "0" position to match the bottom of my hole. On each pass I advanced the boring bar to that point. That gave me a close approximation of a "flat bottomed hole". It really looks good, but its not as smooth, clean, and "perfect" as you can get with a good facing operation. In my project that wasn't a problem. Regards, JBK ------- Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 01:07:58 -0800 From: "Scott A. Stephens" Subject: 3 and four jaw chucks. Decided to check the head stock to see how much it is off. My question is putting a piece in the three jaw chuck. Yes I know I should use a collet but I do not have collets yet. Over 1 inch I measure a change of .001XX. My question is should I wait and get collets to make sure I am getting the head stock and not the error of the three jaw chuck? Also is measuring over the length of an inch and trying to twist the head the best way for me to do this? I've been at it for ruffly an hour and seem to have trouble getting finer the .001XX. Maybe I need a gentler hand. Thanks ------- Date: Fri, 24 Jan 2003 20:56:05 -0000 From: "Bryan Hassing " Subject: Profiling with the Sherline 4400 lathe? I own a Sherline 4400 lathe and build models of heavy trucks (Peterbilt, Kenworth, Mack, et al). I'd like to turn parts with curved profiles, such as air horns that have ends shaped like a bell. Does anyone here know of a source of information on using the Sherline lathe for this type of operation? Would disconnecting the cross-slide feed screw and following a cut-out profile with a stylus attached to the cross slide work? I don't have a CNC lathe and was about to resign myself to roughing parts in steps then finishing them off using files. But, I thought someone here might have actually tried this kind of turning. Thanks. Bryan ------- Date: Fri, 24 Jan 2003 13:02:10 -0800 From: "Dave Hylands" Subject: RE: Profiling with the Sherline 4400 lathe? Bryan, check out Daniel's excellent web site: http://www.nutsnbits.com/ in particular: http://www.nutsnbits.com/nutsnbits_00000e.htm Dave Hylands Vancouver, BC, Canada http://www.DaveHylands.com/ ------- Date: Fri, 24 Jan 2003 16:04:06 -0500 From: "j.guenther" Subject: RE: Profiling with the Sherline 4400 lathe? You can turn them by hand using a process known as graving. This uses tools similar to those used with a wood lathe to turn metal. Do a google search for "graving tools" or "jewelry tools" and I am sure you will find the tools and some information on how to use them. John Guenther 'Ye Olde Pen Maker' Sterling, Virginia ------- Date: Fri, 24 Jan 2003 13:12:56 -0800 From: "Keith Yundt" Subject: Re: Profiling with the Sherline 4400 lathe? W.R. Smith is the expert on building/using graving tools. Do a search using his name and you will see lots of results. I made some gravers myself using his advice and they work beautifully. You have to build a rest (Bill Smith's design is available from Sherline) or make something yourself similar to one for a wood lathe. I was amazed how well they work. You could also make form tools for something like airhorns. Keith Yundt ------- Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 10:23:51 -0500 From: Daniel Munoz Subject: Re: Profiling with the Sherline 4400 lathe? Hello Bryan, sorry I'm 1 week late in my messages readings (BTW thanks Dave for your kind words about my site) but maybe this could still interest you. To turn brass with curves, I also rough parts in steps, very not very closely. Instead of files to finish the work, I use a technique I developed, close to WR Smith gravers, but not quite. Check this page, all the curves in the pieces have been made that way: http://www.nutsnbits.com/dollhouse.htm Check the spittoon, you can see the staircases before "graving". and also the candlestick and the mortar. I use very rarely metal files, instead I use my own way of graving. The finish is very smooth. I didn't describe it in my webpage, because my English is a little "fuzzy" and I'm afraid someone hurt himself using wrongly my instructions. Here's in a few word how I do it; - I take a 1/8" HSS round rod, ground at 45° on a end. My HSS rods are 3" long, and I use them that way, no handle. - I sometime also use a 1/8" HSS square rod, also ground at 45°. No handle either. The flat side is perfect to scrap plain surfaces. - Then, without using a support of any kind, I hand free shape the brass but FROM THE BACKSIDE. That way, the tendency of the cut is not to drag my hand below the rotating piece, but just to move it up the work, where there's no danger to be stuck into something. The rotation must be slow, of the tool will chatter and will not cut. Other advantages is that the chips go below, not in my face, and the absence of handle give less leverage power if the little HSS rod escape from my hands. This work very well for brass, poorly on aluminium. NEVER try that or harder metals ! Also, your hands are very close so don't use it on metal that generate chips with a sharp cutting edge. Brass is really a joy to cut that way. Daniel http://www.nutsnbits.com ------- Date: Sat, 01 Feb 2003 14:46:14 -0500 From: Bradford Chaucer Subject: Re: chisels > Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 14:08:14 -0600 > From: "G." > Subject: RE: Re: question about chisels [FOR METAL TURNING] > I was planning on starting to turn some brass. Any other place > where I could find them? OK, you have some major misconceptions here. First some terminology so called "metal Chisels" are called cold chisels and are used occasionally for cutting metal in a shearing operation, i.e. chopping of a frozen bolt or nut. They are basically crude tools. Hot chisels (also Hardy chisels) are used by blacksmiths to cut red hot metal. In turning operations you have two basic methods; using fixed toolbits in a tool holder with the toll moved via the carriage or cross slide on a lathe, or off hand or free hand turning. Off hand, which I suspect is what you are referring to is somewhat similar to wood turning though only using tools something like wood turning scrapers (as opposed to gouges or skews which cut as opposed to scrape). On off hand metal turning the tool is usually called a graver, is very small, and is hand held and guided against a tool rest which looks line a small tool rest on a wood lathe. W.R. (Bill) Smith has prepared a lot of material on lathe work for clockmakers which is where off hand turning was most frequently used See: http://horology.magnet.fsu.edu/wrsmith.htm For some of his books and videos. The one on graver turning is a gem though not cheap. See also: http://www.bartcotools.com/P134.html Gravers and other tools http://shorinternational.com/GraverOther.htm gravers etc http://www.iw63.freeserve.co.uk/temp/graver.pdf an article on use and sharpening of gravers. http://www.sherline.com/gravers.htm an article by Bill Smith on gravers http://www.sherline.com/2110inst.htm an article on a hand turning tool rest for the Sherline http://home.att.net/~tom.roma/graver.htm#Making%20The%20Gravers another Smith graver article Do a GOOGLE search on "graver turning" you will find pages of references Regards, Bradford Chaucer ------- Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2003 11:02:37 -0800 From: "Brown, Mark A (SPO)" Subject: Turning welded materials I have a friend who has a shaft that is worn. He wants to build it back up with weld then I am going to turn it back down to size for him. He says the weld is 85,000 tensil strength. Will this be a problem to turn? Thanks, Mark ------- Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2003 11:31:47 -0800 From: "Orrin Iseminger" Subject: Re: Turning welded materials It might be a problem on a Sherline. Welds are generally rough, making for an interrupted cut. That's the first problem. The second problem is the hardness of the heat affected zone. Granted, mild steel has little carbon in it, but even so, if it has been welded, cut with a torch, or chop sawed, the heat affected zone is quite often harder than the bulk of the material. I'd rather take a beating than turn a welded piece on a full sized lathe. I wouldn't even think of doing it on my Sherline. Orrin ------- Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2003 14:35:15 -0500 From: "Kevin P. Martin" Subject: RE: Turning welded materials That's a bit, but not substantially, stronger than mild steel, so the hardness should not be a problem. However, the rated strength of weld metal is likely its minimum (annealed) strength. If it was a small weld on a large object, the weld metal may have been quenched by the sheer bulk of the base metal, so the weld metal might be quite a bit harder (ever try filing weld spatter?). You might cure this by annealing the weld area (for how long? cooling how slowly? good questions!). Another concern might be flux inclusions in the weld which, being glassy and hard, might dull your cutter quickly. Of course, if it is a good weld, there will not be any flux inclusions! One other problem... Unless the weld heat is applied *very* evenly about the circumference, the shaft will end up with a bend at the weld. This is probably ok if the weld buildup goes all the way to the end of the shaft and is corrected when you turn it. Kevin Martin ------- Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2003 17:33:53 EST From: jratcli256x~xxaol.com Subject: Re: Turning welded materials Mark, a trick I learned awhile back when cutting welded surfaces. Chamfer the cutting edge of your tool bit at about 45 degrees, so there is a flat (on a small tool bit) of about .032 wide. Use a substantial depth of cut and as heavy a feed as your equipment will handle. Rough the area down until you're below the rough area of the weld and then switch to your finishing tool bit to finish the job. When you think about it, you'd swear the bit wouldn't cut with that big a flat across the cutting edge, but you'll find, it will cut rough surfaces when a sharp bit won't even touch it. I've cut out welded valve seats from the steam chest of high temperature steam turbines using a similar tool bit. Good luck. John ------- Date: Tue, 04 Mar 2003 18:59:00 -0000 From: "oldisnew " Subject: Great fun! And some questions (new lathe user) Bought a Sherline lathe recently after reading about machining off and on for a year. Did my first-ever cutting last night, and I'm hooked! Now I just have to figure out how to organize everything to do this conveniently in my little apartment. And maybe reconsider framing that first, ugly little piece of T6 aluminum round rod I turned. I do have a few questions at this point that I hope someone can help me with. 1. The handwheels are harder to turn than I'd imagined. I haven't tried to adjust them, since everything seems to have come pre- adjusted from the factory, but I might have to clamp the shelf the lathe is mounted on to my work surface so it won't lift or move while I'm turning the handwheels. Is this the way it's supposed to be? Even turning them against no load? Backlash is about the .003 that the instructions say to expect. 2. It actually took me a little while to figure out how to get the cutting tool mounted properly (that is, which side was up). I think I was using it at an angle that was too close to perpendicular to the stock. The chips were coming off looking like very thin coiled springs made of tinsel. Anyway, while I was feeding the right-handed tool from right to left on a shallow cut (.010), at some point I heard the tool bite less and take a visibly shallower cut. Later, I noticed that the tip had actually curled up a bit, as if it had been dropped on a concrete floor and hit tip first. What caused that? And how do I take care of that problem without a grinder (or can I)? 3. At one point the tool began to squeak or squeal a little while I was feeding it. Was that a speed/feed issue, or is it normal? I haven't tried to deliberately cause chatter yet. Thanks for any help! John ------- Date: Tue, 04 Mar 2003 19:49:43 -0000 From: "lan_brooks " Subject: Re: Great fun! And some questions (new lathe user) Congratulations and have fun! > noticed that the tip had actually curled up a bit, as if it had been > dropped on a concrete floor and hit tip first. What caused that? I suspect the tip is just fine but that you have a bit of the material you are cutting has accumulated on it. I have this problem occasionally with aluminum. The material get "brazed" on due to heat and can be scraped off with a hard sharp tool such as a wood chisel. Brace the tip of the tool against an immovable object, like a hard block of wood then slide the removal tool along the surface where the build-up is and it should come off. next time you use the lathe tool, apply a drop of lubricant to the tip to prevent build-ups. I use tapping fluid for this purpose. You can search this archive for lubricants to find other suggestions. Otherwise it sound like you have a good start. Note that Aluminum will often produce the long stringy chips that you are making. Just do not try to remove them with the lathe running as they can be quite strong and sharp. BR, Lan ------- Date: Tue, 04 Mar 2003 22:05:52 -0000 From: "jimknighton1948" Subject: Re: Great fun! And some questions (new lathe user) Your description about the "hardness" of turning the handwheels sounds a bit odd to me. I know full well that "hard" is a relative term that actually conveys very little meaningful information, and what is "hard" for one person may seem to be "just right" to another. Regardless, the hand wheels on my lathe operate very smoothly and take very little effort to turn. The cross slide hand wheel is a bit "stiffer" than the one for the long axis, but in part that is personal preference. There is no "lifting" or "shifting" of the mounting base. There is a "just right" condition regarding the hand wheel movements that is very difficult to explain in words, but when experienced is patently obvious. The handwheel rotation should be smooth and easy to turn, but not "loose" or "sloppy." The "hardness" you are describing sounds suspiciously like the gibs are too tight. You might want to experiment a bit with these settings and try to find that "just right" setting for your lathe. For what it's worth, the gibs on my lathe needed adjustment right out of the box. I've also found that I need to adjust them periodically, and the "feel" of the handwheels is actually one of the first indications that this might be needed. It's not a big deal, however, and only takes a couple of minutes. Adjustment is very easy and explained very well in the manuals that came with your lathe. Don't be afraid to experiment with your new lathe. Just be gentle with it. It is very well made and it isn't likely that unless you drop it or use the BFH or "strong arm" approach to adjustments and/or "repair" you will do it any harm. Regards, JBK ------- Date: Wed, 05 Mar 2003 13:02:53 -0000 From: "oldisnew" Subject: Re: Great fun! And some questions (new lathe user)...Thanks! Thanks to those who've responded. I looked closely at the cutting tool last night and found that, indeed, some aluminum had become brazed to the tip, and an old wood chisel got it off very nicely. And I'll try adjusting the gibs tonight. Having read everything that I have, I did think that part of the reason why people who enjoy machining did so was the combination of mind and feel that's involved, and that smooth- turning handwheels would be both important to doing precision work and just plain nicer. I'm also happy that Sherline posted their TV ad on their web site, showing someone turning a handwheel pretty effortlessly, or my suspicion that something was wrong might not have been as strong. John ------- Date: Fri, 28 Mar 2003 15:47:53 +1100 From: "Mark & Deb Saccasan" Subject: Re: Old Sherline Lathe Model 1100 From: "mjsaccasan" > Attached to the tailstock is a jacobs chuck which I cannot > get it off. The chuck itself unscrews from the arbor only. > The arbor itself remains stuck in the tailstock spindle. Any > suggestions. Does the arbor slip off? I am missing something? Thanks for the replies. I have retracted it as far as it goes and will not come out. It seems to be jammed. I do not know if I should force it out. Any suggestions? Regards Mark ------- Date: Fri, 28 Mar 2003 04:36:58 -0800 (PST) From: rodger pease Subject: Re: Old Sherline Lathe Model 1100 Mark, if you can create a "jackscrew" bracket using the threaded part of the arbor as one part of the assembly and the body of the tailstock as the other, you might be able to break it loose. Be sure to spray WD40 (or something) around the arbor body to help "unstick" it. Pretty hard to explain in text, but you should be able to figure out something, depending on your mechanical aptitude. Maybe you could take a digital picture of the thing and put it in the photos section. Would give us a better understanding of what your dealing with. :-) Or (as a last resort) you could just put the drill chuck back on (after spraying the WD40 and letting it sit for a while to "work in") and "tap" it a little with a hammer. If that doesn't work, get a bigger hammer. That's what I do, but then...I break alot of things. :-) Regards Rodg ------- Date: Sat, 29 Mar 2003 19:21:22 +1100 From: "Mark & Deb Saccasan" Subject: Re: Old Sherline Lathe Model 1100 Hi all. Many thanks I finally managed to get it out. Sprayed plenty of WD40 and with some gentle persuasion by way of hammer and it finally popped out. Again thanks to all of you who gave me the suggestions. Regards Mark p.s. came out clean with no damage. Also, there was no rust around it which made me wonder why it was so difficult to dislodge. ------- Date: Sat, 29 Mar 2003 07:47:45 -0800 (PST) From: rodger pease Subject: Re: Old Sherline Lathe Model 1100 Whew...!... Mark, I'm certainly glad that worked OK without damage. I'd hate to think that the "hammer" suggestion I made caused any harm (it "was" obviously supposed to be a "last resort"). Not everyone has a "light touch" with a hammer (I sometimes don't) and while it is well made, the Sherline isn't the strongest unit in the world. Not that it can't take some licks, but it is a fairly precision piece and hammers and precision tools don't usually mix. Anyway, glad it worked. You might want to check the taper on the arbor against some of your other tailstock tools to see if there is any noticeable difference. Might also be a "burr" or small piece of material imbedded in the "receptacle" of the tailstock causing the problem? Regards, Rodger ------- Date: Mon, 31 Mar 2003 17:27:12 -0000 From: "Bryan Hassing" Subject: Chattering boring tool Hi: I have recently been machining model truck wheels from 6061-T6 aluminum. I am having some difficulty with chatter of the standard Sherline HSS boring tool held in the Sherline rocker tool post. I am machining flat-bottom bores between 0.396" and 0.449" depth and 0.828" diameter. I see chatter occurring at the junction of the final diameter and final bore depth (the shoulder if I'm using the term correctly). I have tried reducing the motor speed, but increasing the feed rate is difficult as I don't want to "overshoot" either the diameter or depth dimension. The tool appears sharp too. Since surface finish is important with these parts, I'd appreciate any advice on how to machine these parts without leaving chatter marks. ------- Date: Mon, 31 Mar 2003 14:29:26 -0500 From: "Statman Designs, LLC" Subject: Re: Chattering boring tool Here are my suggestions for doing this: 1. Make sure that the boring tool only contacts the sidewall of the bored channel and not the bottom of the flat well that you are creating. Either grind it back so it has a sharper point, or tilt the toolholder to get the angle right. 2. Bore you hole slightly under the depth required by maybe 0.005" 3. Finish boring the diameter of the hole and then do a facing cut of the remaining depth (0.005") across the bottom of the well. I would do this with the same boring tool, so make sure you grind the tip properly for this facing pass. Of course, there are several ways to do this, and this is just how I would do it. Daniel J. Statman, Statman Designs www.statmandesigns.com dan.statmanx~xxrennlist.com ------- Date: Mon, 31 Mar 2003 19:46:58 -0800 From: "Marcus & Eva" Subject: Re: Chattering boring tool Hi Bryan: the advice Dan Statman gave you is all excellent advice. Here's a few more things you can try if that doesn't do it. 1) use the stubbiest cutter you can get away with...your cutter shouldn't stick out of the holder more than 1/2 inch for this particular job. 2) dump the rocker toolpost and go with a plain one. Mine is reamed to accept a 3/8" dia solid carbide or HSS round boring bar...far more rigid than those flimsy 1/4" HSS toolbits. 3) grind lots of side and end relief on the tool tip...you want as narrow a cutting edge as you can get away with and still get the finish you need. 4) grind the tool point dead sharp and then stone a tiny (0.005") radius on the tip with a medium India stone. Don't make it too big. 5) glob some Plasticene around the job and around the boring bar to dampen the vibration...it's messy but works very well on thinwall parts. 6) keep the job damp with lubricant...I prefer a product by Relton called "A9" Some or all of these tricks should do it for you. Hope this helps. Cheers Marcus ------- Date: Mon, 31 Mar 2003 23:25:53 -0600 From: Ken Grunke Subject: Re: Chattering boring tool Does your boring bit have enough clearance at it's front edge to avoid rubbing against the bottom of the bore? If chatter happens only at the end of the bore, that would likely be the case. Or possibly the tip of the tool has too large of a radius. Also, I would use hand instead of power feed, and a carriage stop to set the depth of the bore. Better control for such a shallow depth--and when you get to the final diameter, just clean up the bottom with a facing cut using the boring tool. Ken ------- Date: Thu, 03 Apr 2003 05:13:44 -0000 From: "forbes_rl" Subject: Problem with steady rest slipping I'm hoping someone can give me some advice on how to solve a problem with the brass "fingers" on the steady rest slipping. I'm trying to use the cut-off tool to cut the end off about 12" of 3/4" 6061 T65 aluminum rod. I calibrate the steady rest near the chuck, then slide it down to the free end. I tighten the screws _very_ tight and oil the stock where it bears on the steady rest; at this point the stock is held quite firmly (i.e. no play). I also use plenty of cutting oil on the cut-off tool and am using a fairly low speed (in an attempt to eliminate chatter). When I bring the cut-off tool into the stock the stock starts vibrating and this knocks the brass arms of the steady rest back so that the stock is no longer held tightly and things go rapidly downhill from there. Any suggestions on how to solve this? Rob ------- Date: Thu, 03 Apr 2003 14:01:44 -0000 From: "lan_brooks" Subject: Re: Problem with steady rest slipping Rob, I had the same problem myself and the culprit turned out to be the three washers under the 3 cap screws that are used to hold the three brass arms in place. To fix this, machined a set of 3/16" thick washers from some 1/2" round stock I had on hand. In my case if you could see that the washers were becoming "cupped" from the tightening force. Additionally, you may need to add longer cap screws. If I recall correctly, that I had modified the casting by drilling the hold down screws the rest of the way though and carefully tapping the holes to get more screw engagement without stripping. At least give the washer idea a try. Oh yeah, take the steady rest apart and clean with solvent before setting it up. You want all of the friction you can get between the brass parts and the casting. Once set and prior to use, lube the points of contact between the stock and the "fingers". Good luck, Lan ------- Date: Thu, 3 Apr 2003 09:11:42 -0500 From: "Statman Designs, LLC" Subject: Re: Problem with steady rest slipping Rob: There can be several factors causing this. One thing to consider is the cutting tool you are using. Chuck a test piece of the same material but much shorter and do not use the steady-rest. Try to part off this test piece only about 0.1" from the jaws of the chuck. This will give you the most rigid set-up possible on your Sherline lathe. If you can easily part-off the material then your tool is not the culprit. If you really have to crank on the handwheel to part the material then your tool is not doing its job. Resharpen, reshape, or get a new parting blade. Once you get the tool cutting correctly then set-up with the steady-rest. And use the suggestions of Lan Brooks in his post. Daniel J. Statman, Statman Designs www.statmandesigns.com dan.statmanx~xxrennlist.com ------- Date: Sun, 06 Apr 2003 04:35:34 -0000 From: "forbes_rl" Subject: Re: Problem with steady rest slipping Dan and Lan: Thanks for your excellent suggestions. The washers on the steady rest were indeed dished; I replaced them with doubled washers and drilled and tapped on through the casting to support longer screws. That definitely helps. By trying the cut-off blade near the chuck I discovered that part of the problem is that the blade is grabbing even when I don't use the steady rest. I'm not sure if this is due to the chip getting jammed in the slot or because of the aluminum "hogging" the blade. Even with a relatively light feed things will go along fine for awhile then the blade will suddenly dig in enough to stall the motor. Rob ------- Date: Sun, 6 Apr 2003 01:44:43 EST From: catboat15x~xxaol.com Subject: Re: Re: Problem with steady rest slipping forbes_rlx~xxyahoo.com writes: > the problem is that the blade is grabbing even when I don't use the > steady rest. I'm not sure if this is due to the chip getting jammed > in the slot or because of the aluminum "hogging" the blade. If you can grind a hollow in the top of the tool that will tend to make the chip fold in on itself. Other wise cut off in a step fashon, that is cut deep enough so it doesn't grab, then cut right next to the first cut and go again as far as you dare, then back to the first groove again. Remember that the surface is decreasing as the cut deepens. If you promise not to tell anyone sometimes I use a hack saw for the final cut. John in the high desert of California 12 inch Atlas Mini Mill Rusty file ------- Date: Sun, 6 Apr 2003 09:22:03 -0700 From: "Marcus & Eva" Subject: Re: Re: Problem with steady rest slipping Hi John: I ALWAYS use a saw. I figure that the surface needs to be remachined 99% of the time anyway, so I don't bother much with parting off. So there's no shame at all in your confession. Cheers Marcus ------- Date: Mon, 07 Apr 2003 16:28:13 -0000 From: "lan_brooks" Subject: Re: Problem with steady rest slipping > By trying the cut-off blade near the chuck I discovered that part of > the problem is that the blade is grabbing even when I don't use the > steady rest. I'm not sure if this is due to the chip getting jammed > in the slot or because of the aluminum "hogging" the blade. Even with > a relatively light feed things will go along fine for awhile then the > blade will suddenly dig in enough to stall the motor. You are making progress. During cutoff operations, you want to feed pretty hard and I usually also use a higher spindle speed. Back out of the cut just a little but, say a quarter turn, to allow the curled up chip to clear the groove you are making. Also, I usually hold a bottle of lube in one hand so that I can continuously apply a bit of lube to the groove. The chips that are formed by the cutoff tool tend to remove all of the lube from the groove that is being cut. One additional bit of advice, when parting off using the steady rest, I often use a center in the tail stock for additional support until I am near the break-through point, if the part has a hole in it, or until I am down below say a 1/4 stock left if the stock is solid. Then I move the tailstock out of the way. This increases the rigidity of the setup when the cut-off tool is farther out from the centerline of the part at which point the leverage is greatest. You want to get the tailstock out of the way so that it does not damage anything when the part comes loose. Good luck, Lan ------- Date: Mon, 07 Apr 2003 23:02:47 -0000 From: "jeastwoodlm" Subject: Re: Problem with steady rest slipping "Parting is such sweet sorrow." Sorry, couldn't resist the dumb joke. You might search the archives for "parting" to get some good general advice on setup and techniques. Make sure you are right at center height, and keep the overhang of the tool as short as possible. Lathe speed is pretty critical; slower is better, and keep up the pressure on the feed. It sounds and seems counterintuitive to feed MORE when things are chattering, shrieking and whining, but it generally helps. I tend to feed fairly hard, then back off, feed again, back off again, over and over. Lots of lube helps too. Parting is something that takes some practice to develop a feel for, and for the various materials you use. Also, be careful when using the parting tool to make a groove. The Sherline standard parting tool is .040" wide I believe; you can use it to make a groove of say .1" width, but you have to be careful how you do it. Gradually widening the groove by moving the saddle after the first groove is made won't work well unless you move it by MORE than .040"; moving it less will cause the tool to flex and jump into the existing groove. Good luck ------- Date: Tue, 8 Apr 2003 08:08:33 -0500 From: "Nance, Tom" Subject: RE: Re: Problem with steady rest slipping I'm surprised that the most common cause (at least for me) of binding of the cutoff tool has not been mentioned. That is not having the tool exactly perpendicular to the work. On thin rods it doesn't make too much of a difference, but with anything over a half inch or so, the tool will bind if it isn't exactly perpendicular. The reason is that the top edges sides of the tool (down the length of the tool) will try to start cutting. They are not really made for this and they protest mightily. As an extreme example imagine cocking the tool to a 10 or 15 degree angle and shoving it into the work. You will hear sounds that mankind is not meant to hear. Tom ------- NOTE TO THIS FILE: Also see the "Parting Off" text file for more parting tips. ------- Date: Thu, 03 Apr 2003 19:06:39 -0000 From: "jeastwoodlm" Subject: Re: Just got a 4400 - need some help getting started In sherlinex~xxyahoogroups.com, "lansoprazole" wrote: > After several weeks of careful research and thinking and finally > saying the heck with it, I am now the owner of a Sherline 4400 lathe > with the "A" accessory package, a steady rest, and a thread cutting > attachment (for a future project). I also got a Delta bench grinder > (new $30!) and a few HSS tool blanks. [SNIP] > And so I need a dial indicator. I have seen a bunch on Ebay > for a wide range of prices, and would like to know if any particular > brand is good and cheap. [SNIP] > Any other suggestions or links to "getting started" type of sites? Sounds like a good start; I also bought a grinder as my first accessory after getting my 4400. It's ture you CAN spend a lot of money on accessories, but you don't have to. Here's some suggestions: 1) I found that the three jaw chuck suppiled by Sherline didn't grip all that well; I had to get into the habit of stopping and tightening it every few minutes. So, I'd recommend a 4 jaw chuck for two reasons: the Sherline 4 jaw grips better, and with a 4 jaw it's much easier to make shapes such as cubes and rectangles from stock. Being able to make a cube from a rough sawn piece of stock will help make up for the lack of a milling machine. 2) If you don't want to go for buying the Sherline 4 jaw, you can make a beefier 3 jaw by getting a "plain back" 3 jaw chuck (look for the Bison brand on sale from Enco, MSC, Travers, et. al.) and mounting it to the Sherline faceplate that came with your lathe (maybe they don't call it a faceplate, but it's that gizmo that threads into the spindle, and the other side is milled flat with 3 mounting holes around the perimeter.) I mounted a 3" Bison 3 jaw and it works fine. 3) A lathe tool I use a lot and can be easily made is a parting tool holder. Basically just a cube of aluminum with a notch in the side that fits the parting tool, and hole down the center for the T-nut and clamping screw. It would be easier to make the notch with a mill, but you can drill closeley spaced holes to remove most of the material, then file to shape. Get some good files, they aren't expensive. 4) If you make the parting tool holder, next you can make it do double duty as a boring tool holder. The Sherline boring tools are HSS blanks shaped for boring, and work OK, but are too short for many applications. Most boring tools have 3/8" diameter shanks and come in various lengths. Drill a hole through your cutoof tool holder opposite from the notch for the cutoff tool, and drill and tap a hole to allow a screw to clamp the boring tool. Drill the 3/8" parallel to the bed of the lathe, and so that the tool's tip will be close to the center height (i.e., be vertically level with the axis of the spindle.) 5) If it didn't come with the A package, get the drill chuck so you can use it mounted in the tailstock for drilling. Then you'll need drills; I've found having size 1-60 and the letter sizes are very useful, along with the usual fractional sizes. A small selection of taps will also be useful: 1/4-20, 10-32, 8-32, 4-40. Most of the Sherline accessories can be duplicated or even improved upon. I made my own knurling tool that will knurl diameters much larger than Sherline's tool. If you ever decide to get the riser block to raise the spindle, allowing larger work to be turned, you can make your own riser blocks for your tool posts pretty easily. If you don't have a dial indicator and magnetic base, definitely get one. I use this every time I chuck up a piece to get it to turn true in the chuck. You'll want a dial caliper too for measuring dimensions to .001" accuracy. Perhaps that's enough advice for now. Have fun (I sure have!) ------- Date: Sat, 26 Apr 2003 00:42:59 -0000 From: "Flavio Roberto Varani Junior" Subject: Cut speed on 4400 I am interested in buy a lathe of sherline model 4400, have curiosity to know which the speed of cut in aluminium and steel, therefore never before I worked in a mini-lathe. Ex.: how much time would be needed to transform a bar of steel of 1"x 5" into 1/2" x 5"? ------- Date: Sat, 26 Apr 2003 01:48:17 -0000 From: "Jim Knighton" Subject: Re: Cut speed on 4400 Flavio, I don't mean to be flip or disrespectful, but this is a difficult question to answer - there are a lot of variables involved such as the alloy of the steel, the kind and sharpness of your cutting tool, etc. Other significant variables are operator oriented. For instance, will you be using CNC, a power feed motor, or turning the wheels by hand? This isn't the kind of cut I typically make, and I suspect that most others wouldn't do this except in a pinch. If I needed a 1/2" diameter part that long I would try to start with stock closer in size to the finished diameter. Regardless, with my 4400 lathe I routinely machine 1018 steel (both cold and hot rolled), annealed O1 tool steel, stainless steel (unknown allow), 6061 aluminun, 7075 aluminum, and brass. I work with very small sizes and also pieces that stretch the capabilities of the lathe. For instance, last night I was machining a couple of 12" parts from 1/2" O1 drill rod. I had more trouble getting the specific setup right than I did actually cutting the metal. I've turned pieces as large as 5 1/2" diameter (I have risers on my lathe). All of these metals have their own machining characteristics, but none present any particular difficulty. I've also successfully turned most of these metals with hand-held cutting tools, a process that is largely ignored by hobbyists except in jewelery and watchmaking circles. Once you make the plunge I suspect you will discover that cutting the metal is actually not very difficult. Depending on the complexity and nature of your projects I suspect you you'll find it more challenging to figure out how to make the cut you want on the odd sized and peculiarly shaped piece of metal you start with. At least, this has been my experience to date. You didn't give any indication of your experience level, but cutting speeds and length of time to machine a part are really two different issues. I don't like to push my machines to the limit of their capacity. This is a hobby activity, and my time has no value to anyone except me. I don't mind the time it takes to go slow and I make fewer mistakes when I'm not pushing myself or the machines. I make enough mistakes as it is. I determine appropriate cutting speeds and feed rates by look, feel, and ear. On the lathe I generally limit my cuts to about .005" in 1018 and O1 steel (that's radius, not diameter) and perhaps twice that in aluminum. The machine will make more aggressive cuts than that, but the speed metal is removed really isn't the issue as far as I'm concerned. I want a smooth and finely finished surface, and I don't want chatter. At any speed or feed rate if I get chatter I have to make adjustments, and avoiding chatter is the key issue. It eats up cutting tools real fast and leaves an ugly finish. I don't think the vibration is good for the machine, either. Good luck with your machining adventures. I fully understand the need and quest for knowledge. You might take a look at the Sherline web site - most of the info in their brochures, instruction sheets, etc. is available on line. I recall several instances in which questions about capacities, etc. are addressed. They might be helpful to you, but when I was doing my initial research I was frustrated by the vagueness and imprecision of the answers. After using these machines for a while (I've had my lathe between two and three years) I better understand why the answers are framed as they are. Using the lathe as an example, machining isn't an exact science. Maybe it is with the big machines in a production environment, but with our small scale equipment quite a bit is done by "feel," i.e., feedback and judgement in real time while the machines are running. How firmly to you tighten a fixture? What sounds are the machine making? What happens when you take a particularly heavy cut? Do I want to try it again? What does the surface look like? And so on. In order to learn to use these machines you have to use them. Experience is paramount, and the lessons learned soon become second nature. You really can't learn this stuff any other way, and that involves making mistakes. Fortunately, the machines are quite robust and forgiving. If you break something, replacement parts are readily available. I've made far more mistakes than I care to admit to and have had to replace a couple of parts myself. Nothing catastrophic, and no real damage done except to my pride. Regards, Jim Knighton ------- Date: Sat, 26 Apr 2003 04:18:38 -0000 From: "smitty8002000" Subject: Sherline collet questions Need a little info on the Sherline collets. Right now I am using the WW collets, and damaged my 1/4 collet through stupidity!! Anyhow, I like the fact that the WW collet has a shoulder on the inner diameter to limit how far the material goes into the collet, question is, do the Milling collets have the same shoulder? Any info would be great, Thanks Smitty ------- Date: Sat, 26 Apr 2003 00:42:13 -0400 From: RichD Subject: Re: Sherline collet questions Smitty, All the milling collets are straight thru. MT-1 external. However, the drawbar thread is internal which limits tool depth. I have drilled my drawbar to allow long 1/8" tools to pass. RichD ------- NOTE TO FILE: There are more extensive collet discussions in the text file "Cutters Collets and Arbors". Also, the "Atlas Collets" file may provide some ideas. ------- Date: Thu, 12 Jun 2003 01:50:49 -0000 From: "yacub1953" Subject: Finding a small-tipped live center for a Sherline Lathe I'm new to this group. I've just gotten a Sherline long-bed lathe. For now, I plan on using it to turn really small objects - specifically, wooden beads that I make. To be able to tool all of the surface area of such a small piece of wood, I'd like to have some pretty small tips on my live- and dead-centers...no problem with the dead center; I've got a chuck on the headstock that'll hold a small one. But, I notice that the live center that Sherline offers is pretty big to provide tooling clearance on all sides of such a small piece of wood.Does anybody know of a live center that would fit the Sherline lathe that comes with an extended tip no wider than around 1/8" or so? Or, does anybody know about a 'chucking live center,' a live center/chuck combo, that would fit the Sherline? I know that such things exist, but haaven't beenable to run one down. Thanks for your time. Sincerely, Jamie Wahl ------- Date: Wed, 11 Jun 2003 19:21:13 -0700 From: "Marcus and Eva" Subject: Re: Finding a small-tipped live center for a Sherline Lathe Hi Jamie: My solution to exactly the same problem was to just turn down the diameter of the Live center until I was happy with it. I seem to recall that it wasn't hardened and could be turned easily with High Speed Steel. Make up a left hand tool, chuck up a bar in the 3 jaw chuck, poke in a small center drill and get your live center in the tailstock. Get the point of the live center into the center drilled hole under lots of tension and turn on the machine. The pressure of the center in the hole will provide enough friction to keep it rotating and allow you to turn it down if you take light cuts. Takes about 15 minutes to do. Cheers Marcus ------- Date: Thu, 12 Jun 2003 02:28:43 -0000 From: "n2562001" Subject: Re: Finding a small-tipped live center for a Sherline Lathe Jamie, the center on the Sherline live center can be removed by driving it out through a hole in the shank. From that point you can machine whatever point you wish and install in place of the original. Jerry Kieffer ------- Date: Wed, 16 Jul 2003 06:37:20 -0500 From: "Nance, Tom" Subject: RE: Power Feed Review >Anyone have the power feed, and care to report on how they like it? Hi Bill: It's okay. It sure beats turning long cuts by hand. I wouldn't give it up. It runs quietly, and is easy to set up and use. Having said that, it's only fair to mention a few downsides and improvements I'd like see made. It runs at only a single speed. Different materials and diameters cut best at different feed rates. It runs only in a single direction. I like to have a fast reverse. Or any kind of reverse for that matter. It must be removed if one sets up for threading. My motor becomes extremely hot after 15-20 minutes of use. (That may be just my particular motor and may not be the norm) I'd like to see some kind of method to turn off/disengage the feed when the cross-slide gets near the chuck. I'd like to see it come with a power cord that replaces the lathe power cord so both motors can run from the same supply. Outlets are at a premium in my shop. I spliced the power feed cord into the lathe power cord and permanently mounted a switch on the lathe mounting board. It works fine, but it looks klutzy. All in all, I'd rather have one than not have one, but I think there's definitely room for improvement. These are just my opinions and please take them as such. I am sure other folks, more knowledgeable than I can (and hopefully will) speak to this matter. Thanks, Tom Nance Corpus Christi, TX (Just dodged a bullet from Claudette) ------- Date: Wed, 16 Jul 2003 08:39:08 -0400 From: "Jason Richards" Subject: Re: Power Feed Review I bought one with my lathe as well, and must confess that I rarely use it. I often alternate between threading and cutting operations and it is just too much of a pain in the posterior to swap it around. (Pulling the motor off 3 times in an hour tests my patience as it is.) I think I remember someone talking about adapting the power feed to run off of the handwheel side, which would be nice, particularly if you could construct a linkage attached to the cross slide that would disconnect the drive junction before it hits the chuck as another mentioned. Jason ------- Date: Wed, 16 Jul 2003 08:52:36 -0400 From: "Marshall Pharoah" Subject: RE: Power Feed Review I was going to buy one, but bought a Frog instead. This does both power feed and threading. In fact, I have a brand new threading attachment from Sherline still in the box that I ordered before I saw the Frog. The price of the Frog has gone up to $199 since, but it's worth it. I don't recall the price of the threading attachment and power feed, but together they're probably in the same neighborhood. Marshall ------- Date: Wed, 16 Jul 2003 21:00:08 -0400 From: "Marshall Pharoah" Subject: RE: Power Feed Review Jim, a couple of years ago I was planning on buying the Sherline power feed. Then I saw the Frog at Cabin Fever and ordered one almost immediately when I got home. Before I did, I considered building a bracket to hold a stepper motor much like the Frog does, but using a pulley/belt drive connection. I figured I could get one of the cheap stepper drivers from Jameco or another hobby shop. These allow variable speed drive by turning a knob, and would also allow control of the direction. I figured the pricing of this to be about the same as Sherline's drive box. The second option was the Frog (then about $175). This gives variable feed, rapid reed, and threading, and even allows you to mark a start point and stop point for repetitious cuts. Third option was to go with full-blown CNC. I figured at the time at least $500 without the computer. I also figured a much longer learning curve. This will probably happen someday. I'm doing the mill now. But for now the Frog does everything I need, and I did consider connecting the Frog to that as well. Marshall ------- Date: Sat, 19 Jul 2003 21:53:35 EDT From: davidmrootx~xxaol.com Subject: Re: Frog Stepper Motor Cable Length Be sure to install a heat sink on the back of the Frog as instructed or the Frog will overheat and die. I built a bracket to mount the keypad near the location of the power feed and this has worked well. David ------- Date: Sun, 24 Aug 2003 03:06:39 -0000 From: "tauscnc" Subject: Quick Change Toolpost I got a quick change toolpost for the Sherline lathe and it's awesome!!! The part finish and fit is incredible. It's so nice to just "snap" in the cutting tool and keep going. It might be something you considered but never got. The mroe I use it the nicer it is. Its one of those "how did I live without it items :):) Check it out at my site: http://www.cuttingedgecnc.com/lathe.htm or at theirs http://www.home.earthlink.net/~rmteo/_wsn/page2.html Hope everyone is well tauseef www.cuttingedgecnc.com ------- Date: Sun, 24 Aug 2003 21:07:09 -0000 From: "yupak12" Subject: Removal of Tool from Tailstock I've been using a live center, in the lathe tailstock, for a long time. Now I want to remove it, and insert the Jacob's chuck. How, do I remove the live center? Its seems to be seated tightly. Bill ------- Date: Sun, 24 Aug 2003 17:19:20 -0400 From: "JERRY G" Subject: Re: Removal of Tool from Tailstock Bill, Just turn the tailstock in a counterclockwise direction. Towards the front of the lathe. You will encounter some resistance. Don't be afraid of turning hard. Inside the tailstock is a stop. As you draw the sleeve back, the end of the live center will touch the stop. a little pressure and it should eject. When you put your Jacobs chuck in, wipe the tapered shank to make sure it is clean. Then retract the jaws and give the front of the chuck a couple of light taps with a soft mallet to seat the taper. Regards, Jerry G ------- Date: Mon, 25 Aug 2003 17:15:46 -0400 From: "Statman Designs, LLC" Subject: Re: How do I align head- and tailstock if their heights don't match? From: "yacub1953" > I have noticed that the headstock and tailstock of my Sherline lathe > are not at the same height. When I put dead- and live-centers on the > lathe and bring their points together, there appears to be as much as > a couple millimeters of difference in height between them. I notice > this when I am end-drilling wooden bead blanks. I have the > cylindrical blanks held in a three-jaw chuck on the headstock, and my > drill bit held in a tailstock drill chuck. I notice that when I begin > drilling into the blank, which I have pre-drilled in its center, the > drill bit is NOT aligned with the center hole - it is lower. As I > move the drill bit to the left, it will finally 'bump up' and into > the pre-drilled hole and end up drilling a hole that runs, more or > less, through the middle of the blank. But I'd like a closer > tolerance than this. I notice that Sherline offers accessories that > it touts as solving this problem - #1207, the adjustable live center, > and #1202, the adjustable chuck arbor for the tailstock. Do any of > you have experience with these accessories? DO they do the job? Also, > I notice that #1202 features a threaded male end for attaching to (I > assume) the tailstock chuck. Which tailstock chuck is this supposed > to work with? As far as I can tell, none of them have threads, male > or female, but rather simple Morse tapers. What am I missing here? > Thanks a million for your time. Regards, Jamie The adjustable tailstock will fix your problem. That is why they made it available. On the Jacobs chucks the morse taper ends unscrew from the chuck body. This is where the male threads will fit on the adjustable arbor. Daniel J. Statman, Statman Designs www.statmandesigns.com dan.statmanx~xxrennlist.com ------- Date: Mon, 25 Aug 2003 19:06:18 -0400 From: Jim Ash Subject: Re: How do I align head- and tailstock if their heights don't match? There are four adjustable tailstock options, the live center, the chuck holder, the tool holder and the die holder. I have the first two, although I mostly use the live center. They work well, but they require a little setup to get the accuracy you want. The #1202 adjustable tailstock chuck holder is intended for use with some of the Jacobs drill chucks Sherline sells, the ones with the threaded hole, not the tapered hole. Those drill chucks come with a 3/8x24 to Morse #0 arbor which can be unscrewed from the chuck to expose the threads. The adjustable tailstock holder can then be screwed into it, rammed into the tailstock, and adjusted for centering. Mysterious physics aside, when using a tailstock chuck on a lathe, the drill will find center instead of wandering from it. You can use this on the Sherline when super accuracy isn't required, and just let the setup pull in the slop for you. I wouldn't recommend this for small drill bits, but it works ok for me with bits larger than maybe 1/16". Some of this might have to do with how far off 'natural' center your lathe is when you perform these operations. Jim Ash ------- Date: Mon, 25 Aug 2003 17:24:01 -0700 From: "David" Subject: Re: How do I align head- and tailstock if their heights don't match? Jamie: I'm going to disagree with the other posts (at least today's) on this question. I'm against the adjustable tailstock tools. But first, you need to determine what is out of alignment: (1) is the headstock by any chance tilted up (or down) around its center point (the locking screw buried in the middle of it)? Mine was, by quite a bit. Anything can cause it: a bit of swarf, a ding (which always raises material around its edges), a rough place on the key seat, a rough place on the key itself, etc. (2) is the tailstock tilted down? or up? (same potential causes as above) (3) is the headstock or the tailstock twisted away (or towards) the operator? (4) is the shaft of the tailstock, as it extends toward the headstock, excessively loose? (5) If you are using riser blocks, you multiply the possibilities for error by four. (6) If you are using the old-style tailstock (the one that tightens with a single screw, about halfway up, by squeezing an open area together under the screw to clasp the dovetails of the ways), by all means discard it and purchase the new-style tailstock with gibs. It is a far superior design. With any of these circumstances, you will not be able to turn a true cylinder, it will always be a taper. When I finally found an engineer I could ask some questions of, he drew me a rough diagram of what the geometric relations between the centerline of the headstock, the centerline of the tailstock, the parallels of the ways, the cross-slide screw, and the motion of the cross-slide should be but almost never are. Everything should be absolutely parallel, in all planes, except the motion of the cross-slide, which should be at exactly 90 degrees to the ways. In addition, the centerlines of the headstock and the tailstock must be not only parallel, but contiguous (the same line). If any of these conditions are not met, you will always, as I say, turn a taper, not a true cylinder. Now the question arises: to what tolerances-and every machine has tolerances-do I expect my machine to operate? Each of us will have to answer that question in regard to their own work. For my own work, if I can see (without magnifiers, guages, etc.) that something is out of alignment, the tolerance is too great. Your steps you need to take are simple to state, but rather difficult to implement. First you have to find out what is out of alignment and in what direction; then you take steps to correct the problem. As I said, "Duh!" In my own case, the headstock was twisted away from the operator rather badly, using the riser block with both keys inserted and locked down. With the help of a local machinist (who made me a guage bar) and some ingenuity of my own to design an adjustment device, I reduced the TIR at six inches from the headstock from .0045 to .00025. Both measurements were made the six-inch length of the guage bar while it was turning between centers. The .00025 is close enough for my work. If you do the trig, the .0045 error works out to quite a bit when, for example, you're boring a cylinder held on the cross-slide. You could expect equal discrepancies at the tailstock end when holding a drill in a chuck. If you are interested in how I went about doing all this, please contact me OTB and I'll do my best to help. After all this, you should be able to see that the adjustable tailstock tools do nothing to correct the problem, only to accommodate it: you'll still be turning tapers, because the workpiece is not parallel to the ways. I hope I've been of help. I know how frustrated I've been for all this time. I'm still trying to figure out how to accommodate error introduced by chucks and collets. In addition to all this, don't rule out contacting Sherline and explaining your problem. Ask for Craig and be as detailed as you can. He's good people (they all are), and he'll nearly always be of help. Sincerely, Dave Wood ------- Date: Sun, 05 Oct 2003 23:19:07 -0000 From: "tresark" Subject: Lathe Backlash I received my 4400 lathe this week, had the 5400 mill for a couple years. Looking through the doc's and checking the history here at the user group list. I can't determine if there is a backlash adjustment for the long axis of the lathe. Z axis? I have nearly one full rotation of the handwheel before backlash is taken up, is this normal? Something like 48 thousands of backlash. Thanks, Doug ------- Date: Sun, 5 Oct 2003 19:17:21 -0400 From: "Statman Designs, LLC" Subject: Re: Lathe Backlash Since the leadscrew has a pitch of 0.050" you cannot have 0.048" of backlash due to the leadscrew. Most likely you have your handwheel adjusted improperly. Loosen the set screw that holds the handwheel to the leadscrew. Then push on the cross slide table towards the right and hold it in that position as you slide the handwheel on the leadscrew all of the way to the left. It is easier to do this with an extra person, but it can be done by yourself. While holding everything tightly in position then tighten the setscrew on a previously unused portion of the leadscrew post. If you are close to the old spot it will walk into that divot and leave you where you started. Other than that there is no adjustment except to buy a new leadscrew and saddle nut. Daniel J. Statman, Statman Designs www.statmandesigns.com dan.statmanx~xxrennlist.com ------- Date: Mon, 06 Oct 2003 01:51:04 -0000 From: "tresark" Subject: Re: Lathe Backlash I agree that 48 thousands of backlash is a lot, mostly the reason I asked about it. And as for adjusting the handwheels, its a CNC machine. It has handwheels on it, and I as I turn them I can feel the motor cogging so I know it isn't the handwheel. Putting a DTI on the carriage shows .046 inch of movement, I need to find a mirror so I can look at the screw and carriage nut, I'm not unbolting from the table unless I have no other choice. Doug ------- Date: Sun, 5 Oct 2003 22:00:42 -0400 From: "Statman Designs, LLC" Subject: Re: Re: Lathe Backlash See if you can physically move the entire leadscrew from side to side, if so then it is the same adjustment that I described earlier. When you have a manual lathe, the handwheel prevents the leadscrew from moving side to side, when you have a CNC conversion then the motor coupling must prevent this, and obviously the handwheel will not have an effect since the motor shaft does not slide. There must be something loose somewhere, since it is physically impossible to have that much slop on a 20 TPI leadscrew. Is this an old machine with hundreds of hours of use? If both the leadscrew and the saddle nut are well worn (extremely well worn) then you could approach this level of thread related backlash, but I really do not think this is your problem. If you grab the cross-slid and move it back and forth through the backlash, does the entire leadscrew move with it? If so, then it is loose. If not, then it is worn out. Those are really the only two choices for this system. Daniel J. Statman, Statman Designs www.statmandesigns.com dan.statmanx~xxrennlist.com ------- Date: Mon, 06 Oct 2003 02:27:24 -0000 From: "tresark" Subject: Re: Lathe Backlash (found problem) Well I dug up a small dental mirror, and found the problem. Oh, just so you know, the lathe is new. Probably should have said that sooner, as worn wasn't a consideration. I followed the assembly instructions provided. Well I had bought the 5400 new as well, and when I adjusted the backlash for it, there wasn't an adjust for Z. In looking at the lathe I figured there wasn't one for it either. But the mill Z only has about 0.005 of backlash. Anyway, long story short, the saddle nut screw wasn't tighted up. The saddle wouldn't move till the saddle nut had moved far enough to bind the locking screw and begin moving the saddle. The documents don't mention any adjustment for this except for binding on the leadscrew which it wasn't doing. And the movement was consistent at .046, it wasn't increasing so it wasn't coming loose, it just wasn't tight. Well after adjusting and tighting it down, the backlash is a more respectable .003 inch. Another learning experience, I like this stuff :) Thanks for the help and suggestions. ------- Date: Mon, 6 Oct 2003 14:18:03 -0700 From: "David" Subject: Re: Sherline cutt off tool part number You can get precisely the same thing [cut-off tool] from Enco. Their part number 397-7503 is $11.80. Catalog page 284, or search for the part number at www.use-enco.com. They also have an imported one (397-7403 for $9.65); but I haven't used it and can't vouch for it. Dave Wood ------- Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2003 02:31:28 -0000 From: "forbes_rl" Subject: How can I minimize the play in the cross-slide? I would like to reduce the amount of play in my lathe's cross-slide so I can do more accurate boring. The boring bar itself is very stiff, but I notice that when I push on the end of the boring bar the cross-slide itself rotates a bit and causes about .008 deflection at the end of the boring bar. I've done the obvious thing and tightened the gib to the point where the slide becomes difficult to move. However, the play remains. I'm wondering if the gib itself is compressible, or perhaps does not perfectly match the ways due to its one-way taper. Does anyone know what the minimum amount of play one can expect is, and if there are any alternate gib arrangements that might offer more rigidity? Rob ------- Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2003 01:23:41 -0400 From: "Statman Designs, LLC" Subject: Re: How can I minimize the play in the cross-slide? Depending on the amount of use your machine has, it is most likely the leadscrew and the brass nut that it feeds into that have worn. The gib is not compressing and should be loosened to get smoother action without wobble of the cross-slide. You can unscrew the leadscrew all of the way and remove the table from the slide and look at the screw to see if it is worn. The brass nut has a set screw that holds it in place and then just pops out of a counter-bored recess. I think the cost of nut and screw is about $20 and it is simple to replace if worn. If it is not worn then your handwheel might not be tightened fully against the cross-slide and this can cause excessive backlash as well. You should be able to get less than 0.003" of backlash. Daniel J. Statman, Statman Designs www.statmandesigns.com dan.statmanx~xxrennlist.com ------- Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2003 08:22:28 -0000 From: "mileagemayvary" Subject: Re: How can I minimize the play in the cross-slide? There is a really neat idea of using a star nut as per the mill's antibacklash, shown near the bottom of Tauseef's site page at: http://www.cuttingedgecnc.com/lathe.htm ------- Date: Tue, 21 Oct 2003 16:24:52 EDT From: joeb759x~xxaol.com Subject: Work Holding On Lathe I need to turn down an alum. round 35" in OD Of course the sherline lathe chucks won't hold this diameter. this will be used as a flywheel on a small hot air engine. Any practical suggestions as to how I can hold the round to turn it down? I do have riser blocks for the lathe and mill. ------- Date: Tue, 21 Oct 2003 15:27:03 -0500 From: "Nance, Tom" Subject: RE: Work Holding On Lathe I will assume that you meant to say 3 point 5 inches, right? The flywheel will probably have a hole to accept an axle. Drill the hole first and then make a mandrell that the flywheel can sit snuggly on, and then away you go. Tom Nance ------- Date: Tue, 21 Oct 2003 13:31:26 -0700 From: "Brown, Mark A (SPO)" Subject: RE: Work Holding On Lathe 35"????? If you mean 3.5" one of the things I've done is turn it sideways on the rotary table using the mill. Mark A. Brown www.zora-arkus.com ------- Date: Tue, 21 Oct 2003 14:45:19 -0700 From: Alan Marconett KM6VV Subject: Re: Work Holding On Lathe Hi Joe: Assuming you mean 3.5", I'd use the faceplate, and drill and tap 3 holes in it. Then drill 3 holes in the blank to correspond with the tapped holes. These holes (or make 6) can be worked into your flywheel design. Screws can then be used to secure the blank to the faceplate for turning. Alternately, the blank can be drilled for its shaft, and then worked on a mandrel. The riser blocks will get you up above the ways. Alan KM6VV ------- Date: Mon, 17 Nov 2003 22:19:11 -0600 From: "Al Lenz" Subject: RE: Information on drill bits [MAKE CLOCK PIVOTS ON LATHE] > PS: I've been using the Sherline lathe to make my clock arbor blanks > and then switching back to the jeweler's lathe to do the pivots, > especially the polishing etc. sounds strange but it saves time. I > use the water tempered stock out the MSC catalogue, it polishes well. Rick, at the 2002 NAMES I mentioned to Jerry Kieffer that as an ex-watchmaker I did essentially what you described, that is use the Sherline for most everything but still fell back on the watchmakers lathe for finish turning of small pivots, etc which require a sense of touch for that last 'half hundredth of a m/m'. He promptly sat me down at his Sherline and had me cut a perfect pivot in about one minute flat. The secret is to leave the pivot diameter large, maybe same size as the arbor, then make a series of short cuts at the end just deep enough to get a mic on. When you get to the desired dia. then cut the entire pivot length in one full cut. Worked like a charm. Just thought I had to pass it along. Al Lenz P.S. And then I saw some of Jerry's projects, all made on a Sherline. There were tiny threaded fasteners that were so small that a broken clock pivot would have been plenty for the bar stock. I kid you not. Even though most of us will never attain Jerry's level of expertise, it does show what can be done with a Sherline in the right hands. al ------- Date: Tue, 18 Nov 2003 16:20:42 -0000 From: "danpines" Subject: use lathe as screw machine I was really fed up with not being able to find 10-32 bolts in Israel. Needless to say threaded rod is also not to be found in this size. Decided to use the lathe as a screw machine, using a die holder and a 10-32 adjustable die. First time around I held a blank rod in the headstock 3 jaw chuck and held the die holder by gloved hand. Switched on at low speed, used a lot of cutting fluid (as there is no easy way to make back turns occasionally) and it worked like a charm. I adjusted the die for a shallow cut just in case.. Second time around i tightened the die and did it differently. Held the die holder in the 3 jaw chuck, inserted and locked rod, locked other end of rod in the tailstock chuck and of course did not lock the tailstock. Switched on and stood back admiring the screw machine as it pulled the rod and tailstock towards the headstock while threading. The only setback is threading the threaded rod back out. used a small rechargeable drill which turns both ways to do it. All in all, I had my threaded rod in a few minutes. I do not know whether it will work as smoothly for larger stock say 3/8". See photo in photo section dan pines ------- Date: Tue, 18 Nov 2003 11:37:57 -0500 From: "JERRY G" Subject: Re: use lathe as screw machine Dan, If you can use metric nuts and bolts, go to 5 MM and stop working so hard........:) Regards, Jerry G P.S. 5 MM is .1968" "Close enough for Jazz" ------- Date: Tue, 18 Nov 2003 19:50:53 -0000 From: "danpines" Subject: Re: use lathe as screw machine jerry: i use metric (available here) for anything which does have to be attached to the sherline lathe. i needed long 10-32 fasteners for riser blocks i made for the lathe, to fit the t-nuts. dan ------- Date: Tue, 18 Nov 2003 14:57:47 -0500 From: "Statman Designs, LLC"